0:02 will Ramsay kill his father Roose Bolton
0:05 in the books he may be capable of it but
0:07 will he actually do it let's take a look
0:10 at the evidence hi everyone this is
0:12 Robert welcome to inde deep geek on this
0:14 channel we dive deep into A Song of Ice
0:16 and Fire as well as other great fantasy
0:18 worlds like the Lord of the Rings and
0:21 The Witcher welcome and this is another
0:23 collaboration with the wonderful history
0:25 of westos please do check out their
0:27 excellent podcast and YouTube channel
0:30 there's a link in the description
0:32 before betraying the Starks at the Red
0:34 Wedding Roose Bolton shored up his
0:36 alliance with his co-conspirators the
0:39 phrase by marrying one of Lord walder's
0:41 granddaughters rather un originally
0:44 named Walder with an a at the end by the
0:46 end of A Dance with Dragons it appears
0:49 that she is pregnant and rousa Pines
0:51 that the Dreadfort might become overrun with
0:52 with
0:55 boltons but then he says that Ramsay
0:57 will probably kill them all in order to
0:59 ensure that he inherits The Dread for
1:01 himself and we already know that Roose
1:03 also believes Ramsey killed his trueborn
1:07 son demeric years ago given all that
1:09 surely Roose is aware of the possibility
1:12 that Ramsay might kill him too but will
1:16 he be able to stop it will Ramsay kill
1:19 Roose in the Game of Thrones TV show
1:21 this question has already been answered
1:23 of course Ramsey did Kill roose's new
1:26 child and his wife and Roose himself
1:28 however Ramsay's character and story arc
1:30 is definitely one of the many changes
1:32 the show made to the books in this case
1:34 they went to Great Lengths to make
1:36 Ramsey a central villain figure
1:37 especially in the wake of Joffrey's
1:40 death there was a narrative impetus to
1:42 make him the Lord of The Dread Fort so
1:43 that he could have full command of the
1:46 Bolton armies against Jon Snow and Sansa
1:49 Stark in the books however it's not so
1:51 straightforward on either count Sansa is
1:53 not involved in the northern plot at all
1:56 not yet at least it's Jane P not her who
1:59 was forcibly married to ramsy and Jon's
2:00 death is likely to be handled
2:03 differently there's no guarantee he
2:05 leads an Army against the boltons at all
2:06 let alone something like the battle of
2:09 the bastards maybe he will but even then
2:11 the circumstances of the battle will
2:13 surely be different if only because of
2:16 Stannis in the show he makes it to
2:18 Winterfell with his army only to be
2:20 wiped out by the superior Bolton Force
2:23 yet in the books it's an army of fras
2:25 and mandes he's about to face and they
2:27 are headed to stannis's location near a
2:29 crofter's village rather than Stannis
2:31 headed for them at Winterfell and he has
2:33 prepared an icy trap that most of the
2:36 fandom believes will work and it seems
2:38 likely that the mandes will reveal their
2:41 true colors and turn on the phrase a
2:43 very different battle indeed so things
2:45 are different in the books but that
2:47 doesn't mean that everything will be
2:50 different and Ramsey himself is quite a
2:52 similar character in particular it's
2:55 clear that Roose almost expects Ramsey
2:57 to kill any children he has with Walder
3:00 with an a this is the whole quote from
3:02 Roose when talking about the dread Fort
3:03 being overrun with
3:06 boltons if she pops out Suns the way she
3:09 Pops in Tarts The Dread for will soon be
3:12 overrun with boltons Ramsay will kill
3:15 them all of course that's for the best I
3:17 will not live long enough to see new
3:19 Sons to manhood and boy Lords are the
3:22 bane of any house Walder will grieve to
3:25 see them die though which goes to show
3:28 not only that Ramsey has absolutely no
3:30 quals about killing family members
3:33 including babies but just as importantly
3:36 that he by implication does want to be
3:39 Lord Bolton one day Roose expects him to
3:41 get rid of anyone challenging his place
3:43 in the line of succession so might
3:46 Ramsey take the next psychotic step of
3:47 logic and speed up the process
3:50 completely by killing his father we get
3:53 an Insight when Roose insults Ramsay
3:56 reminding him that he is a bastard son
3:58 despite him being officially legitimized
4:00 in the previous chapter
4:03 and taking Theon his favorite toy from
4:06 him we read this again from theon's
4:10 paav reek saw the way Ramsay's mouth
4:13 Twisted the spittle glistening between
4:15 his lips he feared he might leap the
4:17 table with his dagger in his hand
4:21 instead he flushed red turned his pale
4:23 eyes from his father's paler ones and
4:25 went to find the
4:28 keys quite revealing Theon sees that
4:30 Ramsey wanted to kill his his father in
4:34 that moment why didn't he he was Rose's
4:37 only living son so finally air apparent
4:39 well we don't know for sure but it
4:40 certainly doesn't seem to be a
4:43 particular love for his father or fear
4:45 of Roose or a recognition that he has
4:47 few supporters in the Bolton retinue
4:49 that holds him back Roose even laughs at
4:51 the idea that he might have supporters
4:53 and even though roose's guards were
4:56 outside there has to be a chance that as
4:58 the only living Bolton left even
5:00 standing over his father's dead body his
5:03 men and vassals would have no choice but
5:06 to obey him particularly if he blamed
5:09 Theon say for killing Roose kinslayer or
5:12 no the law and tradition would both make
5:15 him Lord of The Dread so perhaps he
5:17 thought that better opportunities would
5:20 come or more likely given his impatience
5:22 earlier in the chapter perhaps he wanted
5:24 to marry the fake Aya Stark first to
5:26 cement his claim not just to The Dread
5:29 Fort but also Winterfell and the North
5:32 before he killed his father but
5:34 shouldn't Roose realize all this as well
5:37 he knows what Ramsay is like and has a
5:39 notably cautious character for example
5:41 he has a decoy wearing his armor when he
5:43 passes through the neck for fear of
5:46 cranman arrows and Lady Dustin points
5:48 out that Roose never eats or drinks
5:50 without seeing Lord mandley consume it
5:52 first but in the scene with Ramsay that
5:55 we've just quoted Roose dismisses his
5:58 guards first it's just the three of them
6:00 when Theon thinks Ramsey is close to
6:02 jumping the table the caution Ruth has
6:06 shown elsewhere seems to be lacking here
6:08 maybe he takes it for granted that
6:11 Ramsay is conditioned to obey a bit like
6:13 how Ramsey believed reek was so loyal
6:15 thanks to his brutal conditioning but as
6:18 we saw he was wrong not only did reek
6:21 Escape he began calling himself Theon
6:23 again Roose might have similarly
6:26 misjudged his son he laughs at the idea
6:28 that Ramsay had men of his own but he
6:31 might be so overconfident in his control
6:32 of the dread fought men that he has
6:35 failed to note the most direct approach
6:38 next time if there is a next time Ramsay
6:41 might not back down his Fury might win
6:43 out over his conditioning he's a man
6:45 with a vicious temper and Roose doesn't
6:47 seem to fear any consequences from
6:50 provoking him but there is another
6:53 possibility here maybe Roose is simply
6:56 at a loss as to what to do about Ramsey
6:59 he says to Theon tell me my Lord if the
7:02 kinslayer is a cursed what is a father
7:06 to do when one son slays
7:08 another does Roose truly believed that
7:11 the old gods have cursed ramsy that they
7:13 would curse him too if he had Ramsey put
7:16 to death Roose is too much of an enigma
7:18 for us to know exactly what he believes
7:22 or feels or if he feels at all he could
7:25 send Ramy to the wall but then he would
7:28 have no Heir until his new wife produces
7:30 a child and house bton would be in a
7:32 very precarious position as long as
7:34 Ramsay keeps on murdering roose's other
7:36 children and Roose definitely wants
7:39 there to be an air for House Bolton then
7:41 there's a kind of stalemate here Roose
7:44 knows Ramsey might want to kill him but
7:46 doesn't feel he can do anything about it
7:49 so he is probably left to Simply keep
7:52 his distance from his own son Roose
7:53 doesn't have to ever be alone with
7:56 Ramsey again a security practice often
7:58 seen in real world dynasties of the
8:01 ancient world for example but again even
8:02 though he has shown quite a bit of
8:05 caution elsewhere he has not shown it with
8:06 with
8:09 Ramsay this is quite a dark thought but
8:13 perhaps Roose has simply accepted his
8:15 fate he definitely appears to be more
8:18 accepting than most of his own mortality
8:20 mentioning to Theon that he won't live
8:23 to see any new Sons live to manhood we
8:25 don't know exactly how old Roose is
8:27 probably middle-aged or something like
8:30 that certainly not old old so it seems a
8:32 little fatalistic of him to be so
8:34 certain that he won't survive the next
8:37 15 or 20 years say has he simply come to
8:39 an acceptance that having made so many
8:41 enemies of the other Northern houses
8:43 living in a time of war with a hard
8:45 winter coming and a sun like Ramsay the
8:48 odds are against him surviving long term
8:51 he has already secured what Millennia of
8:53 boltons could not replacing the Starks
8:56 as preeminent house in the north so his
8:58 place in history is secure it's now just
9:00 a matter of see seeing how long he will
9:03 survive that for if he has accepted that
9:06 he won't live to old age and that Ramsay
9:08 will kill all his other children he has
9:11 accepted that ramsy will succeed
9:14 him with Theon leaving Winterfell our
9:17 last P character has gone from Roose and
9:19 Ramsey's side so we don't know firsthand
9:20 anything that happens there for the
9:24 foreseeable future now ramsy has the
9:26 lordship of Winterfell secured and a
9:28 reason to be very very angry with the
9:30 loss of his wife and Theon and
9:33 threatened by the announcement of waler
9:36 with an A's pregnancy what might he do
9:38 if Ramsey does kill Roose early in the
9:41 Winds of Winter it sets up a few
9:43 intriguing possibilities for the story
9:45 going forward because Winterfell is a
9:47 Tinderbox right now with competing
9:49 groupings at each other's throats quite
9:51 literally at times they're being held
9:54 together only by a fear of Roose and the
9:56 Allies he has the fras and the
9:58 Lannisters or in some cases perhaps a
10:01 personal iation with Roose or desire for
10:04 advancement if Roose dies yes the dread
10:06 fought men and direct vassals will
10:09 probably follow Ramsey but so many
10:12 others would turn on him Ramsey has made
10:14 a lot of enemies with his behavior lady
10:18 Dustin the hornwood the mandes and so on
10:21 and few allies Roose has explained this
10:24 to him and may think he understands but
10:26 Ramsey has repeatedly shown that he acts
10:29 without thinking of the consequences Ram
10:31 Ramsey might also not be able to keep
10:33 the Allies that Roose has made for
10:35 himself especially the phas the
10:38 Coalition that swept the Bolton to power
10:40 May well fracture because Ramsay can't
10:42 or won't see the implications of killing
10:45 his father without something significant
10:47 happening at Winterfell it's hard to see
10:50 how stannis's snowbound weakened army or
10:53 any other might successfully Siege a dug
10:56 in Bolton force in the castle and just
11:00 as a thought perhaps Ramsey has already
11:02 killed his father we wouldn't know and
11:04 although I believe the pink letter
11:06 wasn't actually written by Ramsey why
11:08 would someone else write it as if it's
11:11 from Ramsay if Roose was still alive and
11:13 in charge surely Jon would be more
11:15 provoked by a letter from the man he
11:18 knows betrayed Rob it's far from
11:20 conclusive but definitely food for
11:22 thought if we're looking for further
11:25 hints in the text then perhaps Tywin
11:27 Lannister the person Roose Allied
11:29 himself with death at the hand of the
11:31 son he considered a bastard but probably
11:34 wasn't could be echoed by ruses at the
11:36 hands of the son who was a bastard but
11:40 now technically isn't in every case
11:42 there's an element here of evil being
11:45 the cause of its own downfall Roose
11:47 tells Theon the rather horrible story of
11:50 how Ramsey was conceived I'll spare you
11:52 the details but if Roose had not been
11:55 the horrific man he is Ramsay wouldn't
11:58 even exist and his son demeric who seems
11:59 to have actually been quite a a decent
12:02 human being would still be alive and
12:03 Roose wouldn't be facing the threat of
12:06 his own son murdering him Ramsay may
12:09 have the motive means and probably will
12:11 have the opportunity to murder Roose but
12:14 it will do him no good he may rule for a
12:17 while but soon the Starks will return to
12:20 Winterfell and then surely he too will be
12:21 be
12:24 gone if you'd like to see more videos
12:25 like this digging into the northern
12:27 plotline and A Song of Ice and Fire
12:28 there's a link to that playlist
12:30 appearing now on the left of your screen
12:33 or to support this channel thank you
12:34 there's a link to my patreon page
12:35 appearing now on the right of your
12:38 screen that's all for this time thanks
