0:09 Welcome to a new lens with common good
0:11 capital where we talk with investors,
0:13 raas, fund managers and philanthropists
0:15 about their experiences within different
0:17 impact investing themes as well as
0:20 explore the power of stewardship in
0:21 capital. I'm your host Jeff Schaefer,
0:23 CEO of Comic Good Capital, and I'm here
0:25 today with And do you want me to call
0:26 you Zachary or Zack?
0:27 >> Zack is fine.
0:30 >> Okay. Zack and then Mannheim. Yes.
0:31 >> And normally I don't introduce people
0:33 this way, but Mannheimr, where is that from?
0:34 from?
0:36 >> Technically Mannheim, Germany, but
0:38 accumulation of a lot of Eastern
0:39 European places.
0:40 >> Okay. I I would have guessed that and
0:43 actually Schaefer is German and it means
0:45 shepherd. So that I guess we're uh we
0:47 have some commonality. But uh Zach is
0:50 the founder and chairman of Alquist and
0:52 3D which is a company that uses 3D
0:54 printing technology to create
0:55 exceptional design while lowering the
0:57 cost of housing and infrastructure in
0:58 economically distressed and underserved
1:01 communities. He is also co-founder of
1:04 Altis Community Studios, a social uh
1:06 enterprise that empowers local artists,
1:07 entrepreneurs, and activists to
1:09 transform their communities through
1:11 creative and collaborative projects. So,
1:13 I love hearing your background here. You
1:16 You must be a creative by nature.
1:17 >> Most likely. Yes.
1:18 >> Yeah, that's what that's what I would
1:20 figured. Well, thanks for joining us.
1:21 And what's fun about this, we actually
1:23 just did a webinar and you were on
1:26 there. Did a great job. And so, now
1:27 it'll be fascinating to hear a little
1:30 bit more of your story. So, start off
1:32 and just tell us uh where where you grew
1:34 up, kind of where you went to school,
1:36 and then just a brief summary of your
1:38 career, and then we'll we'll dive in
1:38 from there.
1:40 >> Sure. So I I grew up in southeastern
1:42 Pennsylvania, just outside Philadelphia,
1:43 home of the world champion Philadelphia
1:46 Eagles. And I went to college at
1:49 Muenberg in Allentown, Pennsylvania. I
1:50 was a theater and philosophy major.
1:53 Prepared me for zero careers in my life.
1:55 And after I graduated, I moved to London
1:57 for a bit and did theater over there
1:59 until my visa expired. I came back to
2:01 America and did what every other kid
2:03 that went to theater school did does. We
2:04 went to New York and tried to make it on
2:06 Broadway. Although my goal was off off
2:09 Broadway of doing pretty experimental
2:10 theater. I ran theater companies there
2:12 for about 10 years and then worked in
2:14 restaurants cuz theater barely paid you
2:16 anything. In New York, I realized very
2:18 quickly that the last thing New York
2:20 needed was another theater or the
2:22 theater company. I wanted to be in a
2:23 place where we would have more of an
2:25 impact with the work that we were doing.
2:26 So I didn't know where I wanted to go.
2:28 And then you paired that with rising
2:30 cost of living and everything else. New
2:33 York even back then was becoming very
2:35 challenging. So, I left Brooklyn. I did
2:37 a road trip to 22 cities around the
2:39 country and I chose De Moines, Iowa to
2:42 move to. Very, very different than my
2:45 surroundings in in Brooklyn. But, uh, De
2:47 Moines hit all my my demographic boxes
2:48 for what I wanted to do. And that's
2:50 where I started a nonprofit that was
2:53 based in cultural and educational
2:55 offerings in downtown De Moines. We
2:58 opened up a space that catered to every
3:00 walk of life. We had every type of
3:02 artistic median uh medium uh
3:04 represented. We had sound recording
3:06 studios, live music venues, a full
3:08 blackbox theater, restaurant, culinary
3:11 academy, circus academy, dance academy,
3:13 comic book store, you name it, it was in
3:15 there. And this really helped change the
3:17 cultural landscape of downtown De Mo. We
3:20 did this in an old 1937 art deco
3:21 firehouse that we purchased from the
3:24 city. What I didn't know at the time was
3:26 we were doing something called economic
3:28 development. I'd never heard that term.
3:30 It never came up in any of my theater or
3:32 philosophy classes. Um, suddenly I
3:34 started getting calls from other
3:36 communities, mostly rural, around the
3:37 Midwest, saying, "Hey, we have empty
3:39 buildings on our main street. Could you
3:40 come here and help us do something
3:42 similar?" And so I started a business
3:45 that helped these communities grow. And
3:47 at first it was helping them grow with
3:49 cultural concepts of creating business
3:52 models for new theaters, cultural
3:54 centers, restaurants, breweries, coffee
3:56 shops, all the stuff to help attract and
3:57 retain that next generation of
4:00 workforce. And that grew into these
4:01 communities saying, "Hey, this is great,
4:03 but we have child care issues. Our
4:05 hospital closed. Our schools are
4:06 underfunded. Our streets are falling
4:09 apart." And so we began to work with
4:11 engineering groups and turn this into a
4:13 master planning group that would help
4:14 these communities grow. And these are
4:17 really rural towns. Average size
4:19 population for us was like 5,000. And it
4:21 grew out of the Midwest. And soon we
4:22 were doing this in 25 different states
4:24 around the country, mostly in the
4:26 Midwest and the Mississippi Delta.
4:27 Meanwhile, the number one issue
4:30 everywhere we went was housing. And they
4:31 kept saying things like, "Hey, this is
4:33 great. This new theater concept that you
4:34 want to do, but if we don't have
4:36 anywhere to live, why does that even
4:37 matter?" Which is a fair point. So, we
4:39 began to look at ways to drop the
4:42 housing cost. And in 2016, during my
4:44 research, I went to a seminar from a
4:46 futurist and he talked about all sorts
4:48 of things and one of those things was 3D
4:51 concrete printed homes. This is 2016.
4:52 And somebody in the audience raised
4:54 their hand and asked the question, hey,
4:55 how long until you think that this type
4:57 of construction method becomes prevalent
4:59 in America and he said, well, given the
5:01 cost and availability of land, uh,
5:04 zoning issues, regulations, unions,
5:07 etc., I'm going to bet 10 to 15 years.
5:09 And he was a good futurist because I
5:11 think he was right on. Afterwards, I
5:12 went over to him. I bought his book so
5:14 he would talk to me. And I said, "Hey,
5:15 your point about doing this in urban
5:18 areas and taking 10 to 15 years, I think
5:20 you're right. but I work primarily in
5:22 smaller communities. Don't you think
5:24 that this could take root there sooner
5:27 because we can move faster in these
5:28 places? And he said, "Well, you know, I
5:29 never really considered that. You might
5:31 be right." And that set me off on four
5:34 years of R&D. I traveled around the
5:35 world, met with all the major
5:37 manufacturers of 3D equipment at the
5:38 time, of which there weren't many. We
5:40 ended up getting a grant in the state of
5:43 Virginia to uh 3D print our first homes
5:45 there and I started the company in late
5:48 2020 specifically to address the housing crisis.
5:48 crisis.
5:50 >> So I got to stop you there for a second.
5:52 What's fascinating to me is obviously
5:54 you and I have met before but I didn't
5:57 know all that background. So my question
6:00 was or comment is you must be creative.
6:01 Yes, you answered that question very
6:03 quickly. But what's intriguing to me as
6:04 somebody who's been in the financial
6:07 world for the last 28 years to see to
6:10 hear your story to hear your training
6:14 and to see how your creativity and
6:17 innovation is being used to make a
6:19 difference in the world is it's
6:22 inspiring. On the other hand, it kind of
6:24 breaks some of the stereotypes in the
6:26 sense that I've sat in financial world
6:28 where it's all about money and it's all
6:30 about getting your greatest return. And
6:33 so to see you build what you are
6:35 building to solve a problem and
6:36 obviously I'm assuming you need to make
6:38 money in the process but it doesn't
6:40 sound like making money was your number
6:41 one goal. Not not that there's anything
6:42 wrong with that.
6:42 >> There isn't.
6:44 >> Yeah. But it's just fascinating how you
6:47 come to this and so here you are I'm
6:49 assuming in the space just based on what
6:50 I've heard and read about you. You're
6:52 probably one of the experts in the space
6:54 and you were doing what you were doing
6:56 the previous 10 years or whatever it is
6:58 and building wasn't in your training.
7:00 But look at you today. The method of of
7:04 how you implement your concept is
7:06 irrelevant as long as you can find the
7:08 most efficient way to do it. If you had
7:10 asked me 20 years ago if I would be 3D
7:12 concrete printing homes anywhere, I
7:14 would have said, "What is a 3D concrete
7:16 printed home?" But I would said, "You're
7:17 crazy. There's no way that I would be
7:20 doing anything like that." And so for
7:22 me, this is a very linear path. To
7:25 anyone else, I it probably seems crazy.
7:28 That's the pathway you go. My goal is
7:30 and always will be to help create
7:31 community. I try to do that everywhere I
7:34 go. And at the moment, I'm kind of at
7:36 the base level in my mind that you can't
7:38 really have community unless you have
7:38 places to live.
7:42 >> I mean, we uh at Common Good and myself,
7:44 we've done a lot in affordable housing
7:46 here in the US. I've also made some
7:48 investments in Africa, housing over
7:52 there. And sadly, the last 3 to 5 years,
7:55 the general public is waking up to this
7:56 idea that there's an affordability
7:59 crisis. But I think it took a crisis to
8:00 get everybody to see it.
8:02 >> That's the only good thing about CO. It
8:03 woke everybody up to how bad the
8:06 situation is. And primarily how bad it
8:07 is everywhere. For years, it was
8:09 terrible in big cities and we've always
8:11 known that, but now it literally every
8:13 single community has this problem.
8:15 There's a shortage of homes everywhere.
8:17 They all cost too much. I mean, it
8:18 couldn't have been better illustrated to
8:22 me than this must have been 2017
8:24 somewhere around there. I was touring a
8:27 a small town in Iowa and came across a
8:30 home that had 14 people living in it.
8:33 English was not their first language and
8:35 it had a tarp as a roof and they were
8:38 paying $1,400 a month. And I just said,
8:41 I don't even know how this is allowed.
8:44 So to me, owning a home, the way this
8:46 country has been set up, and this I
8:48 think goes to your question of capital,
8:49 this is the American dream. Home
8:50 ownership is the American dream. That's
8:52 how it was set up. That's what our
8:55 entire financial system is based upon.
8:57 It is what, right or wrong, this is what
8:59 we've got. And frankly, that American
9:01 dream has not been real for the majority
9:03 of American families for decades. And so
9:05 if we're going to solve our larger
9:08 political problems, to me, this is the
9:11 route. If you want people to succeed and
9:13 thrive with whatever they're doing,
9:14 wherever they live, whatever their
9:16 family's like, they need to have that
9:18 bedrock of financial security, and that
9:19 starts with owning a home.
9:21 >> All right. Well, so then let's jump into
9:24 that my my typical capital question and
9:25 see. And if you've already answered,
9:27 that's fine. But so when did you realize
9:29 the power of capital? And then what does
9:32 that mean to you? And if it's first of
9:33 all, is it different than what you just
9:34 said? I guess what I'd say
9:36 >> when I realized the power of capital
9:38 probably when I didn't have any. But uh
9:40 I could tell you my real first
9:43 realization of this was I owned a
9:46 restaurant many years ago and we under
9:48 capitalized to start the business
9:50 because we wanted to borrow as little as
9:52 possible. um and it killed us and that
9:55 became a problem very quickly right away
9:56 and that's when I first realized oh okay
9:59 so borrowing more was not necessarily a
10:00 bad thing because it would help us ramp
10:03 up and so but I still didn't have a real
10:05 understanding of that until I got deep
10:07 into the work I'm doing today in terms
10:10 of what you need for home ownership not
10:12 only are home prices unaffordable but
10:13 coming up with a down payment is
10:15 unaffordable like the only reason why I
10:18 was able to buy my first house was
10:20 because uh the Obama administration gave
10:23 gave us $8,000. That must have been 2009
10:24 somewhere around there. That's There was
10:26 no way my family and I with what we were
10:28 currently making could have afforded to
10:31 buy just a very very modest I think it
10:34 was a $160,000 home back then, which was
10:37 a ton of money. Capital when we live in
10:39 a capitalistic society. Whether that's
10:42 good or bad depends on your perspective,
10:44 but it is true. The power of capital is
10:48 necessary for any human in this system
10:50 to thrive. Okay, let me go back and this
10:52 is a a weird question. Not a weird
10:54 question, it's worded weirdly, but so
10:56 let's see if you can digest this one.
10:58 How would you describe
11:01 who you are in the context of where
11:04 you're at in your life journey?
11:06 >> Who I am in the context of where I am?
11:07 >> Yeah. If you were to look at your
11:08 totality of what you think your life
11:11 will be, where are you at now? And what
11:12 are you doing in the context of this totality?
11:13 totality?
11:16 >> You know, I I incomplete. What
11:19 percentage? I'm not sure but you know I
11:22 sometimes consciously and sometimes not
11:24 find myself in situations where I know
11:26 very little where I am not an expert in
11:29 any sense of this and I I go into things
11:31 in order to solve problems and also
11:32 because they interest me highly
11:34 construction I knew nothing about going
11:37 into this technology I knew nothing
11:38 about certainly didn't know anything
11:41 about robots or the the housing market
11:43 or I knew none of this all I knew was
11:45 that there was a problem and and
11:47 something that I found useful during
11:51 this path is often it's the people that
11:55 come in objectively or blindly into a
11:59 system can achieve more quicker because
12:01 they don't know what they don't know.
12:03 And so there are many things that I
12:05 probably wouldn't have done for this
12:06 company or in this industry when we
12:09 first started if I knew now if I knew
12:11 then what I know now because I would
12:12 have said either that that's a mistake
12:14 it's not going to work or I would have
12:15 said well that's not how things are
12:17 normally done so we should probably I
12:20 think that's that thinking is abhorrent.
12:23 I think you should go into this with the
12:26 intent to change the way a system is set
12:30 up not maliciously but in order to
12:32 improve it. So then take 3D printing in
12:34 the context of building home. Describe
12:37 to us how it fundamentally is changing
12:41 or will change the historic conventional
12:43 h house building construction.
12:44 >> Most people would answer this question
12:46 by saying the way it's going to change
12:47 it is because we're going to have lower
12:49 costs and stronger and more sustainable
12:51 homes and all of that is true and that's
12:53 going to happen over time. The way I'll
12:54 answer the question is the number one
12:55 way this is going to change the
12:58 landscape is the amount of jobs this
13:01 technology is going to create in markets
13:03 where they don't currently exist. This
13:05 is construction is one of the largest
13:08 industries in the world and so it it's
13:12 necessary everywhere. But you have you
13:15 take that and the rate of young people
13:17 that want to go into the trades. You've
13:18 got the need for homes going this way
13:21 and the rate for people going into it
13:23 going this way. And that's been true for
13:26 probably 40 years, maybe more. And it's
13:29 because the trades are often not safe.
13:30 They may not pay as well as you want
13:32 them to until you get to an experienced
13:34 point. There's tons of regulation. It's
13:37 frowned upon sometimes by people who
13:39 don't think that that's a either a real
13:41 job or a good job or whatever that not a
13:43 job that requires a four-year college
13:46 degree. So you take add all this up and
13:47 the amount of people wanting to go into
13:48 the trades have gone down. It's not
13:50 sexy. It's not cool. It's not something
13:52 people want to do. However, most people
13:54 do want to build. They do want to work
13:56 with their hands. They do want to create
13:58 something whether that's physically or
14:01 mentally. This technology allows you to
14:03 do all those things in a safer way.
14:06 Typically in a higher paid position and
14:08 normally without having to go anywhere
14:10 close to a four-year degree and go
14:12 severely into debt. This is going to
14:13 interest a lot of people. It already is
14:15 interesting a lot of people, but there
14:17 aren't enough options out there for
14:18 training, nor are there enough companies
14:21 to hire the people to be trained. So,
14:24 we're creating all of this at once. This
14:26 entire industry, we're creating the
14:29 demand. We're creating the talent pool.
14:32 We're creating how to physically do it.
14:33 We're creating the software. We're
14:35 creating the robotics. We're building
14:37 this entire thing from scratch. It's
14:41 different than when say radio went to
14:43 television. The communications industry
14:45 already existed. And you could say that
14:47 the construction industry already
14:49 exists, which is true. But the industry
14:53 for 3D concrete printing, it is being
14:56 created right now completely from
14:57 scratch. And that means we're going to
14:59 have a ton of successes. We're going to
15:00 have a ton of failures. We're going to
15:02 have a ton of challenges. We're going to
15:04 have a ton of interesting opportunities
15:05 and things that we never would have
15:07 thought. So here's a good example. Five
15:09 years ago when I started this company,
15:10 would I have ever thought that I would
15:13 be printing for Walmart? No. Not because
15:15 that was crazy. Just because that was
15:18 not the goal. And in my mind, a company
15:21 the size of Walmart is not going to
15:23 adopt this type of brand new technology
15:26 early on in the industry. And I was
15:27 completely wrong. Not only have they
15:29 adopted it, but they're going to grow
15:31 this. But it's not just Walmart. It's
15:33 other large companies that want to get
15:35 into this work. Everybody understands
15:38 that this is going to solve a problem.
15:39 Some of those problems are being solved
15:41 today with this technology. The rest
15:43 we're still learning as we go.
15:45 >> So if you can divulge this
15:47 hypothetically Walmart or somebody else,
15:49 what would be their main drivers from
15:50 saying, "Yeah, let's do it this way
15:52 versus traditional."
15:53 >> The easiest answer is uh save money.
15:55 >> And has that been proven out?
15:57 >> It has now. So the first one we did last
15:59 year in Tennessee was that did not get
16:01 proven out. That first project was not a
16:03 a money saver for them. However, we
16:06 demonstrated enough promise for them to
16:08 say, "Okay, let's do one more of these
16:11 and let's see what happens." Because the
16:13 first one, we had every single thing
16:15 against us. It was in August in
16:17 Tennessee. It was 110 degrees on the
16:20 pad. So, we had to literally go
16:22 nocturnal. We printed from 9:00 p.m. to
16:23 6 a.m. That was problem number one.
16:26 Problem number two, it was a size four
16:28 seismic zone. We and most other
16:30 companies had never printed it. Problem
16:33 number three, this was 8,000 square feet
16:36 and 22 feet tall. Nothing has ever been
16:38 commercially printed by us or any other
16:41 company on the planet like that. Problem
16:45 number four, the design was conservative
16:47 and not efficient for 3D printing
16:49 because we had nothing to do with
16:50 design. It was already done and they
16:52 handed it to us and they said, "Print
16:54 this." So, and then of course problem
16:56 number five, we had new people we were
16:58 training. problem number six never for
17:00 this company. You can keep going but
17:02 those were the main issue given all of
17:05 those odds and I will say in the first
17:07 week of printing it was setting itself
17:09 up to be a failure very very challenging
17:12 but we finally had that breakthrough and
17:13 from then on it was fairly smooth
17:15 sailing. Now when we finished that work
17:18 that took us 48 print days to do and we
17:21 had eight humans on the job site and two
17:24 robots. Now the next one they said, "How
17:26 do we get more efficient?" And and we
17:27 said, "Number one, we need to design it
17:30 with you." So we went to Bentonville. We
17:31 sat side by side with their architects
17:33 and their engineers and we designed the
17:35 next one together. That was the biggest
17:38 best thing we could do. Secondly, we got
17:39 the material company involved and they
17:41 began talking to us about the best
17:43 possible way to do this. We reconfigured
17:47 our robots to better be able to print a
17:49 structure like this. We trained our
17:51 teams. We rehearsed. We did so many
17:53 other things that we had not done for
17:55 the first one. And so on the second one,
17:57 we were able to finish the second in
18:01 seven print days, 75 print hours with
18:03 five humans and two robots. And we set a
18:06 record and we showed Walmart that there
18:09 was real savings upfront, not just the
18:10 savings that you're going to get on the
18:12 ancillary, on the energy usage and
18:15 things like that, but real true savings.
18:18 And that's when they said, "Whoa, okay,
18:20 we get it. We want to do so many more."
18:22 Congratulations to you and your team for
18:25 winning that getting it done. You'll be
18:26 a better company for going through all
18:29 those through all those challenges. So
18:31 another question I'd love to ask and
18:33 again you may have already answered is
18:35 and this can be you can think of this in
18:38 a big way or small way but h how would
18:39 you say you're trying to change the world?
18:40 world?
18:42 >> So I'll answer the the small way first
18:45 by trying to teach my kids that anything
18:47 is possible and would I work with them
18:49 every day on that. I I would say
18:51 building community is what I'm always
18:52 trying to do. Whether that's literally
18:54 building it by building a structure or
18:57 building community by getting two people
18:58 that would never otherwise associate
19:00 with each other to communicate in a
19:03 friendly way in the same place. And
19:06 that's always been my goal. I I left I
19:08 left Brooklyn a long time ago because
19:10 everybody around me agreed with my point
19:13 of view at the time. And I felt that it
19:15 was obviously a place like New York is
19:17 very diverse culturally, but it's not
19:20 very diverse ideologically. And I wanted
19:24 to understand why people thought the way
19:26 they thought who thought differently
19:28 than I did because I didn't understand
19:30 it because of the way where I had grown
19:33 up was very one-sided. We all think this
19:36 way. And I naturally agreed with that
19:37 and still agree with a lot of those
19:40 thoughts. But I needed to meet other
19:41 people and understand why they would
19:43 think this way because I couldn't
19:45 possibly fathom. Now almost 18 years
19:47 later and being around so many different
19:49 types of people with different types of
19:50 points of view and coming from different
19:53 places, I have a much more seasoned look
19:55 on how the world works. My own thoughts
19:57 have changed, which is natural, of
20:00 course. But if I'm trying to change the
20:02 world, it has to do with who am I
20:05 talking to right now, right in this se
20:07 in this scenario? How do we differ? And
20:10 how can we find common ground? And then
20:11 how do you transfer that to other people?
20:11 people?
20:14 >> And and do you know why you had the
20:16 intrigue or the interest, the curiosity
20:19 to learn about other people? Because I
20:20 mean there's many people who grow up
20:22 probably in your environment and they
20:24 don't walk away with that the way you're
20:26 walking away with it. Was there
20:27 something that happened? Why is
20:29 community such a big thing to you? Which
20:31 by the way, I don't disagree, but I'm
20:33 not so sure that's not everybody thinks
20:34 that way. Well, I think everybody thinks
20:36 that community is important immed
20:37 especially in their own immediate
20:38 sometimes their community could just
20:41 mean their So that's fine. There were a
20:42 lot of different things that I'll give
20:45 you. There's a lot of ways to to to say
20:48 this, but my favorite story is when I
20:50 had first moved to De Moine and we had
20:53 just started the social club and we were
20:54 trying to figure out how to get this
20:56 moving and we had this makeshift
20:58 building that was held together by dirt.
21:00 We had first we had a theater in the
21:03 back, a piece of crap theater, and we
21:05 had a little bar in the front with a
21:06 cabaret stage, and we started doing
21:09 shows. And the first groups that came in
21:11 to rent our theater was a group called
21:14 3X Wrestling, and they do WWE style
21:16 wrestling. Now, I never thought we'd
21:18 have wrestlers in our theater, but they
21:20 had money, so we said yes. So, they
21:22 started renting our theater once a month
21:24 to do their wrestling shows. And at the
21:26 same time, totally coincidentally, in
21:28 the bar, we booked a jazz and poetry
21:30 night at the same time. Now, these are
21:32 two worlds that would typically not be
21:34 caught dead socialized together. And so,
21:35 the first night, everybody came down.
21:37 They got drinks from the bar and they
21:39 ran off in opposite directions. Second
21:41 month, same thing. But the third month,
21:43 something really interesting happened.
21:45 The wrestlers were on their intermission
21:46 and they were coming into the bar to get
21:47 drinks and run back to the theater to
21:49 avoid the poets because they're so
21:50 scary. But there were these two guys
21:54 about six5 bull leotards standing a
21:56 little bit away from me drinking a beer
21:57 and watching the poetry. And they
21:58 suddenly turned to me and they said,
21:59 "Hey, are you the guy who runs this
22:01 place?" I said, "Yeah." And they asked
22:03 if they could talk to me in private. So
22:04 we sat down in my office. I asked what I
22:06 could do. And they said, "Listen, we'd
22:07 love to get more involved." I said,
22:09 "Great. We're a nonprofit. Here's 10
22:10 different volunteer opportunities." And
22:11 they said, "Yeah, we had something else
22:14 in mind." And they looked around to make
22:16 sure that nobody was listening. And they
22:18 whispered, "We both write poetry." and
22:19 they asked if they could read their
22:21 poems at the club. I said, "Sure, it's
22:23 an open mic. Anybody can." And that
22:26 began our wrestling and poetry evenings.
22:27 And so the following month, these two
22:29 guys, they came out, they went and
22:30 wrestled. They came out, they got on
22:31 stage, they read their poems, which were
22:33 pretty good, and then went back and
22:35 wrestled some more. The following month,
22:37 people who were their friends came out
22:39 to watch the poetry at first to support
22:41 them, and then they kind of got into it.
22:43 Two months later, the poets, encouraged
22:45 by all this new behavior, said, "We
22:46 should probably go check out what they
22:48 do." They went in to watch the wrestling
22:49 and they walked out saying that was awesome.
22:51 awesome.
22:53 10 months in, we had to change the times
22:55 of the program so people could go to
22:59 both. Now, this was in 2008 during the
23:01 Iowa caucuses back when they had
23:03 meetings. And the political
23:05 conversations happening in this room
23:07 until 2 in the morning were some of the
23:10 most natural organic convers people that
23:11 disagreed with each other almost
23:14 entirely on every issue were standing
23:16 there drinking a beer with each other
23:18 and having a civil conversation. Now, we
23:20 don't think minds were being changed,
23:22 but relationships were being formed. And
23:24 we stood back and watched this and we
23:26 said, "Okay, how do we replicate this
23:29 every night?" And so what we tried to do
23:31 was to book at least two different
23:33 events every single night that tried to
23:36 draw as opposite crowds as possible. And
23:38 so that was when that was a big light
23:41 bulb moment for me, but uh it was also a
23:42 lot of fun.
23:45 >> That is a I love that story because we
23:47 all can relate to how our own perception
23:51 of wrestlers and poetry and to see them
23:53 come together. I mean, they're both in.
23:55 Yeah, I would have loved to uh to have
23:56 seen that. Is that still happening?
23:58 >> They don't I I don't know if they still
24:00 do it today. The the social club,
24:02 unfortunately, closed, I think, in 2020.
24:05 I know those folks are still around. I
24:06 don't know if it's happening the same night.
24:06 night.
24:07 >> Well, I one of the things I should tell
24:10 the audience here is that Zach and I met
24:11 I don't let's just say a month ago,
24:13 something like that. I wear another hat
24:16 with a group called Promising People,
24:19 and we essentially are training men and
24:21 women behind bars with virtual reality.
24:23 And so we got in contact through some
24:27 relationships. Part of the idea is to
24:30 put his courses on how to do this into
24:33 the headsets to take into prison so that
24:35 as they get trained and get released uh
24:38 there could be a natural workforce uh
24:40 for you and for this industry. And I and
24:42 I bring that up because you know I've
24:44 been doing stuff in prisons for 34
24:46 years. uh started when I was a freshman
24:49 in college and it's the same type of
24:50 thing as most people look at people in
24:52 prison and go I got nothing in common
24:54 with these people these guys are thugs
24:55 or whatever whatever whatever then you
24:58 get in and have a dialogue and and and
25:00 sure some of them fit the stereotype but
25:02 not the majority of them to see inmates
25:05 crying because they're they couldn't be
25:09 at their sister's child's
25:11 you birth or or whatever like you don't
25:14 that's not a paradigm of how you picture
25:16 these these these men and so u I'm
25:18 anxious to see how how this works out
25:21 with promising people because as you've
25:24 already said outside the walls I mean
25:26 community is important and so is is
25:28 housing well the same thing is true with
25:30 men men who are behind bars and frankly
25:32 when they get out the community that
25:34 they struggle to find is just is just
25:37 massive so it's so hard and then and
25:40 then obviously the need for a a job it's
25:42 so critical so I think and you probably
25:44 already know this but you will find in
25:46 the prison system. There are some
25:49 amazing people with amazing skill sets
25:51 that I think would just, you know, would
25:52 be awesome at what you're doing. You've
25:54 got some pretty big plans that you're
25:56 working on and things that you're
25:57 dreaming about. I don't know if the word
26:00 stewardship comes up in your vernacular
26:02 at all, but h how do you view
26:03 stewardship and and how are you trying
26:04 to live that out?
26:06 >> I mean, we're stewards of our clients.
26:07 We're stewards of our staff. We're
26:10 steward stewards of just the community
26:11 as a whole. You could look at our
26:13 business like you could any business and
26:14 say on the one hand we have this
26:16 business because we want to make money
26:17 which of course is true and there's
26:18 nothing wrong with that and that's what
26:20 everybody has to do as long as we live
26:21 in a capitalistic society. So that's
26:24 where we are. However, the mission of
26:26 the organization we do have a mission
26:29 and that is to help pe put people back
26:31 into the American dream, help make
26:34 buildings more sustainable and and
26:37 greener and better for our planet. Help
26:39 create community wherever we're going.
26:42 We are stewards of of our mission and we
26:44 have to remember that it'd be very easy
26:46 to go down a pathway of well we're just
26:48 going to print retaining walls and
26:50 gutter systems forever and make our
26:53 money and be fine and we could and we
26:54 will do those things but not only those
26:56 things we have to remember the original
26:59 mission of the organization and we are
27:00 stewards to that.
27:01 >> You know I love the way you answered
27:04 that because on the other hand you want
27:07 a sustainable business so you can go do
27:09 that. So I'm projecting that you took
27:12 those opportunities with with Walmart.
27:14 Not that it is your number one priority
27:16 to build for Walmart, but on the other
27:17 hand, it probably gave you gives you the
27:20 capital, gives you you can learn and all
27:22 kind of stuff so you can hone your craft
27:24 to go do what you ultimately want to do.
27:26 And so I I think it's a good lesson for
27:28 all of us because on the when you get in
27:31 this impact investing world or or and I
27:32 don't want to confuse the two you get in
27:35 the philanthropic world it's like ah
27:36 well if you're doing this over here and
27:38 it's not completely your mission somehow
27:39 you failed and it's like well no
27:41 sometimes you need to pivot a little bit
27:42 you got to stay afloat.
27:43 >> That's that's right. I mean this is this
27:45 is startup life.
27:47 >> Startup life is exciting and horrible at
27:48 the same time
27:52 >> and I don't recommend it. But I would
27:54 say that that yes, you do have to pivot.
27:56 And yes, having a a client like Walmart
27:58 is not something we ever of course want
28:01 to say no to. It's it's less about the
28:04 impact of of what that does for our
28:07 bottom line and it's more about how much
28:09 can we learn in this process. That's the
28:12 true thing that Walmart has afforded us
28:14 is the ability like going from project
28:16 one to project two was it really in my
28:18 opinion we'll be able to tell 20 years
28:20 from now that's what built this company.
28:21 That's that's when we learned it. That
28:24 was our breakthrough. We had periods of
28:27 success prior to that, but nothing close
28:29 that moment. There's other benefits to
28:31 this and frankly, if you want to talk
28:33 about stewardship, it's being a steward
28:36 to any and all. Everybody needs help and
28:37 we should be working with everybody.
28:39 There shouldn't be anything that we
28:40 disclaude. So, it's interesting you say
28:42 that when I got my MBA, so I guess that
28:47 would have been 2004 to 2006, a lot of
28:50 the case studies were Walmart and a lot
28:52 of them were on the negative side. And
28:54 so, you know, even hearing this, it's a
28:56 great reminder and and translate this to
28:58 companies, translates this to people,
29:02 they're typically not either good or
29:05 bad. There's generally there's probably
29:07 some play between both of them. And so
29:08 here you look at Walmart and if you go
29:10 off of the perception that I had based
29:12 on, you know, going through my MBA
29:14 school, whatever, however many years
29:17 ago, and yet you see that Walmart is
29:19 probably venturing out in a space where
29:21 a lot of other smaller companies can't
29:23 do it. And they're going to allow you to
29:25 hone your skills. You're going to make a
29:26 difference for them and they're going to
29:28 make a difference for you. And so it go
29:30 it even goes back to your concept of
29:33 community and not shunning somebody just
29:35 because they do things a little bit
29:37 differently. you still can work together
29:39 and and accomplish things. And I'm
29:40 assuming in the same light, there's
29:42 nothing wrong to have Discord. I mean,
29:44 you told Walmart, look, to do another
29:46 one. I need to actually come down and do
29:47 this together. And so, you probably have
29:48 a much better relationship with them
29:51 today than you did when you started. So,
29:53 >> yeah, we it's they got excited about
29:55 that. And we today we have a great
29:59 relationship. And they are most a lot of
30:01 folks probably wouldn't think of Walmart
30:03 as an innovative company and they are by
30:05 far one of the most innovative companies
30:07 and they've changed their their
30:10 perception greatly over the last 10 to
30:11 20 years and they're continuing to do
30:13 that. And when you've you've got
30:16 companies of this size they're going to
30:17 be scrutinized. They're also going to be
30:21 celebrated and so we I I am I didn't
30:23 know much about the inner workings of
30:24 Walmart obviously before we started
30:26 doing this work. I know a decent amount
30:30 today and it has been a a wonderful ride
30:32 with them of being able to learn side by
30:35 side. They are as much if not more
30:37 excited about this technology as we are.
30:39 >> Well, what's interesting is is if you
30:42 take that same concept, you know, in the
30:44 impact investing space, and I'm not
30:46 saying I I fall into this personally,
30:48 but the larger companies can be shunned
30:51 easier. And yet I've always sat on the
30:53 side that says, "Well, yeah, but a lot
30:54 of these big companies if they make
30:57 minor tweaks, the impact they can have
30:59 is massive to any startup that they're
31:01 going to have." And so usually it's just
31:03 a matter of having a dialogue and and
31:06 finding alignment in different areas.
31:07 And I'm assuming the alignment there is,
31:09 hey, we want this stuff cheaper, we want
31:11 it faster, and you can do that and
31:13 deliver, you know, the other
31:15 environmental benefits. It's a home run
31:16 for everybody.
31:17 >> Exactly. And that last part is is one of
31:19 the big things that gets glossed over
31:21 and forgotten is that they do want it
31:22 better and cheaper and faster, of
31:24 course, but they also want this to have
31:26 more positive impact on the environment.
31:28 And frankly, I don't think enough
31:30 companies are thinking that direction.
31:32 Walmart definitely is, and we're a small
31:33 piece of it.
31:34 >> Okay, last question. If you could have
31:36 one dream come true, and it could be
31:37 more than one if you if you want, and I
31:39 can take your family out of it if that
31:41 helps you, but if you could have a dream
31:43 come true, what would that be? I
31:44 immediately go to I want my kids to be
31:46 happy and healthy. But taking my family
31:48 out of it, one dream to come come true
31:51 would be for for everybody to venture
31:53 outside of their comfort zone and their
31:56 little bubble where they live and work
31:59 on a on a regular basis to not they
32:02 don't have to agree with but to
32:05 understand the perspective of the other
32:08 of the person opposite them is to
32:10 respect it. Not agree. They don't have
32:13 to agree, but to understand why a
32:15 certain per person thinks the way that
32:18 they do. I think if everybody could do
32:20 that, the world would be a much better place.
32:20 place.
32:22 >> All right. I I am going to add one more
32:25 question. So, we're talking 3D printing.
32:27 I think of houses. I'm assuming you've
32:29 thought about this. If not, that's fine.
32:33 If you had from scratch had, you pick
32:35 it. whatever it's 30 acres, whether it's
32:38 500 acres, if they somebody gave you the
32:41 money and gave you the freedom to say
32:43 now go build a community that you want,
32:45 have you thought about like would it
32:47 look different? I mean, I'm assuming
32:49 it's been built by 3D printing, but how
32:52 else would it look different from what
32:53 we're used to seeing?
32:55 >> If I had a blank check to build a
32:56 community, yes, it would be done with
32:58 3D. probably other technologies being
33:00 involved as well, but every component of
33:02 every home, of every structure would be
33:03 3D printed out of all types of
33:05 materials, not just concrete. It would
33:07 be designed entirely by the homeowners
33:09 themselves. Every every little bit of
33:12 it, every door knob, every drawer pole,
33:15 every bathtub, every fence, every door,
33:17 everything would be designed by the
33:19 individual who's going to end up owning
33:21 it. And in some cases, they would print
33:23 it themselves. the products that they're
33:25 using, any waste inside their home would
33:27 be recycled for them to be able to print
33:28 other things for their homes in the
33:30 future. There would be shared community
33:33 space where you have larger 3D printers
33:35 that everybody can utilize in their
33:37 area. Culturally, they would be able to
33:39 utilize all of the art forms would be in
33:43 that walkable community. Every store,
33:45 everything that you need to purchase
33:47 would be available there, provided
33:50 locally and provided by the community
33:52 itself. And yeah, I think that that does it.
33:52 it.
33:54 >> Had you thought about that before?
33:54 >> Of course.
33:56 >> I just say because you answered it like
33:57 like you had.
33:59 >> Yeah. Very cool. Well, Zach, thanks for
34:02 for taking the time. It's just fun to
34:04 One of the opportunities and and the
34:07 things I love doing here is talking with
34:09 people who are not just talking about
34:12 doing stuff, but are risking and doing.
34:14 And that's exactly what you're doing.
34:16 And so, I'm anxious to see where this
34:19 goes. I hope that one day you will have
34:21 your blank check and you can or at least
34:24 help design one of these communities and
34:26 then we'll go from there. So anyways,
34:27 thanks so much. Anything you want to say
34:28 in closing?
34:30 >> Thank you. Great questions, great great
34:31 interview, great discussion. Thank you.
34:34 >> So just as so everybody knows if they
34:36 want to find out more about you, put it
34:38 put it in the description, whatnot,
34:39 where can they find you?
34:42 >> Allquest 3d.com. My contact info is on
34:43 there. Feel free to reach out to me
34:45 directly. I'm also pretty active on LinkedIn.
34:45 LinkedIn.
34:47 >> Wonderful. Well, uh, don't forget to
34:49 subscribe to New Lens with Common Good
34:51 Capital on your podcast app of choice.
34:53 This will help new listeners find the
34:55 show and hopefully put them on a path to
34:56 more fulfilling portfolio from the
34:58 impact investing space. Zach, thanks so
35:09 This podcast is a production of Common
35:11 Good Capital. Does not constitute an
35:13 offer or a solicitation of an offer.
35:15 Such offer would only be made through a
35:16 private placement memorandum.
35:18 Prospective investors in private
35:20 placement securities should be aware
35:22 that making an investment is speculative
35:24 and involves a high degree of risk,
35:26 including the risk of losing all or a
35:28 portion of an investment. Investments of
35:30 this nature are illquid and subject to
35:32 substantial restrictions upon transferability.
