Ben Patrick's nase over toes method teaches how  to bulletproof your body learn how to reach Peak  

Performance and move freely without pain find  out why everyone's talking about knees over  

toes in today's podcast flexibility verse strength  training how should we decide whether we should be  

stretching or strengthening a muscle well I love  both of them and I love however someone wants to  

do it I personally like to make sure that I'm  getting strong from any position that I stretch  

through so a classic example for me in my leg  training is doing a split squat but with a full  

range of motion that means I'm stretching these  hip flexors while training through a full range  

of motion here so unlike a passive hip flexor  stretch I'm loaded through the hip flexor so I'm  

I'm owning this position I can now load this leg  I can do pauses I can do slow tempos so there's a  

lot that can be done from getting stronger through  a stretched position what do you think on that one  

okay so it's the idea of using a full range of  motion and you're lengthening muscles on one  

side of the joint and strengthening the other side  so killing two birds with one stone doing both at  

the same time instead of just thinking of them as  binary things I'm stretching or I'm strengthening  

exactly in some cases you can do both you  can do a stretch strength and exercise but  

ultimately I think that to most protect the  body you don't want to have weak or tight  

links like you want any area that your body can  go into you want to be strong through that area  

from your experience some people suggest that I  have tight hip flexors it seems to me that you're  

doing movements as you just showed through a  full range of motion that both stretches and  

strengthens is there any room for just purely  stretching to fix the tightness absolutely like  

I think I think peer stretching is fine but what  I've seen is that most people who stay tight in  

area they stay tighten area because they're weak  in that area so the average person who can just do  

a Hip Flex restriction like oh my God Everything  feels better like awesome I'm not telling you to  

to change that but the person who's like oh I've  been stretching my hip flexors for years and they  

stay tight well maybe the strength is actually not  there maybe we need to be actually like loading  

into those tissues and then that seems to open it  up and that works for a lot of different areas of  

the body you start to do your strength training  through that zone and then it starts to open up  

for sure that whole idea of an error being  notoriously taught and all they have to do  

is stretch it makes sense that if you keep doing  the same thing over and over not saying different  

results that is the definition of insanity  yeah sure thing a note on that because some  

people will see it and they think it's uh let's  say extreme or something like that is I set up  

everything here to demonstrate you'll notice that  this would require less hip flexor flexibility to  

get the same range as then doing it lower so you  have a you have a scale of measuring that range  

of motion and you would just work at the zone  that feels good the idea is not to be working  

through something that's not comfortable work  through the zone that feels good build strength  

and flexibility uh in harmony that's the goal  okay what would you say are the most important  

knees over toes principles you feel that everyone  should know so we can break this down really fast

this allows me to demonstrate right here backward  walking people with knee pain have been found that  

when they walk forward that vastus medialis muscle  that teardrop muscle it doesn't engage the same  

way it does for someone without knee pain but when  people with knee pain walk backward that muscle  

does then engage as it's supposed to so this  concept of going backward has been used way way  

way longer than any studies on it it's been passed  down generation to generation in Chinese elderly  

they hold hands and walk backwards to prevent  arthritis in the knee so it's actually like to  

make the body if I have to go backward you have to  train your knees over your toes that doesn't mean  

that you could be an Old Pro in a sport and think  that just walking around backward is going to  

magically fix your knee pain it's based on force  and based on strength so that's why we then drag  

sleds backward you could get for someone even more  advanced you could get more alleviation of knee  

pain by dragging a sled backward or that thing's  like a resisted treadmill I tried to chauffeur  

the calisthenics crowd how minimal of stuff we can  use and we'll go down to using literally nothing  

so let's say you warmed up even with like just  jogging backwards but just backward Locomotion  

would be the foundation of knee exercise then  and here's showing like at a at a extreme level  

then you have the same backward concept the same  motion but also handling the way down so now you  

have a reverse step up so instead of just reverse  walking you have a reverse step up and this scale  

so at a three inch step you have a wonderful  stability exercise for the knee at a six inch  

step you have uh you could probably play most  sports nine inches you might have a stronger knee  

than most sports would need by the time you're  doing like a foot with no knee pain now you  

might actually wind up with someone with like more  bulletproof knees than the norm for your sport so  

really from the backward walking to then handling  that pressure that way and you can see how  

as we progress this like through more range  of motion you're almost then getting into uh  

closer to this exercise so now now here we're  training full range of motion and someone could  

it's like optional for us you could then put that  together with full squats so that would be a quick  

uh like four steps backward walking to backward  step UPS to full split squats then then all that  

if someone wants you know the strength effect you  can put it together pretty easily with full squat  

and then you have some outer stuff like we  finished with uh couch stretch or some people  

do like more advanced where they do like a I  mean there's a lot of different ways you can  

call it but let's say a natural leg extension  reverse yeah I consider all of that like more  

optional actually like in coaching this is this  stuff a lot I consider that stuff more optional  

and more based on like are you going to be putting  your knees through extreme demands so for for an  

older person maybe just backward sled and you're  like hey this is great I don't have to get a knee  

replacement now if you're gonna be in sports  though that eccentric pressure of the step up  

we find like to me I think that's the number one  exercise to jump higher is that reverse step up  

you're lifting you're lifting your body one leg at  a time but these aren't just like uh things that I  

think in my head for myself it's from coaching so  many guys so in our gym we have uh a bunch of the  

highest jumpers in the world we have the highest  jumping weekly basketball game on earth and the  

guys who can jump the highest they can lift their  own body so easily in this position so when they  

when they jump it's super easy to lift the body so  so um so yeah the scaling of it from grandparents  

to like Elite athletes with what I just showed  right there like I'm giving it away like that's  

it's a it's a full system then it comes down  then it gets really personal within that so you  

have a scale from backward walking all the way to  like uh let's say the most extreme would be like  

literally like a like a [ __ ] Squad is literally  like how far the knee can go over the toes  

is Grandma like is my mom my mom's 69 does she  need that exercise no I never have her do that  

exercise she goes backwards she does the step UPS  she can do a full split squat on flat ground she  

can do sets of split squats on flat ground so for  her I'm like that's wonderful for longevity just  

to maintain that Mobility then for performance  we start to go higher on the step UPS maybe some  

loading into the split squats definitely loading  into the squats for the performance effect we  

actually we had chains on the bar like a lot of  chains like 100 pounds so if at the bottom it's  

200 it's like 300 at the top because people will  argue well don't go all the way down because then  

you can't use enough weight for the performance  effect well if you control the weight all the way  

down then you can get the joint strengthening  effect full development but adding chains then  

you really can challenge yourself like all the way  through so that's that's how we do it it seems as  

if you're taking a really holistic and balanced  approach to Performance and injury prevention  

Etc and it's just nice because we see something  like backwards walking so the average person that  

hasn't seen it they're thinking how do we scale  that and as you've just said you can play with  

so many variables that we know from traditional  training and apply it to this concept you can  

increase your duration you can increase your  resistance by using the sled you can also play  

around with incline walking backwards walking  maybe a vest if you're if you're in bodyweight  

training maybe you have a vest already and maybe  it's the summer time maybe you go backward with a  

vest I mean different variables and then just all  the other way in traditional training we do High  

Reps low intensity we do low reps fire intensity  you can do that same thing for backwards walking  

with The Walking itself you can do long duration  or you could apply that principle to the step  

down and as you said you build up to crazy  range of motion added weight the the sky's  

the limit yeah yeah yeah I like for um that it's  all variables so it's not even saying that this  

system is uh better than another system this is  a system I found based on specializing in people  

with really bad knees so actually like a lot of  people from doing those uh reverse step ups and  

split squats then something like a pistol squat  even without like the practice of the technique  

you can just kind of control those positions and  do you know a pretty good rep and and oftentimes  

with like you know pretty good posture so  it's I think that's a wonderful exercise too  

um but this is just a smooth scale I found for  people with bad knees yeah and as you for a set  

so far in our chat there's so many different quad  exercises that you can do you've outline them the  

atj split squat the reverse Nordic the step down  why isn't just squats and normal lunges enough  

for Quad strength that's a great question so if we  look at a if we look at a squat and we think about  

where the load is so already the load is not as  much at the extension and when people are trying  

to rehabilitate that's often the most pain-free  thing they can do is extend so it's something like  

backward walking or a sled you can work what we  call a short range so even if it's going on a sled  

yesterday we're pushing the sled forward and then  we're going backward and we ended up we do eight  

rounds in here 12 and a half yards each way which  adds up to 100 yards each way and I'm going side  

by side with a New York Yankees baseball player  who has chronic knee pain and by the end I mean he  

can't keep up with it backward you're really you  can apply full intent to that short range so we  

see for like the elasticity for jumping and stuff  there is a bit more to be gained from sledding  

than just squatting alone now the squat as you  go down now you start to get into some really  

amazing loading like I would consider the squat  you could call it like the king of leg exercises  

I think that would be that would be fine but for  someone with my knee injury history like I have a  

partially artificial kneecap in the left then I  had more tears in the right like squatting felt  

awful but working that squat one side at a time  felt really good not to mention like there's some  

added benefits of the hip flexor stretching that  you get so for me getting getting better in this  

position one side at a time I then was able to  kind of like rebuild the ability to squat and have  

it feel really good same with as I was showing  the the Step Up think how much load by handling  

my whole body weight through these positions I  can now get like as you approach we tend to do  

this one for higher reps like 20 reps so let's say  you approach 20 reps and you're like literally at  

failure it's kind of hard to take one side of  the body like one at a time to failure in such  

a safe manner that you can just flow right into  like a squat it takes a lot more preparation if  

you're gonna be using like heavier loads you want  like things have to be balanced in the body so I  

think the squat kind of puts it all together and  the squat is going to allow um probably more core  

strength but as you know from what you do like  there's a lot of exercises you can do for the core  

so if someone said here's the challenge you can't  use squats you have to make someone jump higher  

I'd say fine same with if they said here you  can't use this extra can't use this they're all  

different tools that I can work with that makes so  much sense with the quad specific training because  

to probably overload that shortened range you need  targeted exercises the classic example we can give  

is the forbidden leg extension people think of  this as the worst exercise for your knees it's  

terrible it's sharing stress at the full range  would lock out but in order to properly overload  

the quads you need to get that terminal knee  extension at the end range so exercises like  

leg extensions exercises like backwards walking  is a phenomenal way to fully fatigue that aspect  

because just by doing your regular squats that  standing position when your legs are straight  

in a squat isn't doing anything that's not  the point of failure so I can see how your  

knees over toes philosophy here is integrating  some of the deficits from traditional training  

yeah exactly we're trying to just be strong  through all the ranges we're really trying  

to use exercise to have balance to the body so  if it's only squat you're often going to find  

some imbalances and I think one reason that  uh if you look at leg extension first let's  

say going backward with a sled or doing the  reverse step up um oftentimes if someone can  

do leg extensions and they feel good then it seems  to work out well for them if they can't oftentimes  

by doing backward sled something about pushing  through the ball of the foot seems to engage a  

bit like it I think it seems to make it easier  to engage the vastus mean as remember that from  

from this study in 2019 people without knee pain  when they walk forward the VMO does engage so for  

many people there's they would say oh you know  lunges are all you need and things like that and  

that for them that actually might make them  feel fine whereas someone who has knee pain  

might make them feel worse and so a lot like a  leg extension because the weight is here it's a  

bit of a different force on the knee and it seems  to engage a bit differently by pushing through the  

ball of the foot so I think it's um it's important  for someone to realize that even the same exercise  

is not going to work identically for different  people it doesn't mean the exercise works or  

doesn't work it's like when they're going into  the exercise are they balanced enough to even do  

it properly yeah do you think it's something about  the open kinetic chain leg extension versus closed  

connect chain step up the the force is a bit  different through the quad as well yeah I think so  

for sure I think that when you're pushing through  the ball of the foot you're engaging differently  

um than when it's just there I mean maybe maybe  if someone like as a comparison like uh you  

have forearm muscles things like that so maybe if  someone had um elbow pain maybe someone would find  

like differences a lot of people fix elbow pain by  like building up the forearms for example and then  

the like they people do too much curls they get  some kind of tendonitis and then they end up doing  

forearm work and it makes the elbow pain go away  it's just kind of a an example just to show that  

um even in the legs when you're pushing  through the ball of the foot it does seem  

to engage the knee differently than the  pressure being just right there when it  

comes to increasing vertical jump earlier  you said that the step down is one of the  

most effective exercises you found how would  you suggest for people that say things like  

uh what about claims for increasing  vertical by comparison to a step down  

we'd have to establish that jumping within itself  has tremendous variance so you would have like  

like a standstill jump you're just doing triple  extension so that the ankle the knee the hip is  

all just extending and you you go into the jump  so a clean is going to work on Triple extension  

um with something like a step down you're going to  have a lot more eccentric like way down force that  

something like this can cause more adaptation  in the VMO and more adaptation in the patellar  

tendon than a clean and when you go to actually  jump in sport usually you're it's how much force  

can you handle so you're running into the jump  and then let's say it's a basketball jump like  

Michael Jordan two foot jump that means boom all  this force is coming through there and can you  

handle that if you can handle without pain  and jump in the jumping goes up and up and  

up even on a one foot jump a ton of force goes  into that patellar tendon so it's almost like  

it's almost like if you can make a knee that  can't hurt no matter how hard you try to jump  

it's much easier to jump higher so the clean may  look like a good expression but the person may not  

be connecting the dots that oh their their knee  hurts and so they're not expressing more so that's  

what we see is that we haven't seen traditional  strength training match what the natural athletes  

can do so we train tons of natural athletes who  have never they've um they've never trained before  

and they can naturally fly what can those guys  do that the person who's been working out for  

10 years trying to jump higher but can't jump  anywhere near the Natural what's the difference  

there a young Michael Jordan was already Slam  Dunk champion in the NBA back-to-back years flying  

before he started lifting weights so the weights  he used he got stronger it helped him in the game  

but he didn't jump any higher from that so they  Usain bolts of the world the Michael Jordan's  

you know not every good genetic athlete is a  famous athlete so we've we've been fortunate  

to train lots of guys who have tremendous  genetics and then see like what exercises  

can they do that the regular person can't and  often it's that like extreme uh joint strength  

tendon strength to handle it for example um like  like this would be the ultimate the ultimate  

separator between the guy who works out and the  guy who's a natural freak athlete is the natural  

freak athlete can do a Nordic hamstring curl and  the guy who maybe has been working 10 years on  

his vertical jump drops like a sack of potatoes  so this is not a traditional hamstring exercise  

it gets much more into the attendance behind  the knee so that's just an example that's just  

an example that you have power clean would  be a tremendous expression of power but not  

necessarily testing what can the knee handle what  can the hamstrings handle for Speed and jumping  

this comes down to the idea of function we're not  saying that a power claim isn't functional because  

by doing that you would be increasing your power  production in triple extension whereas by doing  

the step down and other exercises for the muscles  involved in jumping such as the Nordic then it's  

able to withstand the forces that are specific  to jumping and Landing would that be correct  

exactly so power clean is a high Force exercise  but jumping is also a super high Force exercise  

so to make guys who are among the world's highest  jumpers we simply haven't found that we have to  

use the Olympic lifts I mean it's a matter of  result we have five different guys over 45 inch  

maximum vertical in our weekly basketball game and  none of them are doing Olympic lifts it doesn't  

mean could they add Olympic list I mean go for it  you could we haven't found the need to and for me  

every ounce of the training volume matters and  also the Olympic lifting is a lot of it's a lot  

of energy so maybe for a sport where you have  a more extended off season maybe like Rugby  

Football I could see that more to like keep some  you know some of that stimulus through the upper  

traps keep that explosiveness like it's not like  you're in the off season of football you're not  

going to just go be hitting people and stuff so I  think the Olympic lift has a place as as something  

that you could use depending on the athlete  for achieving world-class levels of jumping  

we haven't found it necessary because jumping  itself is tremendous amount of force like when  

people measure how much force goes into a jump  it's it's thousands of pounds of force so then we  

use the training to make the body easier to lift  and then and less likely to be able to experience  

pain when we do then jump and it comes down to the  scalability of the exercises as you've mentioned  

earlier everything can be scaled from those  nordics to step Downs in tremendous increments  

so whether someone is injured and they're trying  to return to full health or they're chasing that  

Peak Performance trying to supersede that 40-inch  vert then they're able to find something that can  

really be scaled exactly for me to use an exercise  look the the athleticism is really cool but quite  

frankly I care more about being able to scale and  exercise this is just one example if you lift the  

bench enough of a Nordic well then you you change  the angle of it you could at least probably fight  

down like just about anyone could fight down on a  Nordic if it was scaled enough um so for me like  

the fact that my mom can run and be mobile that  does matter to me more than if Elite athlete jumps  

another inch higher so for me to use an exercise  in the atg system uh like it has to scale to any  

level it has to scale something a grandma could  do and for context even with the Nordic like with  

the hamstring curl machine you can put it at  the lightest plate like you can start working  

the hamstring but for calisthenics and body weight  like there are certain barriers so realizing that  

you could just scale down a Nordic tremendously  it would be better than nothing okay yeah  

you put you know uh even if you had the doorway  thing you could you could have a band and someone  

could hold the band and you could you could uh  scale it that way I mean there's a lot of ways  

you could do it yeah I feel that the raisin body  white exercise and calisthenics aren't as popular  

as they could be is just people don't understand  how to scale them as you said weights you can  

incrementally adjust the weight it's pretty  straightforward especially on machines whereas  

with body weight exercises you have to change  intensity in different ways how can people change  

the intensity of body weight exercises yeah I mean  to show a quick run through like we get into our  

body weight system we put a butt against the wall  we Flex the quad so the quad's not actually able  

to assist we Flex this muscle below the knee  if you stand closer most people can do it if  

you thought you couldn't even do that you could  just lift one side you wouldn't have to lift them  

both off at the same time so we start working from  the ground up that way that same concept applies  

but in the opposite so a calf raise you could do  on two legs you could progress to one leg we then  

and this this replaces like having a sled  we then go into a neover toe calf race so  

I'm just isometrically holding whatever level I  can do with no pain same thing you could go with  

two legs so that's literally the first three  steps of like our our body weight training  

this muscle front and the shin upper calf lower  calf I do those to this day 25 reps each you'll  

be smoked I mean you can you can achieve elite  athletic results uh with with just your body  

so you start there by progressing that isometric  you now get able to handle more and more now you  

can go find a step or do it somewhere now you  can start to get into the step down and then  

you can get into the split squat so right there  like there's there's literally the first five  

steps of my zero system is tibialis upper  calf lower calf which progresses you right  

into step up which then progresses you then  into that full range of motion split squat  

so someone with with with with literally nothing  you could figure out how to do those five steps  

because you wouldn't have to have you wouldn't  have to have a wedge stuff like like it's they're  

all just tools but you can do without the trend  I'm noticing is every exercise has a component of  

stretching and strengthening so you're integrating  in full range of motion movement and it's going to  

get the best of both worlds of flexibility and  strength which to me seems the most usable in  

athletic activities yeah that's what we've seen if  you want the lower the chances of injury increase  

the chances of long-term result we're seeing it's  not a it's not a secret system of flexibility  

or strength this exercise or that exercise the  calf or the tibialis the quad or the hamstring  

you want it all you want all these things to  be to be strong and able to go through range  

of motion and be protected um yeah with the calves  people usually think of the muscle on the back of  

the knee so the gastrocnemius you've spoken a  lot about the tibialis anterior the muscle on  

the front of the Shins what is the importance  of this muscle and why should we train it yeah  

so every step forward that we take boom we're  loading into that tibialis muscle particularly  

if you're running and then you stop so if you're  a soccer player and you kick let's say with the  

right foot without realizing it boom tremendous  pressure going through that front tibialis to stop  

yourself so if you look at it the stronger that  is then the less excess pressure is even going  

to go into the knee in the first place so it's not  just the backward we also want that tibialis to be  

strong and because look even if someone does calf  raises the odds that people have done as much for  

the tibialis it's almost like um if someone's  doing pull-ups bench presses push-ups anything  

that builds Mass up above it means that you're  if you're not training the calf and the tibialis  

you are to whatever degree manufacturing a body  that is more likely to have foot pain ankle pain  

Achilles pain shin splints knee pain you can you  can manufacture shin splints by taking athlete  

building upper body mass and not training the  calf and the tibialis so I I went through all  

those things I I bulked up I was super skinny but  didn't do any of those things so then my body was  

completely out of balance what progressions  or key exercises for tibialis anterior would  

you recommend the one I just showed against the  wall farther you stand the harder it is just as  

it would be hard like just as if you went into a  light jump that would be easier than if you went  

all out into a jump so the farther it is you'll  notice it's harder to raise the toes 25 reps if  

you hit failure stand a little bit closer keep  going so this is this is a foundation that someone  

could definitely get strong with just the wall  tibialis race um there's now uh plenty of bars  

that people can buy if they want to load it but  I've seen a lot of like some of these guys who  

are some of the highest jumpers in the world  and they as far as the tibialis they just did  

the wall version the whole time and for people  that are concerned about ankle range of motion  

perhaps they want to squat deeply be able to get  their knees over their toes nice vertical posture  

from my experience and other people I've trained  as well that full range of motion calf training  

combined with tibialis anterior work seems to be  the perfect combination for permanently increasing  

ankle range of motion because people think oh my  ankles are tight and stiff I can't squat deep I'm  

just going to sit in a stretch passively and do it  it works temporarily but if they don't integrate  

it into full range of motion strength training  the results are very short lasting so by doing  

your straight leg calf work through a full range  of motion your tibialis anterior raises through  

the various progressions as Ben just outlined and  also integrating in that bent leg calf raise in  

the same fashion is the comprehensive approach  combined with patients for increasing that ankle  

range of motion yeah I mean if someone's doing  strength training and then they're only doing  

stretching for the ankle and not strength training  the ankle in its different ways it does make sense  

it's not natural for the body I'm only trying to  do things that if you look at it with common sense  

it makes sense with the anatomy that you're  going to be balancing the body so uh for someone  

who wants that that squat Mobility I don't even  think someone should arbitrarily be criticizing  

themselves if they don't have that squat Mobility  but if they want to improve it well we don't want  

all this weak down here so we would want the  tibialis to be strong so we don't get like when  

people have impingement issues they're usually  trying to force it but not strong here same with  

being strong on the lower calf and the upper calf  and it's pretty cool that like you can do that  

with just the wall boom 25 tip 25 straight leg  25 bent knee all scaling it and you can get good  

results for those areas have you found higher  repetitions a more beneficial protocol maybe  

only in the sense of just being a beginner at the  movement and doing body weight it's like a lot of  

25 reps yeah 25 reps allows you to really get the  volume in so it's kind of like a one to one to two  

sets of 25 reps two to three times times a week is  typically how we do the zero but that doesn't mean  

that there's not guys loading up on the tibialis  doing five sets of five it's not a when it comes  

to sets and Reps those are just variables I could  make a program of just High Reps or just Low Reps  

medium reps I think like across a week we use a  we use a variety of reps Tempo sets nice nice and  

my from my personal experience I'd like to hear  your thoughts Ben when it comes to calf training  

specifically Tempo is butchered at large people  go way too quick they rely on too much elasticity  

from their tendons and they don't actually  train the the muscle itself I've found a really  

controlled eccentric a pause at the Deep stretch  a fast concentric good contraction and a pause  

at the top to be a quite good Tempo what's your  thoughts on that yeah I think you've nailed it 100  

um one of my mentors Charles poliquin he said that  every gym it should be written in there it's not  

the load on the bar it's a load on the muscle and  so for the calf it's very easy with the calf in  

particular to kind of Bounce the weight but not  really be training it so like what you said a  

lot of people start seeing great uh results just  by slowing it down pausing going up Contracting  

for a moment at the top I agree totally The Hip  Flex the muscles uh I poorly understood muscle in  

mainstream Fitness what recommendations do you  have for train them yeah so in the in the body  

weight as you know just progressing people to an  l-sit I mean you can get pretty strong with with  

literally nothing and and that one scales nicely  like you can take um you can take people who are  

very weak and just have them sitting there just  working one side at a time feeling it contract I  

think the disconnect is not in the calisthenics  calisthenics Community tends to train the hip  

flexors but you go into the sports community and  this this thing grew up like oh don't strengthen  

your hip flexors because you don't want them  to get tight but exactly we can see with the  

with the with the full range of motion split  squat you can be loading those hip flexors  

um well like we like most of us in our system  we get either to a split or pretty close to a  

split without even really trying to do so just  from the training and we like in our gym we have  

cable machines set up specifically across from  immovable objects so that we lay on our backs we  

use straps to the cable on our feet and then  we're laying all the way back and having to  

drive the knees up so we have a standard of like  minimum 20 reps with half your body weight a lot  

of people can't eat yeah so we strength train the  hip flexors with measure below the fastest guys  

I've ever trained are like closer to be able to  lift their entire body weight on the cable for 20  

reps that's insane and I love the scalability of  that too because you're truly working on those hip  

flexor muscles without limitation we see people  that are doing hanging leg raises great exercise  

but you could argue that the grip's going to give  out and the hip flexors are a much larger muscle  

group than the forearms so I can see there's a  lot of thought and science into your system and  

it's clear why people are getting such strong hip  flexors with movements like that I appreciate that  

it's one of the biggest takeaways people have when  they visit like the gym in person and they do that  

hip flexor exercise hooked up on the cable because  like we're taking hip flexion to literal failure  

with measurable load um it's quite something  people are often sore for like the rest of  

the week almost like when you've almost like when  you've never trained an area and now you do like  

your first strength training session most people  have not really strength trained the hip flexors  

with overload and going to exhaustion like they  have other parts of the body what have you seen  

the measurable transfer of getting stronger hip  flexors into performance or exercises in the gym  

yeah so I started doing it because with the knee  people end up with pretty messed up hip issues  

often after a knee surgery things get really  tight things get weaker you stop spring oftentimes  

you're out for six months a year that you're not  sprinting so we would see like people after knee  

injuries would get really weak in the hip flexors  but we started to notice that the fastest people  

in the gym had like freakishly strong hip flexors  there are guys who had been Lifting for maybe 10  

straight years but weren't that fast and then  you see someone who's never lifted but it's  

like one of the fastest guys and they already  have much stronger hip flexors so we started to  

notice this speed correlation but realized that  the the hip flexor its job when you're running  

it's stretching back but then it's it's picking  up your leg so it's not that it's not that the  

hip flexor makes you run fast it's that if you're  training to be able to put Force into the ground  

if you're training the calves quads hamstrings  glutes the hip flexor is then a finishing touch  

that if it if it remains too weak you're not going  to be able to keep up with your own stride so it's  

like so the hip flexor is like a Finishing Touch  on speed it's something that naturally slow people  

often miss because they train everything to get  stronger oh their squacos up their deadlift goes  

up but they're top end speed doesn't change at  all sometimes top end speed gets slower over years  

of lifting weights but it's only because they've  manufactured that by getting stronger at certain  

muscles and then not training the hip flexors for  example and then for by that same measure of it  

giving you that that top end speed effect it's  actually amazing for elderly like elderly the  

hip flexors get so weak because they're not  sprinting anymore so that when when we stop  

sprinting the human body the hip flexors start to  go down think if you're growing up if you're a kid  

you're sprinting you're at least stimulating those  hip flexors pretty good but when we stop sprinting  

the hip flexors the nordics for the hamstring  those things that relate to that that high speed  

those start to go really fast so I think the hip  flexors is awesome for people as they get older  

too and women after having babies actually it's  uh it's one of the favorite exercises of women  

after babies because they get so weak in that  lower core area that was a great explanation on  

hip flexors because I feel that it still is an  area that's taboo people are afraid of training  

them because they have heard certain things from  physical therapists or other health professionals  

and I can see how that would relate to a better  function in life and Sprint performance I'll just  

speak to this as well from my personal experience  I'm someone because of doing calisthenics these  

very upper body dominant that's was a big Focus  for the first decade of my training and lower  

body always took a bit of a aside to to that main  focus I always felt like I had tight hip flexors  

and weak glutes I felt like I could never activate  my glutes and it just felt a little bit funny  

down there with you know squats and lunge-based  movements after doing movements such as the atg  

split squat through a full range of motion finally  stretching and strengthening that hip flexor in  

addition to other movements that we've popularized  such as the reverse Nordic couch stretch I was  

able to open up those hip flexors stretching  them and strengthening them and finally felt  

that I was able to use my glutes in every other  exercise and if people can just commit to this  

approach of targeting the hip flexors the feeling  that you have afterwards when you're moving your  

body through gait sprinting gym exercises it just  feels awesome and just that transformation for me  

personally was all the information I needed to to  be aware of hip flexor training man I'm so happy  

to hear that and for someone who's at home and  doesn't quite unders like isn't able to visualize  

what you were just talking about we'll do like a  demo so we've probably spent so much time sitting  

like we're that the the the hip flexors and then  the ability to use the muscles on the other side  

can get really limited so yeah if we're told don't  train your hip flexors if we never do a full range  

of motion split squat but now if we're loading  up in this position what happens as we open up  

like as this opens up and not by forcing it but  by over time getting stronger through here we're  

directly increasing how much we can then use  all this this backside area so we see if you  

want to really use your glutes and hamstrings we  want to open up what's on the front side of that  

so hopefully it helps someone to understand  what you were talking about just theirs is  

the more we're in this position we can't then  open up and use those glutes and hamstrings so  

opening up the hip flexors then those can work  as they're supposed to for sure and just trading  

the tibialis anterior the hip flexor these  other more Fringe muscle groups as you would  

every other exercise in your program you've got  sets reps intensity and you're progressing it I  

feel people lose motivation when it comes to  these things because they're not scaling the  

movements it's like oh yeah my hip flexors are  tight I'm just going to stretch them and they're  

just going in doing random stuff it's hard to  get motivated whereas if I'm like okay I'm doing  

it's you know eight kilos in each hand on my split  squat or I'm doing reverse nordics I'm touching  

the floor I've increased my range of motion these  are all signs and you can correlate symptoms with  

progression and that gives you all the motivation  you need to train we need that motivation we need  

that measurement there has to be a feeling  that we're accomplishing something that's why  

in calisthenics a lot of the upper body movements  it's easier to quickly you can quickly see your  

progress compared to when we get into something  like mobility and it's like uh I think I'm tight  

I don't know but now you start to measure out  a split squat okay I can do it a foot high  

eight inches high whatever or maybe you're outside  two steps down to one step or maybe I'm you go in  

a stairwell you're assisting yourself doing it on  two steps you gradually work down unassisted so it  

gets some measurement going in there and there's  no doubt over the last few years like it has sort  

of been a ripple effect and way more people are  doing this kind of stuff than previously by giving  

some measurement to Mobility if you will yeah  well said and it's that combination of rotting it  

down so you can track it objectively and matching  that up with the subjective feelings of how you're  

performing and moving and also film yourself  I would say that that is the best advice that  

I can give people because in the day-to-day week  to week month to month you're not going to see a  

tremendous amount of change in your flexibility  or strength and having that visual feedback  

is highly motivating because it's Universe  you you can say wow I was starting on this  

real regression and now I'm at this point because  we often tend to get this sense of dissatisfaction  

with our progress we don't think it's quick  enough we don't think it's enough and then by  

seeing yourself transform that is my biggest  advice I can give to people what are the most  

common reasons you've seen that people tend to  get injured I I would say in training it would be  

not understanding that you can scale anything so  like see you see something you just instantly try  

to go do that not realizing like it is somewhere  on a scale so people uh often think I can do  

this or like I can't do that exercise you see this  like it's like this in or out mentality oh my back  

can't do that so what's interesting when you see  that oh I hurt my back I can't do that exercise  

um usually by jumping in not building up to  it and believe it or not if they if they were  

actually to then start over the things they think  they can't do is what they actually probably need  

to be able to do to then not get hurt in life so  it's kind of like a two-part question like could  

my grandma yeah people are getting hurt in sport  and life because of the things they can't do like  

it's it's there's a lot of fears oh for the spine  don't do this don't do that for the knee no knees  

over toes so there's a lot of these don'ts the  don'ts are the the reason for injuries out in  

life not not just the being told not to but the  things people can't do like people's limitations  

your weak points that's your biggest vulnerability  then when you go play a sport this is why we see  

so much results with Oh I thought you weren't  supposed to train the knee over Excel oh  

oh now I'm actually getting stronger  at that position oh wow now I haven't  

been able to play basketball for so many  years without my knee hurting now when I  

play basketball the knee doesn't hurt but  think but think to this step down exercise  

it's very common that someone starts and they can  only do like three inches and any more causes pain  

like 40 things gonna happen when you then try to  go play a sport so so in the gym biggest reason  

for injury would be like trying to start right  here in life biggest reason for injury would  

be because you can't because you can't do this  without pain so maybe that would summarize it best  

working through working through pain biggest  reason for injury in the gym not building to being  

able to handle ability biggest reason for injury  in the sport and in life I'm so glad you mentioned  

that because the ability to handle these positions  requires work people see you doing these n-range  

progressions displays of mobility and strength  and they Wonder was he always like that could he  

do it from the beginning and they haven't seen the  year by year progression that you've done to your  

body to get to that stage of scalability because  had you jumped into that cold you could have got  

injured as well and I feel that that takeaway is  important for both performance and injury because  

then there's almost no exercises off limits when  regressed to a point where it can be handled  

that's right and I actually think that's when  my social media Pages started growing is when  

we would put out a video of like montages of like  starting at really low level like I thought in the  

early days almost that would be like too dorky and  boring and unimpressive but by showing by showing  

the scalability like I think that's when things  start to take off is when people realized oh I  

can I can scale that quality so we've done I would  say for the last three years now just um almost on  

a weekly basis like pretty extensively showing not  just a split squat but a split squat elevated with  

assistance not just a step up but at a low level  assisted backward walking these kind of things um  

I I think that's actually like we we tracked the  stats and stuff that actually grew things way more  

than just showing a feat of what the knees can  do because it's reliable because people say the  

end stage and they can admire it be motivated by  it but they don't know if it's actually realistic  

whereas they see something that's challenging  but within the Realms of what they could work  

up to relatable and engaging yeah yeah and that's  why I see like in in body weight training you see  

a lot of success when coaches show um their  clients like really just step by step how to  

get there like it's it's phenomenal to see it and  then travel it but for sure on the mobility joint  

protection side I think that was like a much less  understood area that it it still breaks down to  

scalability just as a good coach is going to feel  confident to help someone do a chin up I'm going  

to feel confident to make the knee more protected  for sport or whatever it is yeah yeah and people  

should have confidence knowing that even though  they're not doing the end stage just say you can't  

do a body weight pull up yet and you're working  on band stuff or negatives you are still getting  

the same benefits and changes to your body as  someone that's doing the advanced movement so  

once you can humble yourself understand accept and  embrace the process of starting at the regression  

with something that you can manage you'll see  progress you'll transform you'll get all the  

changes to your body and that's that's a key key  takeaway what advice would you have for people  

who are returning from an injury so returning from  an injury I like to think of it you might think oh  

um we get you back to sport in four months versus  eight months in the system no no like I actually  

do the opposite I I would say look if you already  like had an intro in that sport take your time and  

get to the point where you have like more ability  than you had then so something like like a Nordic  

hamstring curl be able to own yourself better  than you could before the injury happened the  

step up so I'm not looking for like how quickly  can we reach certain bass lines to return to  

sport like why is life's not worth living that  way like don't take it so seriously don't take  

rushing back to sports so seriously try to build  beyond the level of abilities you had even before  

injury and then you you might completely change  the trajectory of the rest of the career or sport  

even if it's just for like recreational enjoyment  you can enjoy it at a whole different level how  

about the mindset because you'd be dealing with  a lot of people who have reached huts and they've  

had certain strength muscularity range of motion  and to be injured requires a different approach  

and it's very normal for people to feel a bit  depressed and find the journey quite arduous what  

what mentality do you advise to people yeah the  journey is tough I've learned this with so many  

athletes coming to me the journey is tough when  you're injured in that recovery period you have  

a huge opportunity to change your knowledge think  of the videos on your channel and my channel when  

you're doing well and you're you're playing good  and stuff like you might not really have the time  

for that when you're injured you now have a unique  opportunity to completely level up your knowledge  

I think that's the only thing that can really keep  you going because if you're just in the injury it  

takes certain injuries take recovery time think of  a broken bone or I mean there's so many different  

injuries and that is that it is a depressing state  by Nature you're not able to be active and do the  

things you want to do so that's your chance to  level up your knowledge make sure that you come  

out of the injury with way more knowledge than  you had before and then before going back into  

the sport make sure you have way more ability than  you had before because if you're just getting back  

to the same baselines you had before I remember  with my knees I was kind of terrified because  

even in rehab I was only getting up to the level  I had before and the level I had before wasn't  

enough to protect me so it's like it was pretty  terrible fine um but then as I start once I got  

like way more abilities like oh wow I couldn't  do that before with my knee now I can do that in  

training that doesn't hurt then it was like oh wow  this is feeling different on the court and at that  

point screw it you know go for it and have fun  yeah you really do have to say it as a blessing  

in some way otherwise you'll just feel mopey  Moody and you'll you'll stagnate and you might  

even make the same mistakes once again and I've  realized from my own injuries in the past whether  

it's overuse from tendonitis tendinopathy in the  elbows it it absolutely forces you to take stock  

of what you're doing maybe I'm my volumes too  much my frequencies too much my excellent exercise  

selection isn't optimal and you come out of it  better because I don't think anyone watching or  

listening lacks motivation I think we have quite  driven audiences that that want to improve and  

that can also be to your detriment so an injury  from my experience and seeing other people is  

a Shining Light if you're willing to as you said  learn from it and direct your energy to optimizing  

areas that weren't I know for myself I improved my  sleep and Recovery I started tweaking my nutrition  

when I was Upper Limb injury I could focus on  learning all this stuff about legs so there's  

there's always something that you can do after  you overcome that initial grief that you should  

feel when you when you do get injured and move on  this episode is sponsored by Fitness FAQs become  

a body weight Beast with our cow snakes workouts  use the coupon code podcast 10 at checkout to save  

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enjoy the gains for the lower back this is an area  that can have issues for some people whether they  

have acute pain or chronic pain when it comes to  bulletproofing the back how can we go about this  

all right I've been working at this one a lot  because of people doing the knee ability zero  

and then saying that it fixed their chronic back  issues so I've worked with them in person Tracked  

Down the clues and here's the best I've got for  the back it won't be as smooth but we're getting  

somewhere with this first off the back seems to  be really mysterious for people like it'll it'll  

get injured in such random times that it's so  mysterious of why they hurt the back theory on  

that is that the back is right here so let's say  let's say the hip flexor is shortened all right  

that's one strike against you now let's say  uh you grew up playing a sport where you're  

always turning a certain way you might have a  total imbalance in the ql the ql is a muscle  

that attaches it's it's deep it's like one of  the deepest muscles by the lower spine so you  

may have an imbalance you might not even see it  you may have a strength in mobility and balance  

in one side tight hip flexors then add in you  know uh that that mid spine up here is often  

pulled forward all the sitting people who sit more  have a spine that they can't extend as much so  

you have all these things now fast forward all the  way to sometimes I'll see like an old lady get up  

they're sitting down and they get up and they walk  out and it's like oh that's why the back is such  

a problem for I mean it's literally it's like this  Center bursting point of the body so we're already  

starting with the center bursting point so even  if you were doing the best supplements to reduce  

inflammation or whatever and getting injections  into the back and and even exercises for the back  

the number one exercise the the top exercise so  even if you think you're doing everything right  

for the back but if everything around it is jacked  up and out of the Natural Balance like your back  

is taking more of a beating to begin with so the  average the average human walking out and about  

simply has a back that has more stress on it  than it's supposed to have so so let's go over  

this Foundation lengthening the hip flexor so  split squat is there we then do a seated good  

morning exercise so we're using loads to stretch  into the adductors think like like children have  

that the crazy addict or Mobility so now as  those addicts are stiffen up that means like  

in life if you even go to squat down split squats  tight seated good morning is tight more pressure  

on the back so you see someone you see someone  squat like this that is directly opening up the  

adductors with the seated good morning plus the  split squat the and the ankle work that equals  

like well now I could I could pick up that item  without being in this position so you start there  

with hip flexors of the full range split squat  open up the adductors with seated good morning  

you can progress dumbbells someone may need a  bar to stretch even more now you get up and you  

have you have the lower abs so we we think hip  flexors like we don't want to just be strong in  

a six-pack and weaken the lower ab and then we  do exercises we get on the the back extension we  

we lift weights to stretch the ql that's one  that people often get really sore on or have  

differences between sides so we train the ql and  we do then train the ability notice with the seat  

of good morning I'm trying not to round the back  so see a good morning is is how good is everything  

below the back so the back doesn't have to round  then we do exercises where we now are trying to  

round the back so we want to we want to have in  moderation ability with the back rounded so so  

far we've done hip flexors adductors meaning we've  done what's under the back then we did low AB ql  

low backs we did what's around the back and then  we finish with we now have we have the upper back  

we have that that thoracic spine so the ability  of the back to go that way and to be strong  

in that position so for people that are listening  and watching I'm just watching Ben uh explain  

everything while doing a full back bridge and  it's fantastic thank you so so there's eight  

things that's our like I just showed you our  back program there's our back ability program  

because we're addressing all these things that  would relate to the back so only one of those  

eight was the lower back so that's I think that's  why the back oven doesn't solve because it's the  

center point of the body so every single thing  that's connecting to the back it's even more  

variables than the knee like the knee okay we also  do the Nordic the tibialis the calves so there's  

some variables with the back if there's even more  variables than the a little bit more variables  

it's that whole idea of not just looking at the  lower back as the main cause and the main thing  

to fix it's looking at the body as a kinetic  chain which I feel you've just outlined in a  

really excellent way of looking okay what's around  the lower back we've got the core muscles we've  

got the hip flexors we have the uh lower back  itself to address as a final piece but there's so  

many things you can look at trying to improve and  address before even going to the most obvious one  

with the sated good morning why are we doing  that for adductors instead of say standing  

well I think I think um say a standing  good morning I think it's totally fine  

standing good morning I think would go in a  category of back exercises seated good morning  

the reasons I like this one is that number one you  could start with dumbbell so it's like it's easier  

to start grooving in and start training the back  we're just starting from a stand like starting  

from a standing good morning position you're going  to experience like a lot of force on the back even  

just to get into it so I've seen I've seen more  injury with the standing good morning to see a  

good morning it doesn't mean that standing where  is not a fantastic exercise it also stretches  

the hamstring but the seat of good morning we can  start with dumbbells and it's easier to find other  

tools to strengthen the hamstrings through stretch  positions it's harder to find tools to strengthen  

those adductors through stretch positions so with  this we can accomplish two and one and it's just  

a bit more foundational so if you look at like  if you look at the Torso and the thigh this is  

the closest like that the Torso and the thigh come  together so we're strengthening the back it's what  

we've seen is like you get stronger on a c good  morning stronger more mobile like you get better  

in that position than every other position out  from that gets easier so a c to good morning we  

then see a nice carryover if someone then like for  even stronger back and stronger hamstrings like  

standing good morning will be fine in our system  we would use Romanian deadlift because again we  

could kind of start with dumbbells easier and get  into it so we would use a seated good morning and  

a standing Romanian deadlift to accomplish  those purposes but it doesn't mean that like  

like I love the standing good morning I think  the standing good morning is awesome but you  

all you will notice a difference between standing  good morning and Romanian deadlift where you feel  

it more in the hamstring and then with the seated  good morning you'll feel it more in the adductors  

and it all comes back to once again no right  or wrong exercises it's down to scalability  

regressions and progressions and I say that the  sated good morning as a great exercise because  

you've constrained the movement pattern there's a  little bit less skill a little bit less complexity  

and coordination because you're glutes are fixed  you're seated it allows you to set your shin angle  

and then move as a fulcrum from the back there  there's just a little bit less room for error  

as an initial starting point because we're having  this discussion about the lower back people that  

have low back pain problems or weakness tend to  not have the best movement strategies by default  

so starting with that seated good morning seems  like a really sound choice I love when something  

like the tibialis race you can just start against  the wall unfortunately some movements take a bit  

more equipment than others but I will show you  like a lot of gyms thank you sir a lot of gyms  

have a a bench that inclines so I want to show  you I was training like a really tall athlete  

one time and super stiff in the adductors  and working on CD good morning I was like  

sometimes with the regression you're almost like  is it okay to regress that law and so it's like  

wait like so I had him so like holding holding  dumbbells we'd put the bench 45 degree and he  

just started here so start the bench for like  what do you have to lose if you do this like  

we do it twice a week in the back program like  what do you have to lose if you just take your  

time and six weeks from now try like there's  you have nothing to lose by just starting a bit  

more regress so take dumbbells you're feeling  the stretch then as you get a little bit more  

mobile now you can go down to 30 degree you'll  notice based on this angle my ankle is just in  

front of the knee that tends to make sure that  you're not like trying to with this one you're  

actually trying to lock in the stretch on the  posterior and the adductor so we go ankle just  

in front of me so ankle just in front of me and  your truck your intent is actually getting the  

abdomen to the bench not rounding the chest to  the bench so you're here feeling that stretch  

okay 30 degree then 15 degree so even getting if  you're a taller person even getting to 15 degrees  

is phenomenal because your leg is in a tougher  position so guys who are six seven six eight  

whatever they're I'm like this is phenomenal if  they can even get to 15 degrees and then someone  

more moderate height then maybe maybe they could  get down like to flat bench without rounding the  

spine so if you think see to good morning flat  bench bar on back well you could start that at  

45 degrees with dumbbells in your hands and be  building up all these areas and tissues but yeah  

like it comes back to movement quality as well  because you could get someone that's really tall  

wake or lacks flexibility and I could get quite  deep range in a state of good morning but they're  

not using the right movement strategy they're  bending so much from the lumbar spine which  

isn't the purpose of the movement your whole idea  here is don't be ashamed to regress it to a point  

where you can use that proper hinging motion and  a upright posture now you spoke about the core  

traditionally people think of the anterior ABS  or the back extensors you were talking about the  

ql slash oblique area why is this important for  the lower back there you have so you have these  

muscles on either side of the spine quadratus  lumborum so it's like a quad think like four-sided  

so it's like these blocky muscles one on either  side of your spine and so when your body goes  

this way that muscle stretches and when it goes  this way it contracts most of us have grown up  

playing a sport where we were without realizing  it working one side differently than the other so  

you think baseball throwing kicking so it could  be imbalanced it's also just a thing that in  

the body if we're doing all these rigid motions  building squats deadlifts things of that nature  

and not training that muscle so okay if we're  if we're if the ABS are getting stronger if the  

lower back muscles are getting stronger but now  if those qls are not getting stronger it's just  

creating an imbalance so it may seem tedious to do  something like that it's not like I force that in  

every program but if someone is trying to overcome  something with the back it's an important Stone to  

overturn because it's right there it's probably  really weak when people start doing it they often  

get that that newbie soreness as if they've  never trained it I think it works pretty well  

like the version where you hold something in your  hand and you twist I like to have people reach as  

high as they can to make sure they're really like  stretching here so if the weight was in this hand  

they're reaching as high as they can oftentimes a  right hand in person doesn't realize they're like  

two inches shorter reach with the left arm so just  from a lifetime of like if it's basketball most  

basketball players can't reach as high with the  with the left arm and so you load it and you start  

you start strengthening so you would go from here  reach so you could start this with just a dumbbell  

you then get on a 45 degree back extension machine  and you really feel it in there so we like um like  

for my mom we would set up the 45 degree back  extension machine and then we set up the bench  

there so she can actually like put the hands until  she can handle her own body weight so you still  

have this scalability some of these things though  like you walk into a gym machine scale but like  

Mobility where's the mobility machine like there's  not there's not like scalable Mobility equipment  

so some of the stuff you do have to get a bit  inventive but once you get the hang of it uh then  

it's not too bad so we can play around with range  of motion we can increase weight is there anything  

else you'd recommend concerning core training to  keep it fun or make it even more effective I mean  

the the most consistent weak points I find in  in the core are the qls those ones on the side  

and then like the lower ab hip flexor area and  some people say oh you can't isolate the low AB  

or something I don't think with any exercise I'm  trying to isolate anything I'm trying to be strong  

everywhere but when you start resisting from the  feet for your your core training like something  

like that low cable exercise we do um people end  up sore in the lower abdomen for like days after  

so okay so you're playing around with different  resistance methods whether using external weights  

or body weight to do the same type of movement pen  yeah I mean if someone's never done hanging leg  

raises before or something and they do a bunch of  reps they might notice that they might be sore in  

some of the lower ab area we definitely notice  that when we're lying on our backs holding on  

to something hooked up to a cable and and having  to drive both the knees to the chest you really  

feeling that lower so it's almost like the most  common weak point is from the belly button Below  

in the in the abdomen area below the belly button  and in those qls and I'm trying to do even though  

it seems like a lot of things I'm still trying to  keep it as few as I can so like what I explained  

there with the eight different exercises um  relating to the back like that is that is what  

we do for the core like someone could add more if  they want to but I don't force more than that I'm  

really glad you mentioned that point there  because people will hear this chat they'll  

hear your enthusiasm and energy you're spitting  all these facts and lots of different exercises  

but it's not actually a lot when you think  about it because you're saying regressions and  

progressions for a movement so all those seated  good morning movements are hinges so it's not as  

if you're randomly doing some different exercise  you've got a goal for an area of the body you're  

choosing an exercise which suits that based on  your level goals Etc and going with that I really  

am glad you mentioned that because I feel a lot of  people get insecure with how many exercise options  

there are and variation and changing things all  the time you're not doing that you're progressing  

a movement pattern and that's why you're seeing  growth I appreciate that yeah I personally and  

do the same movements year after year um lots of  intention on them and then I think for someone  

else out there who has other movements they like  to do if you explore them learn them keep what  

you know keep what you like in your routine reject  what you don't it's not like someone has to start  

doing all of them maybe someone for example  uses the seated good morning to enhance let's  

say they like deep squatting with a barbell to  see the good morning could enhance that Mobility  

at which point the simply by squatting they would  probably then maintain whatever Mobility they had  

gained from the seat of good morning so it's not  like you have to do every single movement forever  

I've kind of fallen in love with just being able  to play basketball and not have aches and pains  

and be athletic and so almost all my training like  the things I've described for me are not accessory  

like that this is my exercise like all the things  I described is how I burn the calories one little  

difference is we start every workout with Sleds on  the turf and over our weekly volume we do at least  

as much backward as like you walk in the gym the  first thing is sledding every session why because  

the moment you start to lean against the sled  the sled will move so regardless of someone's  

Fitness level overweight this that the other we  can get them sledding we can get any age sledding  

if someone thinks they can't even sled they can  usually hold on and start spinning like if someone  

if someone didn't think they could walk backward  with a sled just from the like the balance of it  

like someone in their 70s 80s they can get on the  the treadmill hold on and then they find they can  

start to like they can actually start to get a  burn in those muscles but and with the forward  

sled and like anyone can do it because literally  you start to lean on it so actually if someone's  

overweight the sled is easier because of their  weight and every other cardio method go for a run  

and then your knee hurts and you look up on Google  and it's like what do I do about knee pain the  

only thing Google says you can do is lose weight  but then like wait a second I hurt my knees trying  

to lose weight so the sled is cool and it's like  like everyone can win on the sled also every step  

whether forward or backward you're pushing through  your toes so most people have much weaker feet and  

ankles they haven't gone all right if you went to  the gym and you did a bodybuilders leg day let's  

say you did squat leg press leg extension leg curl  uh you just did you didn't load through your feet  

through any of those things so the moment you're  pushing a sled forward or going backward with it  

you're strengthening through the feet so we find  the feet make soap so many people overcome plantar  

fasciitis and heel pains and big toe pains and  chronic foot pains because of the sledding you  

also end up getting cardio you get conditioning  effect you get the knee rehab effect of going  

backward so in a single movement we're able to  gently get so much circulation going and with that  

crazy amount of circulation we now see smoother  results from getting into the mobilizing so the  

first thing we do is sled and that does add to the  overall Fitness effect it does make it easier for  

me the rest of my training I can be focusing on  these detailed uh movements and abilities I want  

my body to have I don't have to do as much like  General cardio and general strengthening because  

the legs the lungs get the legs and lungs both  get like really unbelievable off all the sledding  

I can see all those benefits of backwards walking  and the sledding in particular thanks to the the  

bracing and stability which allows you to really  get that terminal knee extension all those foot  

benefits you've just described what about  the people that lack equipment that don't  

have anything fancy mate can they still get these  benefits on a treadmill then number one question  

what do I do without a sled that was the original  impetus behind 25 tibialis race 25 scales one or  

two legs straight leg calf raise 25 scales  one or two leg bent knee calf raise we see a  

tremendous amount of foot and ankle strengthening  tremendous amount of circulation particularly if  

you have somewhere that you can be backward  walking or running or dragging something or  

using like this is this is much cheaper than a  treadmill because this doesn't have electricity  

but if you are at a hotel gym or any gym with  a treadmill you can often go up to it not turn  

it on it may have a little bit of resistance and  so you could now go we find like if you go five  

minutes of that resistance like a lot of people  have fixed chronic knee pain off just their the  

basic treadmill that's there not turning it on  spinning the belt backward for five minutes so  

those would be the most common Solutions is okay  you don't have a sled use the treadmill not turned  

on spin it backward five minutes do your your  first three exercises for the ankle you're now  

improving at those qualities that you would get  from a sled fantastic thanks for outlining that  

no equipment minimalist approach I really like  having options where anyone can do it regardless  

of age uh being able to afford certain things or  just access to a facility but the concern that I  

can see people thinking is won't that ruin my  treadmill if I have the the power off is that  

a common thing you get to well hopefully by  this point explaining everything I know about  

everything with nothing held back hopefully by  this point people will understand the context you  

can see like this is lightweight it has variable  resistance it folds up like that's why eventually  

it's like we literally have to make a solution  for it so this is it's not thousands of dollars  

it's hundreds of dollars to make and I'm sure the  price will come down as time goes so the variable  

resistance I mean you can crank this to where like  to where like you can oh like barely move it like  

this like this is intense amount of resistance  but then you can also go lighter to where like  

grandmas are coming in and totally winning on this  backward treadmill and it's way cheaper than one  

with electricity because yeah like the ones with  electricity sometimes the gym owners are pissed  

um because I guess if you spin it backward  when it's not turned on it can mess it up so  

my my answer used to be look I'm for the human  not the machine I'd rather I'd rather break a  

treadmill and IT service is someone to train  their knees you could even go on Craigslist  

you might find a broken treadmill so I used to  like go on Craigslist and I would just find for  

home like a treadmill that no longer works and I  would use that um but eventually it's like it is  

the number one question by far many gyms do  have sleds uh some treadmill some gym owners  

will use the treadmill but think about even from  home uh it's like it's the number one barrier is  

not having a sled or some method of doing that  so honestly I think depending on when someone  

sees this like if someone sees this a year after  we release it I'll bet like a dozen companies  

are making something like this by that point just  an affordable no electricity as cheap as you can  

make it internal resistance backward treadmill  so you can get backward sledding from anywhere  

so upper back stiffness in the thoracic spine  is a really common problem what have you found  

the most effective ways for increasing range of  motion in that area so I love um I love holding  

a dumbbell and working on a pullover where you're  using the bench as sort of a to create a tug point  

between the hip and and the shoulder now a lot  of people um feel uncomfortable in that position  

like they feel they feel unstable and by a lot  I mean I'd say the majority of people still have  

no issue with it but I'll even even 10 is still  a lot of people so I love a dumbbell pullover  

um someone at really low levels could just get  in against a wall and actually just start like  

building up like literally just working out of  that position you can get in on a cable machine a  

cable machine to get into like a standing pullover  can feel a lot better but ultimately I'm trying to  

progress people into being able to do a dumbbell  pullover quite frankly I want to study that one  

more in terms of calisthenics on getting into  a bridge because I think to understand that  

more Philly I think if someone looks at every  regression option for example we can get people  

um with the pullover we've seen that we can get  people they often will feel more comfortable here  

like here they can they can conference bench yeah  so they can they can often get into it better that  

way than just going cross bed so in line with  bench is going to be less tough like less uh  

intense than cross bench cross bench will be more  intense like I want people to to wind up where  

they feel comfortable working on a bridge but I  don't I haven't put the time into that one like  

I have in Denise so I think to fully understand it  like with knees how I understand like the machine  

side the free weight side the body weight side I  think I need to understand the body weight side  

better do you have any tips on that I'd be happy  to jump in because I invested a ton of time into  

improving the back bridge because with with  calisthenics we tend to get quite Catholic  

through the thoracic we're doing a ton of vertical  pull-ups we're doing a lot of rows that the lats  

get so tight and they really pull us pull us down  we don't get as much spine extension so I've also  

found the pullover movement phenomenal and I'm  glad that you've you phrased that point the key  

thing is comfort as you said because by nature  of us being steer for weak through that thoracic  

we're going to be quite apprehensive well there's  normal to feel a lot of like breath holding  

limited range when we're moving and I've found  that getting the right shoulder set up is key  

so sometimes dumbbell is too narrow of a grip for  holding overhead especially in bigger guys such as  

myself I'm six foot tall and quite wider shoulders  so I've found that using a dowel or a stick with  

a weight in the middle allows me to choose a  comfortable grip to actually get enough range  

of motion and weight going backwards so I'm I'm  all for the way to pull over with external weight  

as a gentle way to to open up and the progression  I try and get people on Ace up is actually a body  

weight pullover so if you can picture this you've  got the same setup on the bench as a fulcrum for  

your spine you've got your hands fixed behind you  on something like a Smith machine or a barbell in  

a rack so that the hands aren't moving they're  fixed overhead and you're doing the pull over  

motion by letting your hips and lumbar spine  Arch so you're getting that Global extension  

through the thoracic and the way I like to scale  this Bend is for beginners doing isometrics is  

really safe so you're in the position it's it's  deep but it's tolerable you do it for a set of  

say 15 to 30 seconds you're yielding a bit deeper  with each breath not going so far that you can't  

pull out and that's that's the starting point  over time you're doing reps where you're going  

deep and deep into range of motion and this ties  in everything we've said with the lower body where  

stretching what's tight strengthening what's weak  and doing that through a full range of motion yep  

beautiful I'm going to work on that one um and  yeah I mean for me like basketball is my sport  

pullover's my favorite upper body exercise it  gives me the it gives me like for for jumping  

like we for jumping we want upper body Mobility we  want to be able to move the shoulders very easily  

so so so pullovers and like body weight training  like being proficient at dips and chins is kind  

of The Sweet Spot I find for someone who wants  to be in like like maximum speed and jumping is  

Matt is trying to master your body weight and  and also having that pullover for the mobility  

100 and tying this in with something more  local to the spine itself and the erector  

muscles would be just something standard like a  a back bent like a standing backbend you would  

be surprised how challenging this is for  the anterior core so as you're stretching  

and strengthening through those anterior abs  and also your spinal Erectors they're not used  

to extending the back to that deep range of  motion so by doing a combination of pullovers  

whether body weight or with a external weight  dumbbells Etc plus standing extensions that is  

the two-fold approach I found for really getting  uh thoracic extension on point and as you've said  

throughout this podcast Ben it's not not a ton  of exercise there's there's two movements it's  

just regress to progress be consistent and  apply a normal strength training principles  

and actually I nearly forgot um so anywhere in  the in the 35 range where 30 to 45 range wherever  

is comfortable or even on a back extension  machine and just holding the body straight  

um we do pullovers in conjunction with  training the opposite of a pullover so yeah so  

imagine I should have for the demo I should  have had dumbbells out here but if you imagine  

having dumbbells you want to grab a couple so  it might not seem like much but if you if you  

use at least 10 of what your body weighs and then  you're actually trying to hold your arms straight  

and control it down someone could start as light  as they want you could start with just your arms  

and actually fighting the the eccentrics you're  you're getting yourself the traditional exercise  

is you're raising like this but most people will  feel limited through the shoulder that they can't  

really engage you're actually trying to train  those lower traps but if you get yourself if you  

so if you do it as eccentric training if you get  yourself into position and then fight fight fight  

fight fight fight you can get super strong between  uh right there that those lower track so it's not  

exactly lower back and it's not actually like  scapular retractors it's it's that right there  

it's your actual lower trap so when we do when  we do pull over we do it always in superset with  

that trap 3 race meaning uh the like you have  the Trap muscles here you have three rows of  

traps that third row is the one right above so we  wanna we wanna not just stretch with the pullover  

we then want to be super strong on the other  side so we do and we've seen that doing it as  

eccentric training people often then really feel  it working so think like think like five reps but  

five seconds down on each rep something like that  they can often feel more than just like a set of  

ten or something and trying to raise the arms not  that that wouldn't work but when you get yourself  

into position and then you're fighting fighting  fighting you can often feel it love it that's  

that whole Agonist antagonist approach where  he's comprehensive from both sides of the body  

and just supersetting it is a great way to Mac  H subsequent set feel better I'm sure that you  

found that when you do a trap raise eccentric  with a pullover as you get to that second or  

third set that's when you truly get your full  range lack of apprehension everything's firing  

correctly and I'm really happy that you mentioned  that two-sided approach to training because if you  

just do one you're missing out an important piece  of the puzzle yep yeah it's not an either or it's  

not strength or stretch and it's not one side of  the body or the other so that's a little detail  

it's taken us a while from like really working  with people to find that the pullover when you  

then do the opposite and you're actually trying  to be strong that way not just strong that way but  

strong that way it seems to go really smoothly and  this is the complexity of training which keeps us  

always trying to find out what's optimal even  though that's something it's like a dragon you're  

trying to chase you'll never get there but people  will always have one area that needs more work  

than the other it's not often where someone needs  to do pullovers and trap raises to the exact same  

extent you'll find that if you put more work into  one it's going to improve your body as a whole so  

just keep that in mind the the main takeaway here  is unfortunately the thing that you're weak at the  

thing that feels the most uncomfortable it's  going to have generally the biggest impact on  

your your body as a result and that's the thing  that the probably the majority of people haven't  

realized how much magic there is an exercise there  that the the things that they feel they can't do  

is actually like where they have the most room to  gain and so maybe you know maybe eight maybe eight  

different things for the lower back seems like a  lot but if you balance that out over a schedule  

and if you weigh the fact that many people are  saving tens of thousands of dollars on physical  

therapy not to mention surgeries like if you add  up some people are taking a dozen supplements and  

seeing this person on this day so so the level of  complexity to me it's cool that with the exercise  

you're trying to create a body that is actually  built to have less chance of pain and issue like  

to me that's cool that's like that's exponential  investment so that's what I see is that the  

time on these Concepts that we're covering is is  literally I think of it like investing in the body  

it gets easier it gets easier and easier over it's  so easy for me now to maintain all these different  

abilities yes um yes exactly and it's the idea of  being proactive and seeing those first signs of  

success or winning is what matters so much because  the instant approach is taking a drug or seeing  

someone to to fix your body but once you get that  affirmation in yourself that you have the ability  

to transform your own body through exercise alone  wow that's powerful stuff and it's just a matter  

of educating yourself and having the discipline  to do the work I found a very similar finding  

with the side splits I spent a couple years  trying to increase my range of motion doing  

the side splits doing all the stuff around it such  as horse stance and Butterfly stretch to open up  

the groin once you build that base and you're  doing exercises that involve the adductors you  

can just pop into a cult and without even having  to go into the side splits itself so just drilling  

this home that although this stuff to some people  might seem a little bit unusual unconventional and  

it seems like a lot of work which which it is I  mean it's easier to just go to the gym jump on a  

machine pump out exercises on various different  things and call it a day but by transforming  

your body that hard work doesn't require much to  maintain you through life yeah that's amazing and  

even to give someone some optimism on that quite  literally close to a hundred years ago they were  

making machines in gyms that that were rounded and  so you would get in and it would actually like you  

would unwind the spine so just because the machine  culture has built up a certain way and makes it  

very easy to train strength but tougher to train  Mobility it there's actually like there's actually  

a bright future for these things um I think over  the next decade we'll see where where people who  

it seems like these concepts are tough to get into  where they actually could go get into a machine  

and start working on strength through stretch  positions let's talk a little bit about shoulder  

strengths what rotator cuff or scapular exercises  have you found most effective for upper body yeah  

so our foundational one you can do it sitting on  a bench or sitting on the floor the elbow rests  

on the vast medialis everything in the body is  trying to be like a statue as you rotate down and  

then you're rotating up by facing that leg it's  much tougher than as you turn the body this way  

I actually like all of those positions so we start  here and as you start to get to failure to do it  

facing your arm you turn a little bit and then a  little bit as the set goes so in one mechanical  

drop set you can get really strong in the external  rotators most people the external rotators  

um are a weak point like in the upper body so we  try to make people really really strong in those  

external rotators a dumbbell is is great I think  a dumbbell is all you need to get really strong  

external rotators there's there's further stuff  that people could do but once someone realizes  

that there's no wrong position in the external  rotation and that you could start you can go from  

here and as you hit failure gradually turn working  through that full uh little you know rotation  

there I find builds them well we could discuss  and debate different external rotation exercises  

until the cows come home some people say dumbbells  aren't effective you should use machines don't use  

bands because the resistance profile the takeaway  is training the external rotators is an important  

aspect what have you found the benefits of doing  external rotation is for upper body strength or  

flexibility well I got into it because uh with  myself from in my position in basketball I was  

trying to be really good at passing the ball and  I would pass against a wall like as hard as I  

could over and over and I wound up with shoulder  tendonitis I found external rotation was all I  

needed to get rid of the shoulder 10 ice that was  it now then working with baseball players just his  

knees were like ruining my life I started working  with some baseball players that shoulders were  

ruining their lives and having overcome my knees  I'm like okay it's similar principles here and so  

between external rotation and then I was showing  that trap 3 race that that we were looking at  

I mean even with those two alone and you could add  more to that you're getting a lot of the opposite  

of throwing a baseball so throwing is one of the  most shoulder surgery producing activities so it's  

almost like a math equation of how strong are you  in Reverse of the the impact they're putting into  

the shoulder so it what I find usually with the  shoulder is a gross underestimation of how strong  

you need to be and how strong you could get in  the opposite of your throwing motion or whatever  

whatever motion is hurting in the opposite of that  so the external rotation the Trap three Rays there  

almost never trained growing up in when you start  lifting weights and things like that so again  

it's it's sort of by looking just at the main  bodybuilding exercises you could be manufacturing  

imbalances of your ability to actually hold your  shoulder in place or Express things without your  

shoulder being in pain so those are are the  big two and and someone could do more but  

again fundamentally you made me think of this  a couple times the stuff you're saying like I  

I don't believe in any wrong exercise so those  are ones I found to work well but you're never  

going to catch me in the debates of you're never  going to see a video says don't do this or don't  

do that look it's all exercise and the more I  learn about it the more I come to understand that  

you can use exercise to balance the body  so it's almost like you want to be you want  

to be capable everywhere that's to me that's  the secret is to realize that it's not about  

debating things it's about having no weak or tight  links that's one of the main principles I've taken  

away from speaking to you is this idea of moving  towards balance training both sides trying to  

adjust address weak links as we know tons of up  body exercises are internal rotation internal  

rotation push-ups bench press pulling movements  it's notoriously very dominant our daily postures  

internally rotated although there's not a ton  of research saying that yes external rotation  

is the is the cure-all if you do that you'll never  have problems it's just diversifying what you're  

doing and just making sure that you've got a  comprehensive body so it makes sense to train  

the external rotators on the back of that rotator  cuff for that very reason and I've just found  

from working with overhead athletes or people  working on overhead press handstand push-ups  

the rotator cuff particularly the external  rotators are a dynamic stabilizer of the  

shoulder when we're doing these movements  overhead we can keep grinding away at the  

compound lifts and that's a good  way to get stronger and improve but  

Time and Time Again by just doing some rotator  cuff work through external rotation improves the  

structural integrity and balance of your shoulder  and it just allows you to achieve your greater  

potential or your strength potential because  we know that the body is very smart it tries  

to protect us from Pain and injury and it does  that by reducing Force so by working on that I've  

found time and time again people's overhead press  improves the handstand push-ups improve because  

they're more stable and their body doesn't have  apprehension so it's able to produce more Force  

yeah there it's so fun when when you find some  of these things and you experience that and it's  

like that it is one it's like it's kind of like a  cheat code in the upper body of being able to push  

yourself and make upper body improvements without  breakdown is being really strong in those external  

rotators another one if someone um so so we do  that one we also imagine if you're sitting across  

from a cable machine we we hold a rope and as we  as we bring it in um we not only pull it back we  

rip the Rope apart so I'm actually trying to get  uh like the the metal part of the of the Rope on a  

Facebook like all the way to the upper neck right  there so so some people they'll they'll even think  

at first they'll be like oh I don't go that far  but if you lighten the load all of a sudden those  

those everything starts working areas they haven't  really worked and they can get that far so we use  

a few measurements the external rotation trying  to have trying to be able to handle a minimum  

of 10 of your body weight strictly on external  rotation is a minimum and then we actually get  

people like we see for uh really athletic guys  they're actually handling half body weight no  

problem ripping that rope apart on a Facebook then  you see often the guys who've been working out but  

have shoulder pains like the non-natural freak  athlete who's been working out really hard often  

is like super weak and tight on a on a measurable  face pull like that so some people enjoy the face  

pull because it's a bit less tedious than the  dumbbell having to do one side at a time we we  

do both for good measure but yes like like here  with a dumbbell this is more tedious working that  

eccentric staying on the way up then you have  to go and train the other side so we do in in  

our shoulder ability we do this and we do the  face pull but depending on like someone's goals  

um the face pull might suit like a bodybuilding  goal more because you can get in there you can  

pump it out a bit more that's exactly what I was  going to say and that's one of the downsides of  

these more re-happy based exercises that's  generally where people put them in that camp  

even though you're saying build up your strength  get to 10 of your body weight people just for  

some reason don't like doing rehab stuff their  adherence and consistency long term just isn't  

there so a smart way of integrating that is with  the face pull granted it's not as localized in  

that pure external rotation but hey at the end of  the day I'm about people doing their homework and  

the face pull is an exercise where you can sell it  better it's okay you're you're going to mitigate  

injury risk because you're strengthening external  rotators but you're also doing an exercise that's  

going to help with muscle mass hypertrophy in  the posterior adults upper back it's easier to  

sell that in a routine and still get those fringe  benefits so this is always something we need to  

consider when we're going through these exercise  discussions yeah it's it's nice to have a nice  

toolbox so for the person who wants maximum you  you know how to deliver that but then also you're  

delivering the idea is to just be like uplifting  exercise as a whole not creating factions or  

problems for people but giving people Solutions  so it's nice to have like a variety of solutions  

so from the sled from the backwards sledding  to the face pulls like a variety of solutions  

that someone can get in get a pump add it to any  routine smoothly I think it's I think that matters  

versus just saying oh no you can't you know this  isn't for you definitely last question for you  

Ben I'm gonna give you a a curveball here mate  let's let's see what you got here so what do what  

are some of the common myths or misconceptions  when it comes to knees over Toes or atg system  

is there anything that you'd like to clear up well  the the first myth of needs over toes I don't know  

if that's you know too obvious but the the idea is  it was found that um that when the knee goes over  

the toe there's more there's more pressure on the  knee so knee over toe more pressure on the knee  

that was in 1978 that that was found this create  a pretty big ripple effect like I grew up here in  

America and it was like you go to a strength I  was like don't let your knees over your toes in  

training and so uh but then from the moment we  go backward and we start to find out that that  

position actually provides a way to be able to  handle that pressure so yeah if you're talking  

about the basic knees over toe Smith the finding  that knee over chose more pressure on the knee  

should have been used in order to figure out  how to protect that position not avoid that  

position so it's just a the finding was correct  but what to do about it running running from a  

problem we're seeing is maybe not as good as uh  you know in most areas I'm saying it works out  

better to master and understand how to face a  problem rather than running from a problem and  

it's the same with a I made atg yeah it's called  athletic truth group that was just a name to make  

up I was just trying to find an acronym with atg  because atg is is like ass to grasp meaning full  

range of motion so it's the same thing of course  if if full range of motion hurts we're not saying  

to do that but there's long-term Studies have been  done now and it's found that actually full range  

of motion doesn't wear down the knee actually  it prevents breakdown of the knee compared to  

avoiding full range of motion so uh it's similar  knees over toes and atg astrograst full range  

knees over toes full range of motion these  areas of pressure the idea is to build toward  

you can handle those so if you have someone who  forces into it or avoids it completely I don't see  

those work out as well as just taking your time  to be able to handle those positions that whole  

notion of this or that right or wrong without any  elaboration on Nuance or context is something that  

once you understand that as a fitness consumer  geez that that liberates you from a lot of gurus  

or misinformation and you nailed it there with  uh debunking some of those most popular myths  

yeah yeah having gone through that now I can  see a lot of different areas of life and you  

can see the these intents this or that and you  can actually see oftentimes like above those  

arguments I encourage people not to get into the  sides but to like see above that the answer is  

usually going to be something like above what  people are fighting on Ben Patrick it was an  

absolute pleasure change you mate I think you've  done tremendous things for the fitness industry  

you've really pushed the needle in a positive  direction if people want to keep learning more  

about your work where can they find out more  you're here on YouTube we do our best job on  

on YouTube to put out you know something something  that's really helpful each week we're really not  

chasing the views so I would say head on over  to that YouTube channel if you want to then do  

programs and coaching go to atg onlinecoaching.com  I think within a few months someone can Master the  

forms and we we coach your form every single  session no long-term contract so you can use  

it for what you need and then use that data the  rest of your life awesome thank you all right  

thank you brother if you enjoyed that click here  for another value-packed Fitness FAQs video peace

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How To Bulletproof Your FULL BODY | FitnessFAQs Podcast #42 - Knees Over Toes Guy

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How To Bulletproof Your FULL BODY | FitnessFAQs Podcast #42 - Knees Over Toes Guy