Daniel Cormier On Jon Jones, Dana White, Conor McGregor, Khabib, LeBron, Tom Brady & Jake Paul | Club Shay Shay

Have we ever seen someone in that sport

that possessed the arsenal that he has?

No. He's by far the most talented person

that we've had in mixed martial arts.

When he beat me, I was

That was the best you'd ever been.

I'd never been better.

Let's just say for the sake of argument,

you're three years apart. And now y'all

move up and y'all heavyweight.

Nah, he he wasn't beating me at heavy

all my life. Been grinding all my life.

Sacrifice, hustle, paid the price, want

a slice, got to roll the dice. That's

why all my life I've been grinding all

my life. All my life. Been grinding all

my life. Sacrifice hustle paid the

price. Want a slice. Got to roll a dice.

That's why all my life I've been

grinding all my life. [Music]

[Music]

Hello. Welcome to another episode of

Club Shay. I am your host Shannon Sharp.

I'm also the propri of Club Shay.

Stopping by for conversation and a drink

today is one of the most accomplished

and decorated fighters in MMA history.

He's one of the great mixed martial

artists of all times. A warrior in the

octagon, a champion in every MMA

organization he's competed in, a former

UFC light heavyweight champion and

heavyweight champion. He's the second

fighter in UFC history to hold titles in

two weight classes simultaneously. He's

the first fighter to in the UFC to win

and defend both the light heavyweight

and the heavyweight belts. A UFC Hall of

Famer, a two-time Olympian, three-time

Louisiana State Champion, an

all-American freestyle wrestler, color

commentator, worldclass talent, a master

on the microphone, a father, a husband,

a legend. DC could stand for double

champion, but in this case, it stands

for Daniel Cormier,

my man. Hey, say it again. When you say

it all, when you say it all, when you

say it all, man, I'm going to tell you,

when you say it all, it's something cuz

I grew up in Louisiana. I never could

have imagined this life. I swear to God,

I never could have imagined. And to hear

all that, man, that was uh that was a ride,

ride,

man. Thanks for stopping by Club Shay Shay.

Shay.

Thank you,

man. You know, when you stop by Club

Shay, you know you got to have a taste

of the

Yeah. Yeah. That shave by the pool.

Yeah, man. Awardw winning.

Awardw winning.

It's good.

It's great. You know anything about Kanye?

Kanye?

No, I don't. But let me I'm going to try that.

that.

Oh, it smells strong, too. See?

See?

Well, that's pretty good. It don't even

really It don't

Yeah. See, they got that bite. You got

that bite. I was expecting a little bit.

So, my daddy drink like Southern Comfort

and stuff like that. Set your hair on fire.

fire.

Yeah. No, no, no, no, no. It's nice and

smooth. Yeah. It's easy.

See, we got to get you some. We got to

get some for your old man.

That's actually really good.

Yeah. See,

that's real good. Let me ask you when

you hear what I read off and you and I

were talking before we started this

interview and you was talking about

growing up in Louisiana and the

expectations of and now you're in media.

Did you expect any of this to happen?

This be your life at your age now?

No, Shannon, I was I was a kid that I

didn't do I grew up in in Lafayette,

right? So, it's not the best place, right?

right?

But I followed everybody. So, I did

everything they did. So whenever when I

was in high school, my freshman year, I

was a kid that failed off the wrestling

team, right?

I was a kid that had to go to summer

school to get to 10th grade, I did all

kinds of bad stuff until I started

getting better at wrestling, right?

And then I realized like, wait, this

wrestling can take me somewhere, right?

right?

But even after that, I never thought that

that

I would have jobs doing what I do with

the volume, uh, working at ESPN, working

at Fox that I used to.

A lot of similarities, right? But like

having those opportunities, I never

could have imagined doing that because

I didn't even go I didn't go to college

for media. None of us did. We went to

college to play sports.

And normally the best people that are in

media didn't go to college for media,

especially when they do what we do. Now,

obviously, you know, the the playbyplay

and and things of that, you know,

obviously, but

to sit and talk about a sport,

it it really helps if you play that

sport and you can speak through personal experience.

experience.

Absolutely. And that's what people want

to hear. The people actually want to

hear when you are talking as the guy

that played

the tight end, the guy that's in the Pro

Football Hall of Fame. When you're

talking about football

because they know, well, he been in the

trenches and that's what I do when it

comes to fighting. I can explain

something in real fine detail. Yes.

Yes. Because

Because

there's no position I haven't experienced,

experienced,

the good and the bad in my career.

I'm going to take it from this approach.

You you got a late start to the to to MMA.

MMA.

Yep. and getting a late start that

didn't deter you because now I'm looking

at you what you were able to accomplish

later in your career. How I mean is how

is that possible DC?

So I walked into that gym at 30 and a

half, right?

I turned 31 in March. I I only fought

for 10 years and at 41 I should have

been done but the money had got too

good. That's the way you know the money

get good at the end. The money get good

at the end whenever you aren't supposed

to be doing it anymore. But I I I kept

fighting. But I walked into that gym,

but because of my background in

wrestling, it gave me like a massive

head start. So I d I went out to San

Jose. I I went to multiple gyms recruiting.

recruiting.

They were trying to get me to train, but

I walked into AKA, bro. I saw Kane

Velasquez. I was like, "Yo, that dude is

who I want to fight like. And if I can

train alongside him, right,

right,

it will lead me to being one of the

best." But at 31 years old, I was

essentially making my uh MMA debut

because normally guys that are really

really good, they start obviously you

got a wrestling background, but they've

been doing this for an extremely long

period of te of time and you just

basically I mean 30 years old with a

wrestling background, but you got to be

multifaceted to be really good in the

UFC. The more rounded you are, the

better you are. If you're

one-dimensional, you're not going to

have a you're going to have a very short

shelf life in that sport.

Yep. Not today. You can't you you you

definitely cannot be onedimensional

today. Right.

Back in the day, you remember Royce

Grace and those guys? I do. They would

walk with the the jiu-jitsu chain. You

had the jiu-jitsu guy. You had the big

boxer. One brother went out there with

one glove on. His name was R. Jimmerson.

He went out there with one glove.

Can't do that.

The first two fights that were in

Denver, Colorado, I saw him UFC. Really?

Really? Yeah.

Yeah.

You went?

I went.

See, that's crazy.

I was telling Dana the story.

You actually went to watch it?

I went to watch it cuz I I I'm, you

know, just like Okay. And you know,

listening to it, what is it going to be?

Well, we going to see if a karate guy

could beat a this guy and if a big guy

could beat that guy. And I'm like,

"Okay, so what about the classic?" They

like, "Ain't no weight class." I like,

"Hold on. So a guy 125 could literally

be fighting somebody 275." Like, "Yeah."

I like, "Uh, I don't think this going to

end well."

But that's what drew you in, right? And

then Royce wins and he's 165.

Yes. I'm looking at this little dude. I

said, "You about to get the brace beat

off you." And he got his he got his he

got his suit on and Yeah. And I'm like,

"What's he doing?" He's like literally

trying to lay down. I'm like, I don't

think this cuz I because I ain't never

about no

TC. I don't know about no Brazilian

jitsu. And he's like laying down. I'm

like, what you doing?

You go down there, you trouble.

Yeah, exactly.

If you go down there with him, they were

in trouble. But

I I had So, girl, so that my manager Yeah.

Yeah.

still to this day, Dwayne, he calls me

when I graduate college at Oklahoma

State. He goes, "Hey, there's a sport."

This is 2001. He goes, "There's a sport

that's going to take over. It's going to

be MMA. It's fighting. Have you ever

been in a fight like in your life? Right.

Right.

I started laughing at him. I said, "Bro,

I grew up in Louisiana. I had to fight

all the time." Right.

And I think that

that even though even though Shan like

we don't

I'm pretty sure you grew up down in the

South K and you had to fight at times

even though we aren't doing it

correctly. Somebody's trying to punch

you. You're trying to punch someone. So

then it when somebody taught me to punch

like, "Okay, this is how it's done the

right way." Correct. So, it allowed for

me to uh adjust to it much faster. I

wasn't scared, right?

Like that's the biggest thing with

wrestlers, especially being scared to

get hit. You cannot be scared, right?

right?

How is it that we're starting to see

more athletes DC dominate in their 40s,

you saw a guy like yourself, you see a

LeBron James, you saw a Tom Brady, you

see guys that are playing at extreme cuz

normally guys, they're gone. By the time

they get to the mid30s, they're gone.

Especially in your sport, even in

football, guys ain't playing that long.

And every once in a while, you'll get a

Kareem Abdul Jabbar that'll be, but he's

a big guy and he doesn't need to get up

and down the court. Yep.

Yep.

But to see Tom play until he's what, 43,

44 years of age. Yourself fighting

at 41. Yeah.

That's a whole LeBron still being able

to be play at the level he's playing at.

Why do you think guys have been able to

to to do things to this level for much longer?

longer?

Because of the access to to recovery. I

think athletes are smarter today. Those

guys are are very young. So when we're

younger, like you're in your 20s, you're

in your 30s, you're Superman. Yeah. You

go to sleep, you jump out of bed, you go

to train. Yes.

Every day. But then as you start to get

older, the body starts to ache a little

more. But those guys in their 20s and

30s are not

they're not rejecting the body anymore.

They're saying at 25, while I may feel

great, I know there are like problems

underlying for me that I need to address

address make sure that I'm straight. And

I think that's why they're playing so

long, but they're playing at an elite

level. I remember when Pton Manning went

to Denver.

He said it himself. He goes, "I can't

throw the ball down the field." He goes,

"But I will manage a game. Every now and

again, I'll give you one that goes a

little deeper." He goes, "But I'm

managing the game." Because at the point

we were still kind of living in that

that world where you just age and then

you age out. And even Aaron Rogers right

now, right? We'll see what happens this

year. But last year, he just didn't look

like the same guy and caught up to him quick,

quick, right?

right?

going into a fight because like you

said, when you're young, you feel

invincible. You feel you can't lose. As

you start to get age, you're like, I'm

not as quick as I once was. My reaction

time is not the same. My my my defense

mechanisms are not the same. My spidey

senses don't tingle like they once did.

I'm not processing information. You know

what I'm saying? The computer

the internet ain't working.

The internet you you back on a

dial up. You don't [Laughter]

[Laughter]

you're exactly right. But DC, I mean for

you I mean you went in there and you did

what you did to CP like what's what is

your what was your thought process? Did

you like man I'm getting older. Did you

do any did you train any different?

So at 39 I didn't so I I didn't at 39.

This is the craziest [ __ ] ever. So 39 starts.

starts. Yes.

Yes.

Right. In 2017

I lost to Jon Jones in Anaheim.

Right. So, I was they called me, "Hey,

you want to fight another fight?" It was

like September, uh, October. I said,

"No." I said, "Um, this was the first

time I'd been knocked out in my life."

Like, in my life, Shannon, like

in football, I would hit people and you

kind of buzz.

I was knocked out,

bell rung, and all it was was my bell

just got rung, right? You go back to playing.

playing.

I got knocked out, man. like he kicked

me in the head and he hit me with a

bunch of follow-up shots and it put me

out like hey

I remember I can tell you right now this

was in 2017

from the the moment I that fight

finished all the way back to the

ambulance I still can't recall that time really

really

I can't make myself remember what

happened I try I try now even at night

to go man what happened in that 10 15 minutes

minutes

dude there's a video of me crying with

Joe Rogan He's interviewing me after the

fight, but I'm so concussed that I'm

crying in the lockdown because I just

lost the biggest fight of my career, right?

right?

They called me to fight again. And I

said, "No." I said, "I'm gonna let my

brain rest until the end of next year

or the beginning of next year. I fight

in January. At 39, I feel great. I go

into I I I win the belt back. I beat

Stipe in July and I'm fine. I feel no

age because of the late start, right?

I'm only doing this seven years now,

right? Eight years. Because of the late

start at 39, I become the double champ.

I defend the belt in Madison Square

Garden. Everything is great. But on that

morning of that fight with Derrick

Lewis, I get up to do my shakeout. I go

run, hit my pads. As I'm on the

treadmill, I'm like, "God, I'm like, I

don't feel great this morning. Like, I'm

kind of like achy, right, Shannon? I'm

running. I sneeze. Bro, when I sneeze,

threw my back out. What? Threw my back

out. I sneezed so violently."

That's like a baseball player doing a

mess like that.

Yes. I sneeze so violently. My back went

out. So now I'm stuck hunched over. Mind

you, at 1:00 a.m. tonight, I've got to

walk to that octagon and fight Derrick

Lewis. You can't lose a main event on

the day. So then they come and they they

massage me. They give me a stem cell

treatment. They get me up in about

around 5:00 in the afternoon. I go

fight. One month after that, I'm in the

gym training. I kick Kane's leg. He

checks it. Tingle goes all the way up my leg.

leg.

The the the the the disc sits on my

sciatica. Now I'm paralyzed almost. And

from that moment on, I just was not the

same guy. It took one incident, a

sneeze, essentially ended my career

because I never want to fight again,

right? Stipe beat me the next time, then

he beat me the following time. It's like

I never It was that one thing. So, I

think these guys while they're playing

longer have an ability to go longer, but

it'll be one thing. LeBron,

yes. If LeBron gets hurt,

it's not going to be like when he got

hurt in his 20s. He's really going to

struggle to bounce back

because when you're younger, the ability

to bounce back, I mean, an injury that

would keep you down a day, all of a

sudden it's two, three days or maybe

it's a week. And a injury that would

keep you down a week when you're younger

is keeping you down two weeks or maybe

even a month. The body just doesn't recover

recover

with the football like when you how old

were you when you retired?

I was uh I was I was going to turn 36 in

2 months.

So, you were still relatively young. In

today's game though, you'd have played

three more years. Yes.

Yes.

Right. But how did the how did

Because because they don't in training

camp, we had, you know, we was outside

twice a day. We hitting we have some

days we have two a day practices.

They don't even hit no more.

No, no, no, no. They don't they don't

hit no more. We we we hit. We They were

for real real here. And we hit for real

real in college and we hit for real real

in high school. So,

but I think it got our bodies used to

taking that. We didn't have these little

ticky tack injuries that these guys get now.

now. But

But

do you think that because you didn't

have the wear and tear? Mhm.

Mhm.

That you know, say if you had gotten to

this like in your 20 like I think Jon

Jones started like 20.

John Jones was Jon Jones started at like 19.

19.

Yeah. Do you think because you didn't

have the wear and tear because like you

said even though you got I mean you had

a short chef life. Really? You only had

like eight years?

Yeah. Yeah. I fought for eight years,

right? I was the champ. I was in the

championship for eight years. I fought

for the belt those last two years. That

didn't mean I was necessarily in the

picture, right? I was fighting for the

belt because I have the name value. I

was fighting for the belt in Anaheim

because I was the champion, right? I had

to defend. Sure, I was beating Stipe,

but man, by that

that old monkey jump on my back in the

third round. Sh. I was beating the [ __ ]

out of him. By the third round, the

monkey jump on my back. I was like, "Yo,

I am exhausted. I'd never felt it before."

before."

Wow. Yeah. It was crazy. It was It is

the scariest thing that you could ever

imagine in your life. I've been in some

some hairy situations

inside that octagon

not having the energy to fight

cuz that dude wants to kill you. Yes.

Yes.

If that like if that referee don't take

him off of you, he going to keep beating

you up.

Like seriously, like that's how you got

to approach fighting, right?

right?

So it's like it that's a scary when

you're like you get off that stool and

you're like, "Oh my god, I don't know

how if I got 10 more minutes and scary."

I forget who it was, but I remember

there was some lady that she like woke

she's like I was in the ring and I

realized I didn't want to fight anymore.

I was like you probably want like in

training or or maybe even the night before

before

in the back.

Yes. But you don't in the ring and she I

forget her name. Um

she fought. Yes.

Yes.

She got knocked out, didn't she?

She lost.

She lost. Uh Misha Misha Tate.

Misha Tate. Yep. Misha Tate. Yep. I

remember her saying that

and I was like,

"Boy, that's an awful time to find out

you don't want to do something when

you're actually doing it."

Yeah. There's some questions before.

Yeah. Every time.

Oh, yeah. For sure.

Every time you There's some questions. I

used to watch I used to watch Floyd and

all them dudes like in the ring before

when they're introducing them like, "How

do they do that? How do they find calm

in this with everything going on around him

him

with what's at stake?" Yeah.

Yeah.

And I was like, man, I I couldn't do it.

But then I I would I would walk to that octagon.

octagon.

It's the mo like you know like you know

right and that's why people that's what

people don't understand when you hit

that tunnel for a Super Bowl or you hit

that tunnel for a big game your whole

body's on fire.

Oh yeah. Yeah. You you you got goosebumps.

goosebumps.

You got goosebumps everywhere.

What's going through your mind

Shannon? I'm in the back every time and

I would go in same routine. I'm from

Louisiana superstitious. I go in the

back and I go to sleep. People would

look at me like, "How can you sleep

knowing that in three hours you're going

to go fight for a world championship?" Right?

Right?

But I knew that my preparation I left I

left no stalling turn. I done

everything. So the result was done, right?

right?

Either I was going to win or I was going

to lose because

it wasn't going to be something that you

did in that room. And in that 3 hours,

how do you settle yourself? I said,

"Because I'm ready." But they would I

would be in the back. I'd get up. I do

my warm-up. Then they would tell me,

"All right, DC, you walk in a minute."

He start hearing music and all right DC

we're walking in 5 4 3 2 1 and it's just

nerves I'm like how many times should I

have gone left I went to college Shannon

how did I end up here fighting

man I hit that curtain thousands of

people 18,000 the UFC does an amazing

job of walking you through the crowd

and the energy is just electric and

they're reaching for you and they're

they want a piece of you right

and and I couldn't I couldn't even

handle it I would run to the octagon

because it's just too much. I'm already

jazzed. I can't take in any more energy

before I step in there.

Do you see them? Cuz a lot of times like

you get you get into a zone DC and you

know, like you said, like you don't even

you don't even see the people. It's like

a calm. Like I'm in a game and it's like

a calm. I don't even hear the crowd. Yeah.

Yeah.

It's like everything is just like hush

and all of a sudden you catch a pass,

you catch a touchdown and it's ah yes,

it's great. But I could like I can't see

him because I'm I'm focused

purposely tunneling on the octagon and

have the ability to go second. So the

guy that I'm fighting is already in

there. Right.

Right. So I'm not standing there waiting

trying to So I'm I'm going second. When

I hit that when I hit that that freaking

uh when I hit that um that step, those steps,

steps,

I'd walk up and I tap the tab the

octagon. That was some football [ __ ] we

used to do. Always hit play like a champ

today, right? Like I always tap the

octagon. I go in there,

bro. There's Bruce. Bruce is dressed to

the dime.

There's some commissioners making sure

we don't fight before. And then when

they do the last instructions and you

turn around,

there's a pen that they dropped to lock

the cage. It It makes that sound right

there that he just dropped, right?

right?

I could hear it. 20,000 in the arena.

And you could still hear that pen.

I could hear that pen. And then I would

say to myself, I swear to God, I would

be like, "Somebody got to die in this.

It ain't going to be me." Swear to God.

Every time I be like, "Somebody going to

die in here." Like

I'm about to make you go make you go

unlock that gate.

Yes, my goal is to make you unlock.

You either jump over this, you either

jump over to run away from me or they

going to pull me off of you by the time

this is done, right?

And then that was always my approach

because you had to look at it like life

and death.

You just had to. I had so many things. I

wouldn't eat. I would like abstain from

sex. I wanted to be as primal as I could

be going into the octagon.

When you cut Okay, you're the light

heavy that weight is 205. So now, so

what are you coming down from? You

coming from 230? You coming from 235?

You coming from 250? Where you coming

from? Deep Shannon,

Shannon,

my nutritionist was at my house for a

fight I was supposed to have in January,

but I got hurt the day before

Thanksgiving. He had a turkey brine. A

turkey and a brine. It was in a big old pale.

pale. Yeah,

Yeah,

it was white though. Shannon, he was

going to make us Thanksgiving dinner,

but it was not going to be seasoned.

I got hurt right before Thanksgiving,

man. We took that turkey, rinsed all

that [ __ ] off, made it ourself, and

seasoned it. The next day, I weighed 257

lbs. What?

I weigh I weighed 257, bro.

And you got to be 205 in January.

January 19th, I weighed in at 204.7.

I was 257.

What the heck?

I was huge. I was big, but like I wasn't tall.

tall.

Yeah, I know. That's a lot of weight in

in a small area, DC.

But but when I would walk into the

octagon, you could see where the power

was in my ass and my legs.

It was like that all this.

You're really explosive.

Exactly. And it was all in this. Right.

While I was the shorter guy, short arms. Yeah.

Yeah.

I had my torso is not tall, right?

But like it's in my legs and that's why

the explosiveness was always so on on

display. Yeah. It was good. But it was

the He has the best.

It's like walk dude when you're on when

you're on that sideline in the national

anthem playing that feeling. Yes.

That's what we're feeling, bro. It's the

best. It's it lit. I've

That's why so many fighters end up on

drugs and messed up because you can't replace

replace

You can't You can't replicate that.

No, you can't. And that's why athletes

struggle once they leave their said

sport is because you're never going to

be able to replicate 20,000, 80,000,

however many thousand. You're never

going to be able to replicate the locker

room. You're never going to be able to

replicate the bus rides, the plane

rides, just the camaraderie. Now, I

don't know.

But that's what you missed the most.

That's what you literally missed the

practices and afterwards just sitting

there talking.

Yeah. Yeah. I didn't miss the games. I

mean, the money was nice, but you just

missed the camaraderie, the laughing and

joking. You in the line stretching and

doing all those things. Yep.

You mentioned Anaheim. Y

you fought Jon Jones. I think you were

35 and he was 27.

Yep. Yep.

If you guys were comparable ages, is

that fight different?

I think I think there are a lot of I

think there are a lot of reasons why he

beat me. He's I mean, have you met Jon Jones?

Jones?

I haven't.

Jon Jones is probably 65 6'4 65.

Jon Jones's arms are 84 in apart. His

reach. Wow. Mine are 72. Yeah. So like

he was taller like a so even if even at

the same age he would still be taller. Yes.

Yes.

Um two of his brothers played in the

NFL. One was like really good Chandler. Chandler.

Chandler. Um

Um

so I think I would be better because I

would be younger. But I don't know if I

could have been better in Anaheim

because I trained so hard because he

beat me the first time.

I've never been better. I when he beat

me I was better.

That was the best you'd ever been.

I'd never been better. I would have beat

everybody else in the world in and in

all those weight classes. I was never

better than that night and he beat me.

And even the fight up to the point that

he got me, it was just super competitive,

competitive, right?

right?

Joe Rogan said something to the effect

of, "You can clearly see you're watching

the two best lightweights we've ever

seen in an octagon, right?

Because we were both so locked in." So,

I don't know that the age made as much

of a difference because I just think

that he has a lot of built-in advantages

with his height and his reach and he's

got great timing and he's tough, dude.

He's very tough, Shannon. Like, I would

club him upside the head and he would

just keep fighting.

He would just and not many did that.

And that's what I want. What makes him

because like you say, okay, he's he's

6'4 and a half. He's 6'5, 84 in reach.

Um, he can punch you. He can take you

down. See, he don't hit very hard

though, but his hands,

he does not punch hard. Really?

Really?

No, he does not punch hard. He He So, we

were I went into the fight. I talked to

Rashad Evans, right? And Rashad goes,

"He doesn't hit hard, but he has other

weapons." So, we first start fighting

the first time. We trade jabs because I

had a real unique ability because of my

athleticism to get to the jab even

though the guy was taller. So, we jab

each other

and my nose started bleeding. I was

like, "Well, why my nose bleeding? He

hit hard. My [ __ ] bleeding. His [ __ ]

bleeding for different reasons. But um uh

uh

Ignore that. [Applause]

[Applause]

You got you got to think that with anything.

anything.

So my [ __ ] bleeding, right? And I'm

like, "Why is my nose bleeding?" I was

like, "Why my [ __ ] bleeding?" So anyhow,

he uh we start fighting and I'm like,

"Okay, but I got to pressure him because

I'm shorter, right?"

right?"

Yo, you got to walk through some razors

to get to him.

He's got knees. Yes. That you. So, by

the time I get in,

I've been kneading the body three times.

I've been elbowed two times. So, now I

get off. I get my [ __ ] going. And then

we get apart. So, now I got to go all

through the razors again to get my

offense going again. That's what makes

him special. He's a special fighter. He

really is. And I respect him

for what he did inside the Octon. Mainly

because he beat me on that night. like

and you said that's the absolute best

DC has ever ever been.

Shannon, I I was I was in such great

shape. My shoulders were like big. I was

lifting. I was running. I was training

hard. I was conditioned. I mean,

I was well conditioned. I was mopping.

You was ready to go five. If if if five

if five is what is required,

it's going to

cuz we went 25 the first time. Yes.

Right. So I And and my cardio failed me.

Okay. So, I was like, I need to be

better cuz it's going 25 again. Okay.

Okay.

And then ultimately, he got me with the

head kick. But,

uh, I was in shape, man. I was ready to

go. My mind was strong. Everything was

ready to go get the job done

on that night. But, he was he he got it

done. He was

What about him at What if y'all had

moved up? Y'all similar in age. Let's

just say for the sake of argument,

you're three years apart and now y'all

move up and y'all fight heavyweight.

Nah, he he wouldn't beat me at heavyweight.

heavyweight.

He couldn't beat you? I don't think so

because I was good at heavyweight. I

think I was probably better.

And you're probably a natural

heavyweight there.

My natural weight. I was like my natural

weight. But he almost admitted it. He he

he said in the time that we were

fighting, he goes,

"No, I'm not going to fight him at

heavyweight. That would be giving him

the advantage."

He goes, "He's bigger than me

naturally." And he goes, "No." But then

like a couple weeks ago, he was talking

about me fighting. I was like, "Bro, I'm

45 years old, man. I'm 46 now. Go fight

the dude that want to fight you." Like,

they got a big old

Oh, he want to fight you not heavyweight.

heavyweight.

You talking about I would have beat I

would beat DC at heavyweight. Yo, I've

been I've been retired for 5 years, my brother,

brother, right?

right?

Go fight somebody else. Like, I'm good.

Pick on somebody your own side.

When you and John got into it at the at

the uh the presser,

the very first Yeah.

Yeah.

What happened?

Damn. DC.

Hey Shannon,

it's so funny because

MMA has struggled to encapture the urban audience.

audience. Yes.

Yes.

It really has. Mhm.

Mhm.

John and I are going to fight the first

time. John and I have had a we we've

always had a history of not getting

along great. Right.

Right.

So when the press conference happened,

we came forward at the forehead. I

pushed him. He pushed me. We flew off

the octagon. That was right in the

middle of football season in every

sports center. Everything led with that. Correct.

Correct.

Cuz it was that big.

Lorenzo Patina told me, he goes, "You

guys would have made so much money." He

goes, "You made great money in January,

but it was 6 months." He goes, "If y'all

fought in September," he goes, "you

can't imagine how much money you would

have made on pay-per-view."

But cuz the fire had died down a little

bit after 6 months passed.

But we had that moment where the cameras

the cameras kept recording, right?

It was just and we just didn't like each

other. But after the fight, I was in New

York, New Jersey, walking around like I

would always do. And that's when I

realized that being in there with him

had changed the way the public perceived me,

me, right?

right?

Cuz I'm in a very urban neighborhood,

very black, and everybody's like, "Hey,

hey, hey." But I think it was because of

what we did for each other. It hate each

other, dislike each other. We did great

business and we did elevate each other

to the to the point that when I fought

Stipe, I was able to elevate him, right?

right?

Because of the name recognition I got

from fighting John.

Look, the elephant in the room um I saw

Demetrius Johnson says because Jon

Jones, the steroid is tied to his name. Yep.

Yep.

He can't be in the GO conversation.

I don't believe that. I don't believe

that he should be considered the

greatest ball type. I've said that you

can't you can't

Shannon steroids yes

yes

in fighting is much different than

anything else in the world.

They make you stronger. They make you

faster. They give you endurance,

recovery ability when you train.

That's what you That's what it that's

mainly what steroids does. It allows you

to go to there and go hard and go hard

tomorrow and go hard the day after and

go hard the day after and go hard the

day after. That's when you grow. That's

when you become better. Y

because it gets to a point where you're

like, damn, I I just I can't get I can't

give you everything today. Yes.

Yes.

But you can go back to back to back.

And that was me at 36, right? Even

though I was the best I could ever be.

The best I could ever be. I'm working as

hard as I could ever work in my life

knowing that I have to be ready. At 36,

he's 28. Right.

So, he's in his prime.

He's in his prime. But that's the fight

that he actually tested positive and

they made it a no contest.

Mhm. So, while he's doing that, it's

like, like you said, he's able to keep

up with me work-wise, but exceed it

because at a point I got to say, "Hey,

coach, I got to take a morning, man. I

need it. I have to I have to take a morning

morning

and I don't know that he would need to

do that." Yeah. So, I I don't I don't I

don't uh

Did you suspect at the time when you

were in there with him that there's

something that might not be on the up

and up?

No, no, no, no. I didn't suspect. He

felt like him. He felt like he was

always strong, right?

right?

He was always strong. He was always big.

He was always in shape. It wasn't

nothing that surprised me.

What sucked was that was that I I felt

like I moved past it, right? Like, okay,

this dude beat me twice. This shit's

over. Like, there's nothing I'm going to

do to be the champ. Because

if I can't beat him, nobody else has

beaten him.

Hey, that's the truth, right? I was

like, yo, if I ain't beating him, the

rest of these dudes ain't beating them

because I know how much, right?

right?

Cuz when I fight the other ones, I

destroy them. Right.

Right. Right.

Right.

Cuz they don't have the tool. tool. They

don't have the toolbox he got now. Exactly.

Exactly.

And plus, he's 6'5, 6'4 and a half. He's

long long limbs and he like he he has it

all. I mean, you can elbow, you need

If he if you write a checkbook, a

checklist of what you want in a fighter

at 205 to heavyweight,

Jon Jones, they're talking about the

White House. They're talking about a

White House fight card.

Hey man, we got to have some Americans win.

win. Yes.

Yes.

I don't you I don't like Jon Jones. It's

no secret. The whole world knows it,

right? I said, "Man, y'all better put

Jon Jones on there because right now we

ain't got one American in the top 10

pound for pound." I said, "If y'all want

an American dude to go get a victory,

put Jon Jones in there because he going

to win. That's what he does." Yes.

Yes.

But I at the end of the day, I still

don't believe, and I agree with DJ. It's

like you just can't have that tied to

your name, especially in fighting, right?

right?

And people call you the greatest of all time.

time.

He's the greatest talent, right,

right,

the sport has ever seen.

Have we That's what I was about to ask

you. Have we ever seen someone in that

sport that possessed the arsenal that he has?

has? No.

No.

No. He's by far the He's by far the most

talented person that we've had in mixed

martial arts in terms of his his length,

his skills, his mind. He's the most

talented guy we've ever had. We've had

great fighters. Demetrius Johnson was

amazing. Kabib is amazing. But Kabib did

it through grit, determination, and hard

work. He wasn't Kabib wasn't going to

run a basketball and shoot it. Jon

Jones. They got a video of Jon Jones

trying to dunk a basketball. You should

see that. That's bad. But obviously he's

he's an athlete. Look at his family.

Yes. Right. Got two brothers playing in

the NFL.

Yeah. Yeah. He he was he's the best

athlete we ever had. In terms of stero

in terms of the best fighter of all

time, I would never give that because of

that. Now, he's not the only guy that

fought on steroids. I think that before

they started doing all that testing,

all those guys were doing steroids. Really?

Really?

I really do. They just they I mean many

of them had popped for steroids before

and I fought them

and they had they had figured out a way

how to cycle on and off without

getting cycle on and off or

uh cycle on and off or they just weren't testing.

testing. Right.

Right.

I I I never took a drug test until I got

into the UFC. I just went and fought.

So, I don't know what those guys were

doing. There was a guy No, no, they said

that this guy got tested positive for

something. They said USADA, who was the

testing commissioner at the time, bro,

they got a bit they got a bit like

I know when they're coming, right?

They would come at 6:00 a.m. in the

morning and I did I got tested 65 times

from USADA

from wrestling to then. But look at me.

I'm not on steroids. Yeah.

Yeah.

But they were you hitting the numbers. I

said that publicly one time way back in

the day. The next time they came to my

house at 4:00 in the afternoon. So they

were watching but they because they had

gotten like repetitive. They they heard

fighters doing it. One guy popped for

something. Shannon, they got him at 10

PM. They said if they would have let him

go to bed and wake up the next morning,

they could have tested him, it'll have

been gone. 12 hours.

12 hours for that to get out of his

system. It's crazy the level of stuff

they have out there.

Well, it's just like anything. I mean,

they're going to come up with something

that that's in and out. They got these

See, and you didn't you didn't think it

was going to be you thought it was going

to have all that bite to it.

I don't drink.

No, it don't got it don't have any bite.

It don't have any bite. But the the

viral video of you finding out that he

test positive and

you you like you was just so broken heart

heart

heartbroken. It's like you It's like

losing your first girlfriend. I had a

girlfriend growing up and when me and

her we went crazy, right? You

you have sex for the first time.

It is all you want to do. I'm checking

myself out of school, man, to go meet

this girl. She's checking herself out of

school. She's up in the middle of the

night on the phone because her mom

doesn't let her use the phone.

Our parents took us together. They found

out what we were doing, right?

right?

They sat us in the front yard and told

us we could not see each other anymore.

That made

That's what it felt like.

Let me tell you something. I'm on the

city bus getting over that.

I'm telling my 35 cents, man. I'm going

to her house. Who doesn't mama go to

work? And you said

it was like that.

I will sign a waiver. I want to fight it.

it.

Heartbroken because I know how hard I

had worked. Again, it was just like

Anaheim. I worked so hard to prepare myself.

myself. Right.

Right.

We are. When you're fighting,

that's your business partner. Imagine

you're playing the Kansas City Chiefs

and on Sunday they just don't show up.

Think about it.

We done practice all week

that they just don't show up, right?

right?

But your game check is tied to them

showing up. Yes.

Yes.

Now you're like, "Hey man, you're

hurting my business. I know what the

first check looked like when we fought, right?

right?

I want that second check."

And then by the hopefully we go a third

time. You know what I'm saying? It's like

like

that was the her of it. And then it was

UFC 200, man. We was on We were on Good

Morning America together. It was big.

And I was like, "Man, we need a It was I

was heartbroken because it's not just

me. It was my entire team that worked so

hard to make sure I was prepared to

fight that night. So yeah, I said, "I'll

sign whatever I need to." But Dana was

like, "Come on." Dana was like, "You

can't do that." You could tell he didn't

want to tell me that. You could tell it

was like he was like, "Can I talk to

you?" I was like, "What do you need me

to? What do you need?" I was staying at

the MGM signature cuz I always stayed

like at that small little one on the side.

side.

He goes, "Can you come over to the arena

right now?" And I was like, "Why?" I was

like, "It's 2:00 in the afternoon." He

goes, "I want you to I have to talk to

you about something really important."

So, I walk over with my team and he's in

the back in that hallway and he tells me

and he goes, "We have to talk to the

media." I was like, "Damn, this

everything's in place and I didn't

know." I was still just going about my

day like I was going to go cut weight to

make for the fight.

And he was like, "You have to address

the media." It was horrible.

I was up there crying and [ __ ]

Yeah, I know. People, man, DC, what you

crying for?

DC crying every time. All these these do

is cry. They got me crying multiple times.

times.

Did you drive home

from from

from Or did you fly after you found out

that the fight?

No. No. I fought I fought. Remember I

fought Anderson Silva two days later.

They got Anderson to fight. Yeah. Which

was good. I actually I got to fight

Anderson Silva which was awesome. But

thank God Anderson said yes. Not many

people would have done it.

No. No.

Not two days. No. But but is it hard

because you're fighting a a fight

because a lot I've seen people take

fights on short notice and kick the

other fighter's ass because he's not

prepared to fight that guy. You prepared

to fight a guy with one style and this

guy has a different style and you're like

like

and something bad could have happened.

So I was surprised you even took that.

So I took the fight because I want I

dude I wanted to fight bad like when you

want you want to fight. You want the

check and you want to fight.

You want the check but you want to fight like

like

right cuz that's what you do.

I got all that weight. I was already 215

pounds. Like I don't want to go through

all that, right? And then two months

they go, you got to do it again. Right.

Because as a champion, I would fight

two times a year max. Yes.

Right. So I'm like, I don't want to have

to go through that again. So I would I I

I fought Anderson and it it wasn't a

great fight because again, I was so nervous,

nervous, right,

right,

dude? I was in the octagon. I looked

across and I was like the very first UFC

I ever went to, I went to Philadelphia

to watch Anderson Silva beat Forest

Griffin. And I mean, Anderson was

flexing on him. He's like moving

sideways, punching him with one hand

force is just falling down. He finishes

the guy that was the UFC light

heavyweight champion. I was like,

"Damn, this is crazy. I'm fighting Anderson."

Anderson."

I'm in the octagon. I go to the middle.

When I walk back to the side, I look

behind me and I said, "Oh my god, that's

actually Anderson Silva standing over there."

there."

Like seriously,

I'm really fighting a legend.

I'm really fighting Anderson Silva. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. That was the first I've never had

that happen to me in my my life. It was

always somebody's got to die. Except for

when I fought Anderson, I was like,

you're like, I don't want to beat this man.

man.

I got to fight Anderson Silva. But then

once I got then I started trying to kick

No, I never had that problem. You

You

You don't take You don't take it easy, don't do

don't do

Dan Henderson was my idol. He was on the

Olympic team. I choke him unconscious.

Damn, D.

I beat the [ __ ] out of him.

You don't feel bad?

Hell no. Somebody got to die, Jay.

Somebody got to get it right. Will you

play your brother in football? If you

play st.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We grow. Oh,

you want to lose?

No. I'm trying to kill him. I'm trying

to kill him. And we love each other.

Tell him about it afterward. Yes.

Yes.

John retires and everybody's like, "Hold

on, bro. You retired." And then two

weeks later, you talking about you in

protocol again, testing protocol.

Yeah. Yeah.

That pissed you off, didn't it?

So, when he retired, it it didn't I just

wanted him to I wanted to see him fight

Tom Aspenol. I just want him I wanted to

see him fight Tom

Aspenol. That good? He good, Shannon. He

literally has everything you want in a

heavyweight. He's big. He's physical. He

can wrestle. He's fast.

I Michael Bisping

once said to me, "Oh man, I'm telling he

could be like Muhammad Ali MMA." I said,

"Man, you going crazy." I said, "You

You're a person that works at the

company. You're a person that take

people take your opinion seriously. You

cannot be that strong on one side." He

goes, "I swear it's true." He's fighting

a guy uh named Sergey who had knocked

out 10 straight people. Nobody could go

around with Sergey. Tom Aspenog knocks

him out in a round. Walks into the thing

and hugs Michael Bismick. I was like, I

thought I said Bismick, I thought you

were like his advocate. You advocating

for this dude. But I'm like, he's

actually that good, right? And then he

beats up on Curtis Blades. He beats everybody.

everybody.

And so when I think about it, I'm like,

okay, now we get to see John. Because

John and I did this thing called counter

punch where he sat on one side, I sat on

the other with Joe Rogan. Yeah.

Yeah.

And John said

it it was so it was crazy cuz we just

hated each other so much. We were just talking,

talking, right?

right?

John said to me, he said, "At the end of

the day,

I'm better than you because I'm

younger." He goes,

"You can't beat me in the basketball

game." I go, "Well, that's debatable.

you know, you can't out swim me, you

can't outrun me. He said, because every

day you wake up, you're a day older and

you look in the mirror and you see a 36

year old man and I look in, I'm in my

absolute prime. I'm 28.

He said, "You can't be better than me

because the laws of life don't allow for

a 36-y old man to be better than a 28-y

old man when we're doing the same thing."

thing."

Tom Aspenol is 30 now. Jon Jones is 38.

Not a person. I want to see it on the

opposite side

because he said and he said, "Well, he

should be favored because you know he's

much younger and I've heard you and

other fighters say, "Well, you were you were

were

the whole time

the older guy gave you an opportunity."

He dropped the ladder.

So, return the favor and give this guy.

You don't think there's any chance that

Jon could beat him?

I do. That's the problem. If I had I

said to my I said gun to my head, if I

had to choose, I would probably say Jon

Jones would win. Wow. It's all I've seen

him do. I've seen him fight. He's right.

He's everyone. This is always the next

best guy. This guy's going to beat me.

This guy's going to beat Jon Jones. And

what does Jon do? He vanquishes him. He

beats him.

They said it about Gustin.

They said about Gustin. Say it about me.

Said it about Rashad. Said it about

Rampage. Said it about Sir Gan. I mean,

he dirty sir Gan up.

I mean, the man been away for a 100

years and and walked through Sir Gan

like he was like sir Gan was me. That

was embarrassing to DC. DC that was embarrass

embarrass

DC that was embarrassing.

I be trying to stay off of Cereal, man.

Cuz I like Sirill. Yo, when Sirill was

on the ground and he looked at him like

I was like he looked like he saw a

ghost. He was so in awe of John that he

couldn't even compete with him. I was

like, "Bro, he about to fight for the

world title again." Imagine if imagine

if Sir Gan went win and John go, "Okay,

okay, I'm back." Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, that'll piss somebody off. That

would piss people off cuz if Sirill

beats Tom cuz he's Sirill is that good.

He is.

He's that good. He could beat Tom Aspenol.

Aspenol.

No, but Dana Dana ain't going to let

that happen.

What if John's like, "Yo, all right.

You know, you know Dana won't let that

happen. Dana will not let Jon come back

and fight Sir for the heavyweight

title." He like, "No, no, no. You got to

fight. You got to fight."

The ultimate move of all time. I would

laugh at that [ __ ]

I would be happy. Like, John, do you you

you'll be cold for that one. Yeah. Okay.

You say you can't put uh uh John as as

your goat. Give me about Rushmore fighters.

fighters.

Demetrius Johnson. Okay. George St. Pierre.

Pierre. Okay.

Okay. Kabib.

Kabib. Mhm.

Mhm.

Kabib was undefeated. Nobody beat him. Fourth.

Fourth.

God, that's where it gets tough. That's

where it gets tough cuz you feel like

you want to put like when we talk about

just accomplishments, no one's more

accomplished than Amanda Nunees,

right? Can Can I really put her on the

Mount Rushmore of fighting? But George,

Demetrius, Kabib,

God, there are some good guys. Chuck

Liddell was good, man. Chuck Liddell's

kind of responsible for us being there.

Randy Coutur won two titles in his

bracket. I think that fourth place would

belong to one of those guys. I think

somebody like that because

I I can't put I would never put myself

up there. Right. Right. Right.

But I'm like right in that

Right. four to seven range of

I thought you might put Anderson.

Anderson had the Anderson had the

steroid. Yeah. Right. Like I can't put

Anderson. Like I would like to put

Anderson. If if I'm saying all those

guys included then obviously John and

Anderson are on that Mount Rushmore, but

but

I don't do that. I don't I refuse it.

It's not in fighting.

Barry Bonds was a Hall of Famer before

he even went to San Francisco. Correct.

Correct.

Right. Yeah.

Plus he's hitting with a baseball bat.

He's not punching someone right

in the face.

Women fighters.

What did What did Ronda Rousey do for MMA?

MMA?

Everything for women. Dana on record

said, "I will never have women fighting

in the UFC or something very close to that."

that."

Then Ronda came along and she just

opened up the floodgates. Yes. And now

Dana goes very in his life very rarely

does he make decisions where he's like I

really messed up. He openly goes Ronda

Rousey coming and and making me take on

female fighting is one of the best

decisions I've ever made cuz it gave me

Amanda Nunez gave me Jean Lee Valentina

Chevchenko. It's like all these women

have an opportunity because of Ronda.

No Ronda Rousey like I don't know if

women still today fight in the UFC.

That's how important she is. Could she

have been better?

I think she was at the right time also, right?

right?

The girls just weren't well-rounded

enough to compete with her.

And when she got somebody that was wellrounded,

wellrounded,

they they you saw what Amanda did to her.

her.

I saw what Holly Holmes kicked

Holly kicked her in the head.

That That was probably the beginning of

the end, wasn't it?

Yeah. Well, you know, again, like you

know when it's done, but at the end is

when the money gets better than it's

ever been.

So, yeah. She couldn't have beat him. If

she couldn't have beaten Holly, she was

not going to beat Amanda.

No. But I think it was just such a great

pull to have her back that she did it.

You mentioned this, the UFC at the White House.

House.

Dana, look, I was at the uh when they

had it at the sphere.

Oh, you went, huh?

I went. It was It was amazing. It was

amazing. And I wouldn't put anything if

if Dana say they going to have a fight

I don't know what airline flying to the

but it's going to happen.

It's going to happen. If he says they're

going to have it on the White House lawn

now, I don't know how they going to pat

everybody down and frisk everybody, do

background checks because and maybe it's

just closed circuit and they're really

only a handful of staff there.

No, no, I think it's going to be an

event. They said they want 20,000 in there

there

at the White House.

At the White House.

They got an Easter egg hunt at the White

House when they put 28,000 on the

Easter. Look,

but them kids

I didn't Hey Shannon, I swear to God.

Shannon, I swear to God, I I was not

believing it until I saw that they have

that Easter egg hunt there. I was like,

"Wow." Well, then it's possible because

right now when when Trump goes to a fight,

fight, Yeah.

Yeah.

we get background checks. Yes.

Yes.

The night before they go to the arena,

they're sweeping. They sweep it. The

morning of the fight before he shows up.

I I don't know. But

they I told Dana this recently. We were

in New Orleans and I said,

"You're going to the White House for

real." He goes, I said, "Because you

said we got a year, we're a year away." Yeah.

Yeah.

He was talking about He was talking

about something on an interview and he

goes, "We still got a year. The world's

going to change in MMA by that point." I

said, "You're speaking indefinite." I

go, "This is happening." Yeah, we're

going to go We're going to go watch a

fight at the White House. That's crazy.

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You said, "Look, we don't have really

any Americans in the pound-for-pound top

10. And if we just can't have, you know,

Barners coming in and winning all the

fights at at the White House.

No, we got to win.

So, we got to you got to put Jon Jones.

Put John there.

Call C. I'm calling him Captain America. But

But

somebody got to win.

But Dana don't But Dana wants for sure

thing. Knows that guys are going to be

he can count on.

I think he's I think he's going to fight

at the White House. He has to.

He has to fight at the White House.

Aspenol. Don't I mean I don't know why

he won't fight this dude. I I I said

this D if I was still fighting I'd have

fought Tom Aspenol already. I just would

have did it. Like the bigger the

challenge the better. It's like

go prove yourself. But I don't know why

he'll do it. But he might have to fight

Tom A. Like you said Dana's going to

make him fight Tom.

What I mean how much money would they

need for uh uh DC to come out of

retirement to fight at the White House? Yeah.

Yeah.

I cannot fight. They got 20 million for you.

you.

I'm still not doing it. [ __ ] I can't

train. I can't train. I go, dude. I'm

doing CrossFit. I do live. I I was just

today practicing how I'm going to do

sumo uh deadlifts. I'm like, I'm doing

sumo deadlifts. I'm like, that's I'm

just getting excited to go do my sumo

deadlifts. Jay, I can't fight cuz I

can't I can't I was I was sparring the

other day. I started I started a team,

okay, of guys that I'm training, helping

career their careers.

I was sparring. One of them punched me

in my rib with a straight right hand.

Boom. Right here. Dude, it was the most

painful shot I taken. My rib come out.

Right. My rib come out.

I'm in pain. Sh. I can't get off my

couch. I'm just like, uh, every time I

get off my couch, I'm rolling to my knees

knees

to then push up because I can't squeeze

my core. Right. Every time I squeeze my

cord hurts, man. I get I go I go take a

nap. I'm just sleeping, I guess. And I'm

because I'm sleeping rolling. I sleep. I

roll over the top of it, pop it back in

place. But I'm like, I couldn't do this

every day like I used to.

I always had separated ribs or black

eyes, and I I just couldn't do that

anymore. It's too This This life is too

comfortable what I do now, right?

right?

You make good living. You don't need to

go big punch, kick.

I don't want to fight no more, man.

Plus, like, come on. Go put some pads

on. Go tackle somebody.

No, no, no. You know what I'm saying?

You want to ask me?

Two artificial heels, bone bone. I'm I'm good.

good.

The pain is too great. I think that's

what people take for granted, like how

great the pain is that we endure to do

what we did, right?

right?

It it sucks.

I mean, before I got my hips replaced,

DC, I just thought the pain that I was

in was normal because I had dealt with

it for so long. Yeah.

Yeah.

And you get to and you're like, "Okay,

this is my new normal." And then the

doctor says, "No, you don't have to live

like that."

How much better does it feel?

A thousand. Really?

Really?

I mean, there was no position that I

could get in that was comfortable. If I

lay down, it hurt. If I stood, if it

hurt, it walked, it hurt. Sitting hurt.

Standing too long, it hurt. There was no

position in which my body didn't hurt.

My hips didn't hurt.

That's bad. I got I don't have that.

Thank God I don't have that. Yeah,

Yeah,

cuz that that [ __ ] seems so big.

It is. What about What about Conor

McGregor at the White House?

Okay. [ __ ] man. It's over, bro.

It's It's over for him.

It's over, dog. There, man. Man, this

dude Conor McGregor be he is tripping.

Conor McGregor tripping.

He made too much money, huh?

He made way too much. He went from

plumbing to making he sold that liquor

for what? 500 million. Yeah.

Yeah.

It's too much,

right? He got 100 million for fighting Floyd.

Floyd.

Got 100 million for fighting Floyd. Then

he was doing pay-per-views like nothing.

And him and Kabib did two and a half

million pay-per-views.

These dudes, he made too much money.

Connor says he wants to fight all the

time and everybody kind of they jump to

it, but it's like he wants to stay

relevant, right?

He wants to stay in the news. He wants

to stay he wants the notoriety of being

Conor McGregor without having to be right

right

Conor McGregor, right?

And that kind of sucks because when he

was the man, I bet you tapped in

I bet you tapped into the UFC more than

because he could because he could sell a fight.

fight.

He could sell a fight.

He could sell it. But him and Kabib was

the best.

Did you think he was just onedimensional

and that's why

he was good? He was very good.

But when when they got him on the

ground, DC, he couldn't get up.

They couldn't get him on the ground.

Yeah, they did.

Kabib got him on the ground.

That Kabib was a different person,

though. Like

him and Kabib really didn't like each

other. That's per, you know, sometimes

you like, oh, we just selling the fight.

But it seemed that it it was add it was

a little more to it. Like he like Khabib

sincerely and genuinely did not like Carson.

Carson.

He hates he won't say his name still

today. He still does not say his name

because of what he said about his

religion and about dad.

He still won't say his name. Last week

he did an interview in New York.

He says this guy, he'll never say his

name. He hates him. Dude, they're in the

octagon and Connor goes, he whispers

after the third round after Kabib, it's

just business. Kabir goes, "No, it

ain't. No, it ain't. You don't mess with

them dudes, man. Them Russian dudes

there. And then when he like when he had

him the the ref the ref had to do a

little bit extra. DC you saw that DC he was

was

he was going to let him he wasn't going

to let him go.

He was going to put him to sleep.

Shannon he was holding him and he said I

kicked your ass. I kicked your ass and

he kind of was like then he jumped over

the fence. Yes.

Yes.

And try to beat his team.

He thought he I was like whoa. But dude

he had him. He was not going to let him

go because he felt so his family got so

disrespected by this dude that he wanted

to end him. And and honestly, sometimes

you bite off more than you could chew. Yeah.

Yeah.

Cuz cuz Connor got beat bad that night.

He did. He got beat bad.

I mean, and the thing But here's the

thing that that shocked a lot of people.

Connor made Kabib He really did make

Kabib the biggest a bigger star. Yeah.

Like we talked about me and Jones, he

Khabib went from I think he had two or

three million followers on Instagram.

The next morning 10 million. Wow.

Wow.

After that fight and all that happened.

10 million.

Crazy. 7 million a night. That's a big jump.

jump.

You think Kabib would come out of retirement?

retirement?

Kabib told me on we did a thing a while

back where Kabib said they offered him

$40 million to fight. He said no. He

ain't coming back. If if they offered

him 40 mill and he hasn't come back yet,

he ain't coming back. No.

No.

No. He in Dagistan.

Well, they if they

I bet in Dagistan you can make a million

dollars and be good for the rest of your life.

life. Yeah.

Yeah.

Right. In that place.

Well, if they offered Khabib 40 million,

what they offer John Jones to fight Aspenol?

Aspenol?

I think they offer John said he wanted

30 and I think they got the money. They

got 30 for him. And he said no.

They got 30 for him. And he said, "Hey,

let me tell you something. I just told

All of a sudden, you don't hurt me.

[ __ ] I might test positive after it's over.

over. [Laughter]

[Laughter]

What is it about? What is it about

Dagistan that the guys that are they can

wrestle? Now look, I I've seen somebody

followed some of like those wrestler wrestlers.

wrestlers. Yeah.

Yeah.

They really I'm talking about those guys

that go to the Olympics. That's a whole

different level of wrestling. them do. H

how did they get so good? They just So

over there they put them in wrestling.

They put them in in both styles. Then at

like five, six years old, they identify

like where a kid's going to be better

and that's all they do all the way up

through school. Kabib's Kabib and Islam

started doing sombo when they were super young

young

together. Right. Right. With his dad. So

their whole life they did combat sombo.

Combat Sama was actually like ghee tops

uh punching. Yeah.

Grappling like

they were essentially doing MMA as like kids,

kids, right?

right?

And then

just keep getting better. I I think I

think I think for my son, right?

right? Mhm.

Mhm. To

To

have the mentality that I have or had,

it's impossible. His life's too comfortable.

comfortable.

Yeah. Okay.

you and and your brother and your to

your children, they can't even make

themselves think like you did growing up

where you grew up and how you grew up, right?

right?

So, it's like

they they all live like that because

while Kabib I I want to see Kabib's son

and then the next Islam's son

then we could see if how it does over

there because for them it was the way to live,

live, right?

right?

And change all of their liv

So when my kids like playing football

and he's like I want to do this and I

want to do this. I go well you got to be

at every practice. You got to go with

your individual coach.

Like you got to go on Sunday whenever

you go do all your speed and agility.

You have to get up early in the morning

to lift weights. I go because while you

are living where you live and how you

live, there's a kid like me

that's doing the same thing but without

the fallback of what my dad did to make

sure that I'm okay when all this is done,

done, right?

right?

So I don't know that we can h how how

does Christian McCaffrey develop the

mentality that his father had? Unless

his father came with a whole promote,

you know, Ed, maybe he had a whole bunch

of money,

but I don't know how does he develop

that mentality?

I'm a firm believer when I look at the Mannings.

Mannings.

Yep. them.

Argie Manning and and and his his and

Peyton and Eli,

they just teach him. Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, it it's it's something special

for you to for your dad to have and

says, "No, I want to get it." See, I

still have a healthy respect for Bronnie.

Bronnie. Yes.

Yes.

Because he still, you know, he the

likelihood of you having a historically

or a transcendent great parent and then

the child be equally as transcendent and

great, it's just not going to happen.

is great. King Griffy King Griffy senior

was a good baseball player, but he

wasn't junior.

No, he wasn't.

Bobby Barnes was an unbelievable player.

He wasn't Barry. Nope.

Nope. Nope.

Nope.

And so to ask Kareem had son, Magic got

son. To ask their sons, their product to

be just what your dad, it ain't happening.

happening.

So for the dad for for Ken Griffy Jr.

and Barry, their dads were good. Yes.

Yes.

They they just weren't them.

They weren't them. So the second one was

better. But to ask the next one to be

better than the one that's the greatest.

Just imagine Barry Bond's son being

Barry Bonds or better.

No, it's like it's like Vladimir Guerrero.

Guerrero. Yeah,

Yeah,

he was really good. But his son now is

with the same name. Yes.

Yes.

With the same name better than his dad.

That's crazy. So for him to have another

one that does that will be very hard.

But like so

where's like where's Pton's son?

Where's Eli's son? He Pton said his son

went through his camp a couple weeks

ago. I saw that. Yes.

Yes.

But is he

It's gonna be It's gonna be It's gonna

be very I mean, come on.

It's gonna be hard.

Yes. Tom Tom has a son. Yep.

Yep.

But you But here's the thing.

But is Yeah. Right. So just imagine Tom

Brady Tom Brady's son Benjamin

being as good as Tom.

God ain't going to bless you like that,

bro. I'm sorry.

Well, he ain't going to b he ain't going

to bless you like that. That's not

It's I don't think so, man. It's hard. Yes.

Yes.

But they can like like But even for

LeBron James Jr. Yes.

Yes.

LeBron James Jr. Yes.

Yes.

to be in the NBA. Mhm.

Mhm.

It's nuts. And then to have another one

that's supposed to be even better than

the other one.

Yes. But to to to expect him and I think the thing is

the thing is LeBron's done everything right.

LeBron's done everything right. Yes. But to expect a child to be LeBron

Yes. But to expect a child to be LeBron or Kareem's son to be him or Magic son

or Kareem's son to be him or Magic son to be him, come on, bro. That's not

to be him, come on, bro. That's not that's not to happen.

that's not to happen. LeBron James Jr. If he can go in, if he

LeBron James Jr. If he can go in, if he can stay in the league for 10 years,

can stay in the league for 10 years, that to me would be astounding because

that to me would be astounding because And he will. He will.

And he will. He will. Yes.

Yes. But to be in there 10 years after what

But to be in there 10 years after what your dad did with all that pressure,

your dad did with all that pressure, from the moment he picked up a

from the moment he picked up a basketball, there was pressure on him

basketball, there was pressure on him cuz the expectation you got to be cuz

cuz the expectation you got to be cuz everybody know who your dad is. My son

everybody know who your dad is. My son would wrestle and I would see people,

would wrestle and I would see people, oh, he just I just my kid just beat DC's

oh, he just I just my kid just beat DC's son. I'm like, but it's not that DC.

son. I'm like, but it's not that DC. It's not. You didn't, right? I just beat

It's not. You didn't, right? I just beat DC's boy.

DC's boy. I had Kim Griffy Jr. on and when his son

I had Kim Griffy Jr. on and when his son Trey was coming up, he played baseball.

Trey was coming up, he played baseball. And the people in the stand would say,

And the people in the stand would say, "He ain't his dad." And his dad would

"He ain't his dad." And his dad would say, "Name five people who are." Who?

say, "Name five people who are." Who? [Laughter]

[Laughter] Oh, I like that. So, what did what they

Oh, I like that. So, what did what they what would they say then?

what would they say then? They couldn't say anything. I mean I

They couldn't say anything. I mean I mean guy would you know he was an MVP.

mean guy would you know he was an MVP. He I mean he

He I mean he he did everything.

he did everything. Yes. He's one of the greatest he he's

Yes. He's one of the greatest he he's one of the greatest players. I mean the

one of the greatest players. I mean the sweetest swing ever. 600 home. Come on.

sweetest swing ever. 600 home. Come on. He ain't going to be him.

He ain't going to be him. No. And it's and it's okay. But the kid

No. And it's and it's okay. But the kid has to uh accept that that it's okay.

has to uh accept that that it's okay. And a lot of people you you were having

And a lot of people you you were having we were having a conversation about my

we were having a conversation about my brother. I embraced it. See, I never

brother. I embraced it. See, I never lived in the shadow. I embraced it.

lived in the shadow. I embraced it. Every number he had, I got the exact

Every number he had, I got the exact same number. He was three in high

same number. He was three in high school, I was three in high school. He

school, I was three in high school. He was two in college, I was two in

was two in college, I was two in college. He was 84, I was 84. Every car

college. He was 84, I was 84. Every car that he had, I got.

that he had, I got. So, I never looked at like And when

So, I never looked at like And when people told me, I man, you're not going

people told me, I man, you're not going to be like your brother. Like, watch

to be like your brother. Like, watch watch me

watch me watch.

watch. But not many people have that.

But not many people have that. Yeah. Yeah. They they

Yeah. Yeah. They they Not many people have that dog in them

Not many people have that dog in them like that. Like there's there's a dog

like that. Like there's there's a dog about that mentality that most people

about that mentality that most people don't have. Yes.

don't have. Yes. Especially kid Especially a kid that

Especially kid Especially a kid that wakes up and he's sleeping in a

wakes up and he's sleeping in a beautiful home

beautiful home with everything he'd ever want in his

with everything he'd ever want in his life. Like it's hard for that kid to go.

life. Like it's hard for that kid to go. My kid gets up in the morning at 6:30,

My kid gets up in the morning at 6:30, three days a week and he lifts weights,

three days a week and he lifts weights, right?

right? My kid does wrestling practice at 2:00

My kid does wrestling practice at 2:00 in the afternoon. Then he goes to

in the afternoon. Then he goes to football practice at 5:30 in the

football practice at 5:30 in the afternoon. He does that four days a

afternoon. He does that four days a week. Then on Sundays, he meets with a

week. Then on Sundays, he meets with a with with his private coach to do

with with his private coach to do football training, right? where he does

football training, right? where he does speed, agility, right? He catches

speed, agility, right? He catches passes. He goes through his coverages

passes. He goes through his coverages and his reads,

and his reads, right?

right? For me, that's my son going, "Dad, I

For me, that's my son going, "Dad, I want to try to do something great."

want to try to do something great." I said, "Pop, if it works, awesome. If

I said, "Pop, if it works, awesome. If it doesn't, you gave yourself a chance.

it doesn't, you gave yourself a chance. That's it.

That's it. You took advantage of every opportunity

You took advantage of every opportunity you had. Everything that we have

you had. Everything that we have accured, you use to try to better

accured, you use to try to better yourself,

yourself, right?

right? If it works, great. If it doesn't, you

If it works, great. If it doesn't, you never skipped out on the work, right?

never skipped out on the work, right? That's all I care about,

That's all I care about, right?

right? And I'm fine with that. And maybe it

And I'm fine with that. And maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. But he's given

does, maybe it doesn't. But he's given himself a chance even though he doesn't

himself a chance even though he doesn't have to.

have to. Right.

Right. That's what I love.

That's what I love. Good. Let me ask you, how did you and

Good. Let me ask you, how did you and Kabib become such great fans?

Kabib become such great fans? That's my boy right there, man. He

That's my boy right there, man. He walked into the gym. He walked into the

walked into the gym. He walked into the gym by himself.

gym by himself. King Moal

King Moal uh brought him from New Jersey. Mhm.

uh brought him from New Jersey. Mhm. He wanted to come and train with all the

He wanted to come and train with all the wrestlers. Barely spoke a lick of

wrestlers. Barely spoke a lick of English.

English. Walked in the gym, stayed at uh Extended

Walked in the gym, stayed at uh Extended State America right up the street from

State America right up the street from from uh AKA. And he would walk back and

from uh AKA. And he would walk back and forth by himself from the the the hotel

forth by himself from the the the hotel to the practice. And on his first day, I

to the practice. And on his first day, I was like, "Oh, a little Russian kid."

was like, "Oh, a little Russian kid." Cuz I spent a lot of time there when I

Cuz I spent a lot of time there when I was wrestling. We started kind of

was wrestling. We started kind of talking a little bit and it just it

talking a little bit and it just it grew. And then I just understand how

grew. And then I just understand how much of a

much of a he's like a really good human being.

he's like a really good human being. He's a good person, real strong values,

He's a good person, real strong values, and he's he's the best. I think I think

and he's he's the best. I think I think he's the best fighter ever.

he's the best fighter ever. Really?

Really? I do. Yeah, I do. I I saw a kid that

I do. Yeah, I do. I I saw a kid that came in there with limited striking.

came in there with limited striking. Mhm.

Mhm. He told you exactly what he was going to

He told you exactly what he was going to do every single time and he did it. He

do every single time and he did it. He was beating Michael Johnson up one time

was beating Michael Johnson up one time telling him, "Brother, you know I

telling him, "Brother, you know I deserve a title fight, right?

deserve a title fight, right? You need to give up.

You need to give up. Give up."

Give up." Like,

Like, yeah,

yeah, that's how dominant. And he sat in the

that's how dominant. And he sat in the pocket with Connor and knocked Connor

pocket with Connor and knocked Connor down.

down. Knocked him down after Connor had boxed

Knocked him down after Connor had boxed Floyd Mayweather for nine rounds. He he

Floyd Mayweather for nine rounds. He he stood with him and knocked him down.

stood with him and knocked him down. Yeah, I think he's the best man. I think

Yeah, I think he's the best man. I think he's

he's he just stands for something so much

he just stands for something so much bigger than just fighting. And I think

bigger than just fighting. And I think he like I think he I think he uh

he like I think he I think he uh I think he he I think he obviously

I think he he I think he obviously elevates the people around him, which is

elevates the people around him, which is very important.

very important. But he also is like a he's like a

But he also is like a he's like a guiding light for a lot of people that

guiding light for a lot of people that follow him. And he does things the right

follow him. And he does things the right way.

way. Right. There's this viral clip going

Right. There's this viral clip going around that he refuses to shake this

around that he refuses to shake this this lady's hand out of respect for his

this lady's hand out of respect for his wife.

wife. Yep. And for his uh his religion his

Yep. And for his uh his religion his religion.

religion. And if you know his religion, that's

And if you know his religion, that's that's that's the way it is.

that's that's the way it is. That's the way it is.

That's the way it is. Right. But not many men are willing to

Right. But not many men are willing to do that, especially in that moment.

do that, especially in that moment. Right.

Right. Right. Kate Kate uh Kate Scott. Kate

Right. Kate Kate uh Kate Scott. Kate Kate Scott.

Kate Scott. She's she's a great analyst.

She's she's a great analyst. Yes. But I think the reason it got so

Yes. But I think the reason it got so odd was because that kid reacted the way

odd was because that kid reacted the way that he did.

that he did. There was a YouTube kid that was up

There was a YouTube kid that was up there with him

there with him and he kind of was like, "Oh my god."

and he kind of was like, "Oh my god." Like speed. I show speed.

Like speed. I show speed. Yeah.

Yeah. And the way he acted was like cuz he

And the way he acted was like cuz he shook everyone's hand. But then he just

shook everyone's hand. But then he just politely said

politely said and then I'm pretty sure he explained it

and then I'm pretty sure he explained it to her afterwards.

to her afterwards. Yes.

Yes. And then but again it's live. It's live

And then but again it's live. It's live TV, right? Things happen.

TV, right? Things happen. But that's respect to his wife. And then

But that's respect to his wife. And then obvious honestly respect to Kate. It's

obvious honestly respect to Kate. It's actually a respectful gesture to the

actually a respectful gesture to the person, right? You're refusing to shake

person, right? You're refusing to shake hands because he as a married man should

hands because he as a married man should not shake the hand of another woman.

not shake the hand of another woman. Wow.

Wow. What separate Russian fighters from

What separate Russian fighters from American fighters?

American fighters? I don't think that I don't think that I

I don't think that I don't think that I I don't think that is much more to it

I don't think that is much more to it than just the the

than just the the that that need to change their lives.

that that need to change their lives. Yeah.

Yeah. Right. Their need. I mean,

Right. Their need. I mean, even even in not not I'm not talking

even even in not not I'm not talking homeless like I'm not talking like

homeless like I'm not talking like transient people that are living on the

transient people that are living on the street, but even our upbringing, even

street, but even our upbringing, even mine where I lived in uh small house

mine where I lived in uh small house after small house when I was younger.

after small house when I was younger. Yeah.

Yeah. Then my parents did all they could to

Then my parents did all they could to move us into a big house to where they

move us into a big house to where they bought their first house for $10,000. It

bought their first house for $10,000. It wasn't a great house, but it was theirs.

wasn't a great house, but it was theirs. that's still better

that's still better than what they have

than what they have than what they have over there.

than what they have over there. They're like it's all concrete just

They're like it's all concrete just concrete stuff.

concrete stuff. So yeah, it's like I think it's just

So yeah, it's like I think it's just that mentality of need to get better

that mentality of need to get better that makes allows for those guys to to

that makes allows for those guys to to kind of just elevate themselves a little

kind of just elevate themselves a little more because even my upbringing and I

more because even my upbringing and I thought that I had it tough

thought that I had it tough was better than what they have there and

was better than what they have there and you know what we people are willing to

you know what we people are willing to do to change their lives

do to change their lives for sure.

for sure. Yeah. Um, you and Connor went back and

Yeah. Um, you and Connor went back and forth on social media, but you said it's

forth on social media, but you said it's over for Connor. I mean, the money the

over for Connor. I mean, the money the money that he made from Floyd, the money

money that he made from Floyd, the money that he's made off his alcohol, the

that he's made off his alcohol, the money that he that he's making now to go

money that he that he's making now to go back into I mean, you're worth $300

back into I mean, you're worth $300 million to go in there and it's like,

million to go in there and it's like, you know what? I want to get kicked in

you know what? I want to get kicked in my face, hit in my face, elbowed in my

my face, hit in my face, elbowed in my face. Need

face. Need Yeah. There's no need there. Yeah. He

Yeah. There's no need there. Yeah. He doesn't need that. He doesn't need this

doesn't need that. He doesn't need this anymore.

anymore. Marvin Haggler said, "It's hard to get

Marvin Haggler said, "It's hard to get up in the morning when you're sleeping

up in the morning when you're sleeping on satin sheets." Right. Way back in the

on satin sheets." Right. Way back in the day.

day. Yes.

Yes. There there are a few sayings in the

There there are a few sayings in the world that are untrue. Yeah. That was

world that are untrue. Yeah. That was right.

right. Like that that you know that one where

Like that that you know that one where it's like

it's like to be the champion, you got to defend

to be the champion, you got to defend the belt. That's [ __ ] Ric Flair

the belt. That's [ __ ] Ric Flair started that.

started that. To beat a man, you got to beat

To beat a man, you got to beat Yeah. Ric Flair started that, man.

Yeah. Ric Flair started that, man. That's

That's I'll be I'll beat the man that beat the

I'll be I'll beat the man that beat the man and be just as happy.

man and be just as happy. Give me one belt. The moment they put

Give me one belt. The moment they put that belt on you, you're the champion.

that belt on you, you're the champion. But fighters have actually believed that

But fighters have actually believed that Connor it's it's the the the and he's

Connor it's it's the the the and he's one of the biggest superstars in the

one of the biggest superstars in the world. He can't walk into any room

world. He can't walk into any room without everybody knowing who he is. So

without everybody knowing who he is. So the access he has,

the access he has, how's he going to look past all of that

how's he going to look past all of that to go in to a training camp to fight,

to go in to a training camp to fight, right?

right? Especially if he wants to do it right.

Especially if he wants to do it right. Francis Enanu um he was in the UFC, he

Francis Enanu um he was in the UFC, he left. Yeah, it seems to be there's some

left. Yeah, it seems to be there's some speculation that he might be wanting to

speculation that he might be wanting to come back.

come back. There was this talk about Francis

There was this talk about Francis fighting John.

fighting John. Yep.

Yep. Would you like to see that fight?

Would you like to see that fight? I I would have. I would have.

I I would have. I would have. Not now.

Not now. I would now still. Back then I wanted to

I would now still. Back then I wanted to because Francis in his last fight

because Francis in his last fight against Sirill uh he his wrestling

against Sirill uh he his wrestling looked better.

looked better. But I do believe that if if he fought

But I do believe that if if he fought Jon that's a more serviceable fight for

Jon that's a more serviceable fight for Jon because Jon can wrestle, man.

Jon because Jon can wrestle, man. Yes. And he probably would just take

Yes. And he probably would just take Francis down.

Francis down. Yeah. You don't want to stay toeto toe

Yeah. You don't want to stay toeto toe with him.

with him. No. And dude, do you remember when he

No. And dude, do you remember when he would elbow people in back in the day?

would elbow people in back in the day? Like

Like he just I think Francis would have have

he just I think Francis would have have to knock him out. But Francis could

to knock him out. But Francis could knock people out, man. I've never seen

knock people out, man. I've never seen anybody hit harder than Franc.

anybody hit harder than Franc. Yeah, he got power.

Yeah, he got power. He's got the most power seen in my life.

He's got the most power seen in my life. He be knocking dudes. Oh, he hit

He be knocking dudes. Oh, he hit Alistister over and his head.

Alistister over and his head. The back of his head touched between his

The back of his head touched between his shoulders. He hit him with an uppercut.

shoulders. He hit him with an uppercut. the back of his head touched between his

the back of his head touched between his shoulders as he was falling down.

shoulders as he was falling down. I've never seen anything like it.

I've never seen anything like it. But Press is boxed because okay, he uh

But Press is boxed because okay, he uh Tyson Fury and it gave him some

Tyson Fury and it gave him some confidence and then he end up fighting

confidence and then he end up fighting an Anthony Joshua. He got knocked out,

an Anthony Joshua. He got knocked out, but he made some money. I mean,

but he made some money. I mean, yep. He's the only one that's actually

yep. He's the only one that's actually done that and it worked out because he

done that and it worked out because he was a heavyweight champ,

was a heavyweight champ, right?

right? And and Shannon,

And and Shannon, he looks like the heavyweight champ.

he looks like the heavyweight champ. Yeah. when he became the champion, I was

Yeah. when he became the champion, I was like, "Okay, look at him

like, "Okay, look at him now. You look like you're looking at the

now. You look like you're looking at the baddest man on the planet."

baddest man on the planet." Yes, absolutely.

Yes, absolutely. You right. You looking like this dude

You right. You looking like this dude Francen Ganu looks like he walk into any

Francen Ganu looks like he walk into any place and you go, "Well, that's a dude

place and you go, "Well, that's a dude I'm not trying to ain't messing with

I'm not trying to ain't messing with you."

you." And he had he had it. So when he moved

And he had he had it. So when he moved over, it worked. He was the heavyweight

over, it worked. He was the heavyweight champ. Yeah.

champ. Yeah. But [ __ ] he dropped Tyson Fury. Yeah.

But [ __ ] he dropped Tyson Fury. Yeah. Remember he knocked him out. I thought

Remember he knocked him out. I thought it was over.

it was over. Yeah,

Yeah, man. You should I exploded out of my

man. You should I exploded out of my chair.

chair. But then Anthony Joshua beat him bad.

But then Anthony Joshua beat him bad. Right. And you saw when Joshua dropped

Right. And you saw when Joshua dropped him, the difference in a boxer and a guy

him, the difference in a boxer and a guy that cuz Francis was like this, he

that cuz Francis was like this, he needed to grab him.

needed to grab him. He got flatlined.

He got flatlined. And the thing is is that boxers

And the thing is is that boxers understand how to faint.

understand how to faint. Yep.

Yep. And

And when he gave him that faint, when he

when he gave him that faint, when he gave him that faint, Francis went

gave him that faint, Francis went boom. I was like, "Oh my god."

boom. I was like, "Oh my god." Yeah. And

Yeah. And boxer, a boxer throwing a punch in MMA.

boxer, a boxer throwing a punch in MMA. Look, I understand that, you know, they

Look, I understand that, you know, they both hit hard, but boxers, it's just

both hit hard, but boxers, it's just something about that punch and where

something about that punch and where it's coming from. I mean, it's

it's coming from. I mean, it's Shannon, I went train one time in

Shannon, I went train one time in Oakland when I first started boxing gym.

Oakland when I first started boxing gym. They hit you with a jab and it's like,

They hit you with a jab and it's like, what the hell was that?

what the hell was that? Because they know how to punch.

Because they know how to punch. Yeah.

Yeah. And they sit on everything. Yeah. Boom.

And they sit on everything. Yeah. Boom. Boom. It's not jab, jab, touch to try to

Boom. It's not jab, jab, touch to try to take you down.

take you down. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm just mad in there getting my ass

I'm just mad in there getting my ass whooped. I'm like, "Yo, I want I can

whooped. I'm like, "Yo, I want I can beat everybody up in here." I'll start

beat everybody up in here." I'll start wrestling every one of you fools. They

wrestling every one of you fools. They like pissed off because the dudes just

like pissed off because the dudes just putting it on you. They just putting it

putting it on you. They just putting it on you cuz you there's nothing you could

on you cuz you there's nothing you could do.

do. Why do you fight Brock Brock Lesnar?

Why do you fight Brock Brock Lesnar? The WWE got him. The WWE took him back.

The WWE got him. The WWE took him back. It was That was my golden goose, man. We

It was That was my golden goose, man. We had that moment in the ring. I pushed

had that moment in the ring. I pushed him. He pushed me. WWE paid him back.

him. He pushed me. WWE paid him back. They They were paying Brock like six,

They They were paying Brock like six, seven million a year, maybe 10,

seven million a year, maybe 10, right? You telling me, Brock, you can go

right? You telling me, Brock, you can go fight DC and lose or you can come.

fight DC and lose or you can come. Who say you going to lose?

Who say you going to lose? I'm beating Brock Lesnar, man. I was

I'm beating Brock Lesnar, man. I was beating Brock.

beating Brock. That was a big dude, man. Safe coach.

That was a big dude, man. Safe coach. Don't matter, dog. Shay, I was beating

Don't matter, dog. Shay, I was beating Brock Lesnar.

Brock Lesnar. It was one of the safest fights I could

It was one of the safest fights I could have had.

have had. I'm telling you, dog. That's the truth.

I'm telling you, dog. That's the truth. It's just the truth. I like Brock, too.

It's just the truth. I like Brock, too. He's like, he's a great guy. But

He's like, he's a great guy. But I watch what Kane did to him. I watch

I watch what Kane did to him. I watch how he would react to getting punched,

how he would react to getting punched, right?

right? And I was going to punch him. He would

And I was going to punch him. He would have to take me down,

have to take me down, right,

right, to win the fight. And I can wrestle.

to win the fight. And I can wrestle. Yeah, but he's not a wrestler. I mean,

Yeah, but he's not a wrestler. I mean, he was a wrestler, but he was, but

he was a wrestler, but he was, but but if he shoots on me, I'm I'mma make

but if he shoots on me, I'm I'mma make it so hard for him to get that take down

it so hard for him to get that take down that by the time he gets it.

that by the time he gets it. Yeah.

Yeah. He's exhausted. Now I'm up to my feet.

He's exhausted. Now I'm up to my feet. Then you're done. That's why Kane, he

Then you're done. That's why Kane, he took Kane down. Kane got up, started

took Kane down. Kane got up, started kneing him in his face. I saw Brock

kneing him in his face. I saw Brock recently, he still has that scar under

recently, he still has that scar under his eye. Really?

his eye. Really? From when Kane kne him in the face. Yep.

From when Kane kne him in the face. Yep. Still got that big scar on his eye.

Still got that big scar on his eye. Damn.

Damn. It's crazy. It's crazy. Is it true you

It's crazy. It's crazy. Is it true you got a scholarship to LSU?

got a scholarship to LSU? I I got like offers back then, but I had

I I got like offers back then, but I had bad grades and I just was not going to

bad grades and I just was not going to college to play football,

college to play football, right?

right? It was hard to

It was hard to It was hard for me in the school that I

It was hard for me in the school that I was in to

was in to First off, there's way too much pressure

First off, there's way too much pressure on football down there in Louisiana.

on football down there in Louisiana. Bad.

Bad. Yeah.

Yeah. And we weren't very good.

And we weren't very good. But I mean, I was the the all state MVP

But I mean, I was the the all state MVP defensively. I was pretty much missed

defensively. I was pretty much missed everything in football

everything in football because I was a good little linebacker,

because I was a good little linebacker, right? But I was small, right? And they

right? But I was small, right? And they were talking about me playing cornerback

were talking about me playing cornerback or or free safet safety.

or or free safet safety. I was like, how I'm supposed to tra how

I was like, how I'm supposed to tra how much chase Randy Moss? I mean, you know,

much chase Randy Moss? I mean, you know, so like I'm not smart,

so like I'm not smart, right?

right? I didn't really know the difference

I didn't really know the difference between strong safety is more like a

between strong safety is more like a linebacker.

linebacker. Yes. Yeah.

Yes. Yeah. But I was think but I was thinking I'm

But I was think but I was thinking I'm going to be chasing dudes like Randy

going to be chasing dudes like Randy Moss cuz he was graduating the same

Moss cuz he was graduating the same year. I was like

year. I was like there's no way.

there's no way. No, I'm good. Yeah. I was like, I'm g

No, I'm good. Yeah. I was like, I'm g just go wrestle, man. I'm good. I did. I

just go wrestle, man. I'm good. I did. I I got an offer to go play football.

I got an offer to go play football. You was in Hershel Walker's Colonel uh

You was in Hershel Walker's Colonel uh corner. Yes.

corner. Yes. MMA.

MMA. Yes.

Yes. Could Hershel made a career out of that

Could Hershel made a career out of that or he did what he was supposed to do.

or he did what he was supposed to do. Have one fight and move it along.

Have one fight and move it along. Shannon, I got to tell you, man.

Shannon, I got to tell you, man. Is he Was he really the great? He was

Is he Was he really the great? He was the great He's one of the greatest

the great He's one of the greatest athletes, wasn't he?

athletes, wasn't he? Yeah, he was. Yeah. Shannon, this man

Yeah, he was. Yeah. Shannon, this man was so strong, but I don't think I've

was so strong, but I don't think I've ever seen anybody like He was very

ever seen anybody like He was very stiff.

stiff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He had no

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He had no flexibility.

flexibility. Oh, he was even in football.

Oh, he was even in football. Yeah. He's stiff. Yeah,

Yeah. He's stiff. Yeah, bro. He was so stiff,

bro. He was so stiff, but when he hit you Oh, and then he

but when he hit you Oh, and then he would like move his feet. He would move

would like move his feet. He would move his feet, but they never left the

his feet, but they never left the ground. They never left the ground, bro.

ground. They never left the ground, bro. Hersel would be walking towards you like

Hersel would be walking towards you like this. So when this when when this man

this. So when this when when this man would hit you sometime he shock you. You

would hit you sometime he shock you. You know how you rub your feet. Yeah.

know how you rub your feet. Yeah. Sometime H was shocking dudes.

Sometime H was shocking dudes. Hey. And then we're in the back. I swear

Hey. And then we're in the back. I swear to God it was the most

to God it was the most Hershel Walker is a different

Hershel Walker is a different individual.

individual. Mhm.

Mhm. Hershel Walker has had some stuff in his

Hershel Walker has had some stuff in his life where it's like his anger,

life where it's like his anger, but if you meet him, you you met him for

but if you meet him, you you met him for sure.

sure. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah, for sure. He is the nicest person.

He is the nicest person. We were all broke back in the day.

We were all broke back in the day. Hersha was staying at the

Hersha was staying at the Intercontinental or what was the name of

Intercontinental or what was the name of that hotel?

that hotel? Downtown San Jose.

Downtown San Jose. No, but it was it was called something

No, but it was it was called something else before. It was a nice one. But

else before. It was a nice one. But Hershel owned a chicken company. You

Hershel owned a chicken company. You know, Hersel owns that chicken.

know, Hersel owns that chicken. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One of the biggest ones in the country.

One of the biggest ones in the country. Yes, he does.

Yes, he does. But because of that, they service that

But because of that, they service that that restaurant down there. So Hershel

that restaurant down there. So Hershel got free rooms at this beautiful hotel

got free rooms at this beautiful hotel downtown San Jose. He would feed us all,

downtown San Jose. He would feed us all, but he wouldn't eat. He would eat one

but he wouldn't eat. He would eat one time a day, bro. He would he would eat

time a day, bro. He would he would eat soup and bread and some eggs. So, I'm

soup and bread and some eggs. So, I'm like, "Yo, this is the nicest guy ever.

like, "Yo, this is the nicest guy ever. Multi-millionaire, rich, nice football

Multi-millionaire, rich, nice football hall of famer."

hall of famer." We got at the ring

We got at the ring or in the hallway to walk and, bro,

or in the hallway to walk and, bro, something flipped on him. I said, "This

something flipped on him. I said, "This is this this dude is dark." I was like,

is this this dude is dark." I was like, "It's a dark son of a gun, bro." He

"It's a dark son of a gun, bro." He started talking to himself, talking

started talking to himself, talking about, "I'm going kill this

about, "I'm going kill this motherfucker." They don't do talking

motherfucker." They don't do talking about killing this dude.

about killing this dude. Wow.

Wow. He to get himself there,

He to get himself there, right?

right? He went there.

He went there. I was like, yo, I've heard people like

I was like, yo, I've heard people like talk to himself to hyped himself up.

talk to himself to hyped himself up. Hershel was on a whole another level. It

Hershel was on a whole another level. It was the most intense thing I've ever

was the most intense thing I've ever seen in my life. And he went out there

seen in my life. And he went out there and he won. Wow.

and he won. Wow. He was He was over 40.

He was He was over 40. Yeah.

Yeah. He was over 40. Retired from football

He was over 40. Retired from football for many, many years. Went in there, did

for many, many years. Went in there, did his thing, and won a US won a fight in

his thing, and won a US won a fight in Strike Force, which at the time was the

Strike Force, which at the time was the second biggest organization of all time.

second biggest organization of all time. But bro, to see him go to that place,

But bro, to see him go to that place, Shannon.

Shannon. Yeah.

Yeah. You You'd be like, "Yo, this dude is

You You'd be like, "Yo, this dude is crazy." I look back at the other dudes.

crazy." I look back at the other dudes. I was like, "Are y'all seeing this?

I was like, "Are y'all seeing this? Everybody acting normal." Hers was

Everybody acting normal." Hers was talking about killing mother.

talking about killing mother. Hers about killing people.

Hers about killing people. Did you ever think about doing WWE?

Did you ever think about doing WWE? So, I thought about it right after I was

So, I thought about it right after I was wrestling, but then it's hard. People

wrestling, but then it's hard. People talk about that stuff being fake. Hey,

talk about that stuff being fake. Hey, man. It's scripted.

man. It's scripted. Yeah. But

Yeah. But it hurts.

it hurts. Yeah. Oh, those falls hurt. You fall.

Yeah. Oh, those falls hurt. You fall. You got to throw your arms back.

You got to throw your arms back. Yeah.

Yeah. So, every time it's like it's like

So, every time it's like it's like slapping against a uh the ring.

slapping against a uh the ring. Yeah.

Yeah. Or when you run the ropes,

Or when you run the ropes, those robes they burn you. Like it's

those robes they burn you. Like it's it's it's hard, man. And that's why you

it's it's hard, man. And that's why you see them all break down like that.

see them all break down like that. Yeah.

Yeah. Like they're all like they're all like

Like they're all like they're all like messed up. Like their their knees don't

messed up. Like their their knees don't work. They're they're like football

work. They're they're like football players and us. Y'all got it hard.

players and us. Y'all got it hard. Football's hard, man.

Football's hard, man. The the the wear and tear on the body is

The the the wear and tear on the body is is crazy. And so is MMA in wrestling.

is crazy. And so is MMA in wrestling. I'm I'm one of the lucky ones. I feel

I'm I'm one of the lucky ones. I feel like I got out pretty clean,

like I got out pretty clean, right?

right? Derrick Lewis.

Derrick Lewis. Yeah. Back beast,

Yeah. Back beast, bro.

bro. He come in there to do one thing. You

He come in there to do one thing. You already know. He ain't trying to take

already know. He ain't trying to take you down. He ain't tried to kick you. He

you down. He ain't tried to kick you. He ain't tried to knee you. He ain't trying

ain't tried to knee you. He ain't trying to elbow you.

to elbow you. Trying to knock you out.

Trying to knock you out. He tried to knock you out.

He tried to knock you out. The knockout kick.

The knockout kick. That's it.

That's it. He got more knockouts than anybody in

He got more knockouts than anybody in the history of the UFC. He hits hard. I

the history of the UFC. He hits hard. I fought him. He hits hard. When he hit

fought him. He hits hard. When he hit me, I was holding his leg up.

me, I was holding his leg up. Yeah.

Yeah. And he just kind of went like this and

And he just kind of went like this and it skimmed down my eye. Next day, I woke

it skimmed down my eye. Next day, I woke up with a big old black eye.

up with a big old black eye. Wow.

Wow. He kicked me. I had knots all in my my

He kicked me. I had knots all in my my forearms. He He was But he knocks these

forearms. He He was But he knocks these dudes out, man. He knows exactly.

dudes out, man. He knows exactly. Hey yo, did you see him a couple weeks

Hey yo, did you see him a couple weeks ago?

ago? Mhm.

Mhm. Did you see his poor wife in there, man?

Did you see his poor wife in there, man? Did you

Did you Did you see her? He about to cry if he

Did you see her? He about to cry if he didn't you see his wife. She was in

didn't you see his wife. She was in there so embarrassed and the camera pans

there so embarrassed and the camera pans to her.

to her. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm in there interviewing this man. I'm

I'm in there interviewing this man. I'm like I'm like this dude Derek about to

like I'm like this dude Derek about to say some crazy stuff.

say some crazy stuff. Yeah.

Yeah. And he go I go what do you who you want

And he go I go what do you who you want to fight next? Like what do you want

to fight next? Like what do you want next? He looks over at his wife like

next? He looks over at his wife like going to be a lot of ground and pound

going to be a lot of ground and pound going. I was like boy. And she got stand

going. I was like boy. And she got stand there and try to stay composed knowing

there and try to stay composed knowing that Derek's out of his mind.

that Derek's out of his mind. But you were the first man to submitted.

But you were the first man to submitted. I did. Yeah. I couldn't wrestle. It was

I did. Yeah. I couldn't wrestle. It was why I fought him. They called me three

why I fought him. They called me three weeks before the fight to to fight him,

weeks before the fight to to fight him, right? And uh

right? And uh you like, "Sure."

you like, "Sure." Yeah.

Yeah. Easy money.

Easy money. Yeah. I knew I knew he couldn't wrestle.

Yeah. I knew I knew he couldn't wrestle. So

So I knew

I knew his his uh his cardio.

his his uh his cardio. And if if I can extend him, he would get

And if if I can extend him, he would get tired,

tired, right?

right? But yeah, just if you couldn't wrestle

But yeah, just if you couldn't wrestle like I was fighting you.

like I was fighting you. Yeah. But you got to get I mean you got

Yeah. But you got to get I mean you got to get past those three rounds cuz you

to get past those three rounds cuz you let him get you in the first round.

let him get you in the first round. Yeah. He hit you and knock you out. But

Yeah. He hit you and knock you out. But I just shot on him right away.

I just shot on him right away. Right.

Right. Right. because he was so inexperienced

Right. because he was so inexperienced with his wrestling

with his wrestling that I like backed him up and just

that I like backed him up and just grabbed his leg.

grabbed his leg. Right.

Right. That's one thing I learned fighting the

That's one thing I learned fighting the heavier guys.

heavier guys. Yeah.

Yeah. They don't balance well on their feet.

They don't balance well on their feet. Right.

Right. So, I would just kind of move him around

So, I would just kind of move him around until they fell down.

until they fell down. Wow. Learned something new. Who Who's

Wow. Learned something new. Who Who's the hardest puncher?

the hardest puncher? What's the hardest punch you've taken?

What's the hardest punch you've taken? Who Who hit you hard?

Who Who hit you hard? Probably Dan Henderson. That little

Probably Dan Henderson. That little dude. He was like he was made of

dude. He was like he was made of concrete.

concrete. Damn.

Damn. Hendo. He hit so hard. He He hit me on

Hendo. He hit so hard. He He hit me on He was on his back

He was on his back and he hit me and he uh knocked out one

and he hit me and he uh knocked out one of my bottom teeth. I had to go to like

of my bottom teeth. I had to go to like an emergency dentist.

an emergency dentist. Damn.

Damn. On Labor Day on Memorial Day after he

On Labor Day on Memorial Day after he hit me from the bottom. He hit hard.

hit me from the bottom. He hit hard. Even from in close, he would just

Even from in close, he would just crazy.

crazy. Obviously, there are things that you

Obviously, there are things that you can't do, but are there dirty things

can't do, but are there dirty things that guy, you know, you're not supposed

that guy, you know, you're not supposed to eye gouge somebody and you're not

to eye gouge somebody and you're not obviously you can't bite, you can't do

obviously you can't bite, you can't do certain things, but there's certain

certain things, but there's certain things that guys do that the ref can't

things that guys do that the ref can't see.

see. I always had a trick where when I would

I always had a trick where when I would get on top of them, I would always cover

get on top of them, I would always cover their mouth. I would literally try to

their mouth. I would literally try to smother him.

smother him. Damn, DC.

Damn, DC. Yeah, I know. Nasty.

Yeah, I know. Nasty. Dirty.

Dirty. Josh Barnett. That's not dirty. is like

Josh Barnett. That's not dirty. is like I'm just trying to like Josh Barnett

I'm just trying to like Josh Barnett would like always like kind of if you

would like always like kind of if you let him go behind you his hand was going

let him go behind you his hand was going like

like Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Them dudes they they they do

Yeah. Yeah. Them dudes they they they do his life they trying his life or death

his life they trying his life or death out there. Shannon his life out there

out there. Shannon his life out there you like I saw Hey I fought Josh

you like I saw Hey I fought Josh Barnett. I was trying to take him down.

Barnett. I was trying to take him down. He was elbowing me. Boom. Boom. Cut me

He was elbowing me. Boom. Boom. Cut me wide open here. First fight I ever had a

wide open here. First fight I ever had a black eye. He needed me in the eye.

black eye. He needed me in the eye. Right.

Right. cutting my head open.

cutting my head open. When I was a kid, I was playing football

When I was a kid, I was playing football with the older kids. One dude closel

with the older kids. One dude closel line me, broke my collarbone.

line me, broke my collarbone. Yeah, it was bad in the dark.

Yeah, it was bad in the dark. I I walked to my mama house cuz I'm

I I walked to my mama house cuz I'm trying to be tough, right? I'm a young

trying to be tough, right? I'm a young kid. I can't cry. Soon as I saw my mom,

kid. I can't cry. Soon as I saw my mom, I fall on the ground. They put me in a

I fall on the ground. They put me in a cast, broken collarbone.

cast, broken collarbone. I fought Josh Barnett. My mom passed in

I fought Josh Barnett. My mom passed in 2022.

2022. When

When I fought Josh Barnett, I had won my

I fought Josh Barnett, I had won my first big world title, Strike Force.

first big world title, Strike Force. I was bloodied, man. My eye was open.

I was bloodied, man. My eye was open. Everything was they put stitches for the

Everything was they put stitches for the first time. I walked into the hotel and

first time. I walked into the hotel and uh I'm good taking pictures, everybody.

uh I'm good taking pictures, everybody. Oh, champ. The moment I saw my mama, I

Oh, champ. The moment I saw my mama, I start crying like a baby, man. I felt

start crying like a baby, man. I felt I'm in her lap like a seven-year-old kid

I'm in her lap like a seven-year-old kid again. Please make me feel better.

again. Please make me feel better. Right. That's how nasty he was in there,

Right. That's how nasty he was in there, dude. He was elbowing me. He was

dude. He was elbowing me. He was grabbing me. He was doing everything he

grabbing me. He was doing everything he could to just like inflict pain on me.

could to just like inflict pain on me. He does that. Jones does that. Certain

He does that. Jones does that. Certain guys just no matter where you are,

guys just no matter where you are, they're just trying to hurt you,

they're just trying to hurt you, right?

right? And like that's uh Yeah. But you got to

And like that's uh Yeah. But you got to be so wellrounded to do this thing now.

be so wellrounded to do this thing now. Yeah.

Yeah. If you aren't, you're screw. Look at

If you aren't, you're screw. Look at Ilia.

Ilia. He's a monster.

He's a monster. He's a monster. He's like he's he's one

He's a monster. He's like he's he's one of the best fighters of all time and

of the best fighters of all time and he's only fought eight times in the UFC.

he's only fought eight times in the UFC. Wow.

Wow. He's he's amaz these guys are amazing.

He's he's amaz these guys are amazing. What does it feel like to knock someone

What does it feel like to knock someone out? What does it feel like to get

out? What does it feel like to get knocked out? Because you I and I know

knocked out? Because you I and I know exactly what you're saying cuz I've been

exactly what you're saying cuz I've been knocked out and I can't remember

knocked out and I can't remember anything. I don't remember driving to

anything. I don't remember driving to the stadium. I don't remember what I had

the stadium. I don't remember what I had to eat. I don't remember anything. I

to eat. I don't remember anything. I just remember looking up at the

just remember looking up at the scoreboard and asking my teammate Rod

scoreboard and asking my teammate Rod Smith. I was like put we call him putts.

Smith. I was like put we call him putts. I say foots. How do we get the lead?

I say foots. How do we get the lead? Cuz I cuz I don't I don't I don't I

Cuz I cuz I don't I don't I don't I don't want to laugh.

don't want to laugh. No, no, but I'm like how do we cuz when

No, no, but I'm like how do we cuz when we I I just remember like we were losing

we I I just remember like we were losing before this happened and now it's the

before this happened and now it's the fourth quarter and I'm like what happens

fourth quarter and I'm like what happens if we win this game?

if we win this game? He said, "Boo, we go to the Super Bowl."

He said, "Boo, we go to the Super Bowl." I was like, "Yeah, yeah, we go to the

I was like, "Yeah, yeah, we go to the Super Bowl."

Super Bowl." But it's a it's a funny feeling

But it's a it's a funny feeling to get knocked out because you really

to get knocked out because you really don't remember anything. Hey, my coach

don't remember anything. Hey, my coach told me that is bad. I'm laughing

told me that is bad. I'm laughing because my coach told me. Was that the

because my coach told me. Was that the last time you asked? You probably asked

last time you asked? You probably asked him again.

him again. No, no, that was I was like,

No, no, that was I was like, "No, you probably asked him again."

"No, you probably asked him again." I started I was like I started jumping

I started I was like I started jumping up and down the side like, "Yeah, we

up and down the side like, "Yeah, we cuz we over at 14 with like 3 minutes to

cuz we over at 14 with like 3 minutes to go and we got the ball." So,

go and we got the ball." So, this this dude So, I get knocked out,

this this dude So, I get knocked out, right?

right? That was John when he kicked

That was John when he kicked when John kicked me and he hit me with

when John kicked me and he hit me with the followup shots, right? Only time I

the followup shots, right? Only time I knocked out

knocked out I'm crying, right? Yeah.

I'm crying, right? Yeah. I go to my corner. I ask my coach. I

I go to my corner. I ask my coach. I said, "What happened?"

said, "What happened?" He tells me.

He tells me. I break down crying, right?

I break down crying, right? Yeah.

Yeah. Rogan interviews me. As we're walking

Rogan interviews me. As we're walking out the octagon, I look to him and I go,

out the octagon, I look to him and I go, "Hey, what happened?"

"Hey, what happened?" He tells me, I break down crying. He

He tells me, I break down crying. He told me I did that seven times. He had

told me I did that seven times. He had to keep explaining it to me. And then

to keep explaining it to me. And then every time he explained it, I would have

every time he explained it, I would have the exact same reaction. Like, it was

the exact same reaction. Like, it was the first time I had heard that [ __ ]

the first time I had heard that [ __ ] man. That's bad. Yo, Jenn, that's bad.

man. That's bad. Yo, Jenn, that's bad. He said he told me seven times and then

He said he told me seven times and then I'm in the I'm in the ambulance because

I'm in the I'm in the ambulance because they're trying to get me in the

they're trying to get me in the ambulance. I'm I'm refusing.

ambulance. I'm I'm refusing. Right.

Right. Finally, I get in the ambulance and I

Finally, I get in the ambulance and I wake up and I was present like nothing

wake up and I was present like nothing had happened. I was like, I lost.

had happened. I was like, I lost. They're like, "Yeah,

They're like, "Yeah, yeah,

yeah, you lost." I was like, "God damn it." I

you lost." I was like, "God damn it." I swear to God I I woke up and I woke up

swear to God I I woke up and I woke up and and I'm like in realiz like I lost.

and and I'm like in realiz like I lost. Did Did you not because obviously So how

Did Did you not because obviously So how did how did he set the head kick up?

did how did he set the head kick up? It was it was it was beautiful. It was

It was it was it was beautiful. It was beautiful, man. It was beautiful. He

beautiful, man. It was beautiful. He kept body kicking me. That's what he did

kept body kicking me. That's what he did in the first fight, too. And I kept

in the first fight, too. And I kept check. I kept blocking. I kept blocking.

check. I kept blocking. I kept blocking. But then in the second round, I was

But then in the second round, I was fighting good. First round, real good.

fighting good. First round, real good. Second round, real good. So now I'm

Second round, real good. So now I'm feeling good because I feel great. My

feeling good because I feel great. My cardio's great. Yeah.

cardio's great. Yeah. Third round. But the whole time he just

Third round. But the whole time he just kick me in the body. Third time he tries

kick me in the body. Third time he tries to kick me in the head. And the third

to kick me in the head. And the third round is the first one of the first

round is the first one of the first attempts and I was like, "Nah."

attempts and I was like, "Nah." Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Nah. But then he actually gave me one

Nah. But then he actually gave me one that looked like it was going to the

that looked like it was going to the body.

body. And so I did this and you're supposed to

And so I did this and you're supposed to lean, right? You're supposed to kind of

lean, right? You're supposed to kind of lean

lean to kind of take some of the impact off.

to kind of take some of the impact off. Well, when I lean, he was not going low.

Well, when I lean, he was not going low. He was going high.

He was going high. Caught you.

Caught you. Boom. right on the side of the head. So

Boom. right on the side of the head. So then I started doing the chicken dance,

then I started doing the chicken dance, right? Like you know when your legs

right? Like you know when your legs give Yeah.

give Yeah. And this is the this is the this is

And this is the this is the this is where and this is where this is why I

where and this is where this is why I can't stand this dude because somebody

can't stand this dude because somebody else that's not as good would have let

else that's not as good would have let me off the hook because I was still

me off the hook because I was still there and again that's me football neck

there and again that's me football neck big neck you know short neck can take

big neck you know short neck can take most people just fall down from a head

most people just fall down from a head kick like that.

kick like that. I was still there so I'm like doing this

I was still there so I'm like doing this thing running away from him. Yo, he

thing running away from him. Yo, he kicks my leg to spin me.

kicks my leg to spin me. Yes, I remember.

Yes, I remember. So he kicks my leg.

So he kicks my leg. Kick your leg out from

Kick your leg out from Yeah. And so I spin. Yeah.

Yeah. And so I spin. Yeah. It's like that [ __ ] you put the kids

It's like that [ __ ] you put the kids where they go surf.

where they go surf. Then you don't know where you're at.

Then you don't know where you're at. When I did that, I fell and that was it.

When I did that, I fell and that was it. I could not. My body was gone,

I could not. My body was gone, right?

right? But like if I was on my feet, I might

But like if I was on my feet, I might have been able to grab him. I might have

have been able to grab him. I might have been able to hold him. I might have

been able to hold him. I might have shot. I would have done something. But

shot. I would have done something. But because he's such a great finisher, he

because he's such a great finisher, he kicks my leg out from under me. So then

kicks my leg out from under me. So then I spin and when I spin, I'm like seeing

I spin and when I spin, I'm like seeing all these lights and all of a sudden

all these lights and all of a sudden your body starts falling. It was like a

your body starts falling. It was like a kid trying to hit a piñata. It was

kid trying to hit a piñata. It was crazy, man. Then I fall on my stomach of

crazy, man. Then I fall on my stomach of all times in my world to to fall on my

all times in my world to to fall on my stomach. Like fall on your back to where

stomach. Like fall on your back to where you could see him coming, maybe get my

you could see him coming, maybe get my feet up to try to block him,

feet up to try to block him, but instead I fell on my stomach

but instead I fell on my stomach and he jumped on me and started started

and he jumped on me and started started finishing. And I I know this from

finishing. And I I know this from watching it,

watching it, right? So So you watching So you watch

right? So So you watching So you watch when you lost that fight, you watched it

when you lost that fight, you watched it over.

over. Not for a long time. I didn't watch the

Not for a long time. I didn't watch the fight. I uh But it's on the highlights

fight. I uh But it's on the highlights and stuff,

and stuff, right?

right? The UFC don't shield us from the If you

The UFC don't shield us from the If you lost,

lost, if you lost, you going to see yourself

if you lost, you going to see yourself getting beat at some point,

getting beat at some point, right?

right? That's why when him and Stipe fought, it

That's why when him and Stipe fought, it was the worst. The whole week, I'm just

was the worst. The whole week, I'm just out there. I was like, damn, did I ever

out there. I was like, damn, did I ever win a fight? I was just getting beat the

win a fight? I was just getting beat the whole time,

whole time, right?

right? It was terrible. I mean that that I mean

It was terrible. I mean that that I mean you like you said I mean his toolbox the

you like you said I mean his toolbox the way he can finish a fight with a elbow

way he can finish a fight with a elbow he can submit you

he can submit you he elbowed me bad

he elbowed me bad and then that that back that spinning

and then that that back that spinning that spinning back kick got

that spinning back kick got he coke steepe perfect

he coke steepe perfect poor Steipe man

poor Steipe man and and you and he and you he doesn't

and and you and he and you he doesn't telegraph it

telegraph it well the box the heavyweights are boxing

well the box the heavyweights are boxing or wrestling they're not doing all that

or wrestling they're not doing all that right

right you could tell right away when he needs

you could tell right away when he needs steep steep was like what is this

steep steep was like what is this yeah what

yeah what they're they're kneeing now normally A

they're they're kneeing now normally A guyy's trying to either take me out or

guyy's trying to either take me out or box with me, maybe a couple leg kicks

box with me, maybe a couple leg kicks here and there.

here and there. John was hitting him with all kinds of

John was hitting him with all kinds of stuff.

stuff. John hit him with knees, elbows,

John hit him with knees, elbows, spinning kicks.

spinning kicks. When he hit him with that spinning kick,

When he hit him with that spinning kick, Steipe, you could tell Stipe looked like

Steipe, you could tell Stipe looked like a guy that hadn't fought for three and a

a guy that hadn't fought for three and a half years and was 42.

half years and was 42. He looked and he turned on you. I was

He looked and he turned on you. I was like, "Oh, John got him."

like, "Oh, John got him." But he is very good at setting

But he is very good at setting everything up. That's why he didn't have

everything up. That's why he didn't have to cheat. He did not have to cheat.

to cheat. He did not have to cheat. That's where my biggest issue is. Like,

That's where my biggest issue is. Like, you don't need a cheat. You got all

you don't need a cheat. You got all that.

that. Keep that. Like, use what you have.

Keep that. Like, use what you have. And he always get mad at me. He he going

And he always get mad at me. He he going to be on me now. If it is, oh, I live I

to be on me now. If it is, oh, I live I live. The other day he say he live rent

live. The other day he say he live rent free in my house in my my brain or

free in my house in my my brain or something like that. I'm like, man, shut

something like that. I'm like, man, shut up. I care about you.

up. I care about you. Obviously, you were there when Anderson

Obviously, you were there when Anderson Silva was that uh Rockhole or was that

Silva was that uh Rockhole or was that uh uh what

uh uh what Chunning?

Chunning? No. when he checked him when when

No. when he checked him when when Oh, that was Chris Weidman.

Oh, that was Chris Weidman. Weidman.

Weidman. Had you ever seen Have you ever seen

Had you ever seen Have you ever seen that before?

that before? I

I cuz it happened again. Another fighter

cuz it happened again. Another fighter got checked.

got checked. Hey, Chris Weidman checked Anderson's

Hey, Chris Weidman checked Anderson's broke his leg.

broke his leg. Yeah.

Yeah. Then Chris Weidman kicked somebody

Then Chris Weidman kicked somebody else's leg.

else's leg. Weidman kicked a guy named Uriah Hall.

Weidman kicked a guy named Uriah Hall. Broke his leg. So the same thing that

Broke his leg. So the same thing that happened to Anderson, Chris did to

happened to Anderson, Chris did to himself. I can't watch it. Did you watch

himself. I can't watch it. Did you watch it?

it? I watched it. Can you actually watch the

I watched it. Can you actually watch the I can't. It looked like his his leg.

I can't. It looked like his his leg. Yeah. It like broke half. Yeah.

Yeah. It like broke half. Yeah. You watched it. I can't watch it. Even

You watched it. I can't watch it. Even next to the Oct.

next to the Oct. But I I watched it. I I was watching it

But I I watched it. I I was watching it live at the time.

live at the time. But all those replays I was like, how

But all those replays I was like, how did it look?

did it look? Cuz cuz when you see it, you're like,

Cuz cuz when you see it, you're like, damn, that look and then you like you

damn, that look and then you like you try to, you know, you know, you try to

try to, you know, you know, you try to put, you know, try to balance yourself

put, you know, try to balance yourself and you just like damn

and you just like damn looked like his leg broke.

looked like his leg broke. Yes,

Yes, dude. I had to ask Rogan in the attic.

dude. I had to ask Rogan in the attic. I'm like I'm like, did it break? Did it

I'm like I'm like, did it break? Did it break? Did it break? They're like, "Oh,

break? Did it break? They're like, "Oh, it broke." They was like, "Do not watch

it broke." They was like, "Do not watch it." I was going to throw up.

it." I was going to throw up. I mean, cuz you guys know how to how to

I mean, cuz you guys know how to how to check because it's called, you know, you

check because it's called, you know, you check you like

check you like you check the kick. Yeah. You put you

you check the kick. Yeah. You put you either lean into it or you pick your uh

either lean into it or you pick your uh you pick your your your knee up,

you pick your your your knee up, right?

right? And what they were doing were kicking on

And what they were doing were kicking on the inside. That's why when you kick on

the inside. That's why when you kick on the inside, they just turn their knee

the inside, they just turn their knee in. And that if you kick too hard, man,

in. And that if you kick too hard, man, you break your leg.

you break your leg. That's why I don't kick too much.

That's why I don't kick too much. Hey, that's why I was out there boxing

Hey, that's why I was out there boxing just like everybody else.

just like everybody else. What's the worst injury you sustained in

What's the worst injury you sustained in a fight?

a fight? Um, in a fight

Um, in a fight just more damage like facial stuff like

just more damage like facial stuff like black eye, cut face. I never got hurt

black eye, cut face. I never got hurt really bad in fights, but in training,

really bad in fights, but in training, ribs, torn ACL,

ribs, torn ACL, uh torn ACL, ribs. I I tore some sort of

uh torn ACL, ribs. I I tore some sort of a this this ligament in my shin one time

a this this ligament in my shin one time kicking.

kicking. Uh broke broken hand. Like I I couldn't

Uh broke broken hand. Like I I couldn't I couldn't punch. I didn't know how to

I couldn't punch. I didn't know how to punch. Like remember they used to have

punch. Like remember they used to have this idea that Floyd had like trail

this idea that Floyd had like trail hands?

hands? Yes.

Yes. That was me. Like I broke my hand five

That was me. Like I broke my hand five times when I started fighting.

times when I started fighting. Wow. Every time I would land right, I

Wow. Every time I would land right, I would I would break my hand. So then I

would I would break my hand. So then I have a doctor call him. He did a great

have a doctor call him. He did a great job with my uh with this and it never

job with my uh with this and it never broke again. He put a plate with like

broke again. He put a plate with like eight screws because it just kept

eight screws because it just kept breaking. But when knocking someone out,

breaking. But when knocking someone out, you don't feel nothing. You literally

you don't feel nothing. You literally don't feel anything if you knock them

don't feel anything if you knock them out with a punch.

out with a punch. Yeah.

Yeah. It's like sometimes you feel and it's

It's like sometimes you feel and it's like that loud impact.

like that loud impact. Yeah. When you land the right way,

Yeah. When you land the right way, sometimes it's like you don't even punch

sometimes it's like you don't even punch them. It's like you go right through

them. It's like you go right through them,

them, but you know it.

but you know it. Well, they fall. They fall. When I hit

Well, they fall. They fall. When I hit Stipe with that one that put him down to

Stipe with that one that put him down to become the double champ,

become the double champ, I had just I had thrown that punch so

I had just I had thrown that punch so many times

many times and it just so happened to hit him and

and it just so happened to hit him and he went down. I could I I didn't even

he went down. I could I I didn't even feel nothing.

feel nothing. Yeah. Like when Usman caught uh the dude

Yeah. Like when Usman caught uh the dude George Naz.

George Naz. Yeah. Jose Maz. Yeah. when he caught him

Yeah. Jose Maz. Yeah. when he caught him with

with his his chin went all the way.

his his chin went all the way. I was like, "Oh my goodness."

I was like, "Oh my goodness." Model was mad at me one time because I

Model was mad at me one time because I they should I was on I was on NFL live

they should I was on I was on NFL live and I said, "Uh, when the mug when you

and I said, "Uh, when the mug when you when you

when you you called him?"

you called him?" Yeah, I put him in put him in the

Yeah, I put him in put him in the concussion protocol. He got to go in the

concussion protocol. He got to go in the tent because his chin went all the way

tent because his chin went all the way back there.

back there. Yeah.

Yeah. He went down bad. That was Kamaru

He went down bad. That was Kamaru punched through him and he just

punched through him and he just crumbled.

crumbled. Yeah,

Yeah, it was nasty.

it was nasty. Camaro looked good coming back. Let me

Camaro looked good coming back. Let me ask you this. When you saw Anderson

ask you this. When you saw Anderson Silva, he could box box a little bit,

Silva, he could box box a little bit, but he fought Jake Paul.

but he fought Jake Paul. See, that's I have a problem with all

See, that's I have a problem with all that. I don't know how y'all I don't

that. I don't know how y'all I don't know how you guys feel about the the

know how you guys feel about the the Jake Paul Anderson. The Jake Paul

Jake Paul Anderson. The Jake Paul I was see boxers

I was see boxers boxers that's his age.

boxers that's his age. Yes, Mike.

Yes, Mike. I don't think that's asking too much.

I don't think that's asking too much. No, Mike Tyson.

No, Mike Tyson. Yeah, Mike Tyson's

Yeah, Mike Tyson's He beat up on Mike. Mike's 60, man. Mike

He beat up on Mike. Mike's 60, man. Mike did make like 27 mill so I get it. Yeah.

did make like 27 mill so I get it. Yeah. 60 years old.

60 years old. I want Jake Paul to fight guys that

I want Jake Paul to fight guys that he says he wants to fight Canelo.

he says he wants to fight Canelo. Canelo fights 154 or 160.

Canelo fights 154 or 160. That's one of his best weights. He'll

That's one of his best weights. He'll fight heavier cur. He fought he fought

fight heavier cur. He fought he fought the guy at uh 175.

the guy at uh 175. Yeah. And got beat. Yeah. But like it's

Yeah. And got beat. Yeah. But like it's like

like fight Jake weighs 200 210 215.

fight Jake weighs 200 210 215. Yeah. But I mean so that means he'd be a

Yeah. But I mean so that means he'd be a heavyweight.

heavyweight. Yeah. Yeah, he's like a heavyweight

Yeah. Yeah, he's like a heavyweight now. And he talking about he he says he

now. And he talking about he he says he wants to fight Anthony Joshua

wants to fight Anthony Joshua that he's if he fights Anthony Joshua

that he's if he fights Anthony Joshua all everybody's wish and dream of him

all everybody's wish and dream of him getting finished will come to fruition.

getting finished will come to fruition. But I I think the thing is is that

But I I think the thing is is that he's better now.

he's better now. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You No,

Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You No, he takes it serious. You can you can

he takes it serious. You can you can appre you can appreciate that. You can

appre you can appreciate that. You can tell that he spends time in the gym. You

tell that he spends time in the gym. You tell that he has serious coaches and

tell that he has serious coaches and he's taking this craft serious. He ain't

he's taking this craft serious. He ain't just getting in there and people like,

just getting in there and people like, "Oh, he's just

"Oh, he's just he's a YouTuber." No, he ain't. He's a

he's a YouTuber." No, he ain't. He's a boxer.

boxer. No, no, no, no, no, no.

No, no, no, no, no, no. So Jake Paul's a millionaire.

So Jake Paul's a millionaire. Yeah.

Yeah. Jake Paul's not training at the local

Jake Paul's not training at the local YMCA. No,

YMCA. No, he's got real coaches on staff. He got

he's got real coaches on staff. He got real coach.

real coach. He's got high level coaches and he lives

He's got high level coaches and he lives to box now.

to box now. Yes.

Yes. He's been boxing seriously now. So, he

He's been boxing seriously now. So, he should be able to compete.

should be able to compete. Yes.

Yes. He's a boxer. He's not He's not that

He's a boxer. He's not He's not that same kid. That's why I keep telling

same kid. That's why I keep telling those MMA guys, every time they tell me,

those MMA guys, every time they tell me, "I got a chance to fight uh Jake Paul."

"I got a chance to fight uh Jake Paul." I'm like, "Man, don't do it." Because

I'm like, "Man, don't do it." Because he he boxed. That's what he does. He's a

he he boxed. That's what he does. He's a boxer. You don't know how to box. Like

boxer. You don't know how to box. Like my friend Ben Astrin.

my friend Ben Astrin. Yeah.

Yeah. Ben went fought him. Ben should have

Ben went fought him. Ben should have never fought him.

never fought him. Yeah. No.

Yeah. No. Cuz he was going to get Ben never could

Cuz he was going to get Ben never could wrestle. He could never box.

wrestle. He could never box. No.

No. He is a wrestler. Tyron Woodley. I was

He is a wrestler. Tyron Woodley. I was so sad when Tyron Woodley kept losing to

so sad when Tyron Woodley kept losing to him. I love T Wood man. And I was like T

him. I love T Wood man. And I was like T Wood like

Wood like Well, you don't see the butt that look.

Well, you don't see the butt that look. You don't see them punches, bro. You not

You don't see them punches, bro. You not That's not what you

That's not what you That's not what we do. I can't box these

That's not what we do. I can't box these guys. No. He tried to Jake Paul tried to

guys. No. He tried to Jake Paul tried to uh mess with me for a while until I went

uh mess with me for a while until I went up to him in Orlando. I said, "I don't

up to him in Orlando. I said, "I don't play like these kids." I said, "Stop

play like these kids." I said, "Stop playing with me." His bodyguard. I said,

playing with me." His bodyguard. I said, "I'm going to slap you, too." I said, "I

"I'm going to slap you, too." I said, "I don't play like that, man. Don't leave

don't play like that, man. Don't leave me alone." I swear to God, I was at the

me alone." I swear to God, I was at the commentary desk.

commentary desk. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm sitting there. He in the back making

I'm sitting there. He in the back making faces at me. I took my handset off. I

faces at me. I took my handset off. I put it down. I got up, walked right to

put it down. I got up, walked right to where he was in the stands. I point

where he was in the stands. I point right in his face. I said, "Man, I don't

right in his face. I said, "Man, I don't play. Leave me alone." I said, "I'm not

play. Leave me alone." I said, "I'm not the children that you messing around

the children that you messing around with. I'm not going to play with you.

with. I'm not going to play with you. Leave me alone." His bodyguard, "I ain't

Leave me alone." His bodyguard, "I ain't going to do nothing." I said, "I'm going

going to do nothing." I said, "I'm going to slap the [ __ ] out of you, too." Both

to slap the [ __ ] out of you, too." Both of y'all can get it. [ __ ] out. The

of y'all can get it. [ __ ] out. The security act security UFC security can't

security act security UFC security can't get me. Yeah,

get me. Yeah, cuz you know, man, come on. We growing

cuz you know, man, come on. We growing up, man. We don't like I'm not playing.

up, man. We don't like I'm not playing. Everybody don't play like that.

Everybody don't play like that. No, man. Leave me alone. Unless you

No, man. Leave me alone. Unless you really want to fight. Jon Jones, I

really want to fight. Jon Jones, I respect cuz he fights me,

respect cuz he fights me, right?

right? But Leave me alone. Don't I'm not

But Leave me alone. Don't I'm not playing those childish games,

playing those childish games, right?

right? Yeah. Leave me alone.

Yeah. Leave me alone. Do you think you see the guys in MMA go

Do you think you see the guys in MMA go to fight, go to box

to fight, go to box for the money?

for the money? For the money.

For the money. They do it for the money. They Look,

They do it for the money. They Look, man.

man. Can you blame them though?

Can you blame them though? No. No. No. There's only a select few

No. No. No. There's only a select few people that make the big money in the

people that make the big money in the UFC.

UFC. Correct.

Correct. It's the God honest truth. I mean,

It's the God honest truth. I mean, champions make money.

champions make money. Yes.

Yes. Lorenzo Fertito was the best. When

Lorenzo Fertito was the best. When Lorenzo Fertito was there, he would do

Lorenzo Fertito was there, he would do these discretionary bonuses.

these discretionary bonuses. Yeah.

Yeah. Where they would just give you money. He

Where they would just give you money. He had an idea of what he wanted the

had an idea of what he wanted the champion to make and he would make sure

champion to make and he would make sure he got it right.

he got it right. So when I fought Jon Jones, my contract

So when I fought Jon Jones, my contract was $85,000.

was $85,000. I lost the first time.

I lost the first time. On Monday, Dana called me and goes, "You

On Monday, Dana called me and goes, "You did a great job. We're going to send you

did a great job. We're going to send you a check for a million dollars." What?

a check for a million dollars." What? Swear to God.

Swear to God. 85. And then you got

85. And then you got He gave me a million dollars. They gave

He gave me a million dollars. They gave me a million dollars. A check from first

me a million dollars. A check from first time ever made that obviously as a

time ever made that obviously as a wrestler. It was the first time I'd ever

wrestler. It was the first time I'd ever made seven figures. They called me and

made seven figures. They called me and said, "You did a great job. Here you

said, "You did a great job. Here you go." Then I fought again a few months

go." Then I fought again a few months later and I had got a new contract,

later and I had got a new contract, right? And it might have been 300,000

right? And it might have been 300,000 and then we sold a few hundred,000

and then we sold a few hundred,000 pay-per-views and

pay-per-views and they called me and said, "Hey, we're

they called me and said, "Hey, we're going to give you x amount of dollars to

going to give you x amount of dollars to get you back to a million dollars."

get you back to a million dollars." Wow.

Wow. They would do that, man. They were like,

They would do that, man. They were like, because that's what people don't

because that's what people don't understand. Like I know they talk, well

understand. Like I know they talk, well this guy these guys are underpaid, but

this guy these guys are underpaid, but it's like when you become a champion and

it's like when you become a champion and then you're benefiting the business,

then you're benefiting the business, right?

right? They they take care of you.

They they take care of you. Yeah.

Yeah. And but even even the lowest boxers make

And but even even the lowest boxers make are so low, bro.

are so low, bro. Yeah.

Yeah. Like the low

Like the low that makes that make it seem like

that makes that make it seem like everybody making Floyd Mayweather money.

everybody making Floyd Mayweather money. And they're not.

And they're not. They are not all making that money, bro.

They are not all making that money, bro. They're making thousands,

They're making thousands, right? I mean, they make good look. They

right? I mean, they make good look. They like But like you said,

like But like you said, but the good guys will make good money.

but the good guys will make good money. Yeah. What does a guy make that? So

Yeah. What does a guy make that? So Tank and all them dudes are getting paid

Tank and all them dudes are getting paid right now. They're in the millions.

right now. They're in the millions. Yeah.

Yeah. But they're they're the equivalent of

But they're they're the equivalent of the Iliotas,

the Iliotas, right?

right? And the Israel Adosas. They're they're

And the Israel Adosas. They're they're those guys,

those guys, right?

right? But as you go down

But as you go down as you go down the card and you go down

as you go down the card and you go down the pay scale.

the pay scale. Yeah.

Yeah. I bet it's all pretty equivalent or very

I bet it's all pretty equivalent or very equal.

equal. So yeah, people talk like all boxers

So yeah, people talk like all boxers make money. They don't.

make money. They don't. You work for the company now and in the

You work for the company now and in the commentary,

commentary, but how is it negotiating with Dana as a

but how is it negotiating with Dana as a fighter

fighter or do you did you negotiate managers?

or do you did you negotiate managers? You had managers.

You had managers. I have managers, but I was always I was

I have managers, but I was always I was always really good about that.

always really good about that. I would stand on what I believed, you

I would stand on what I believed, you know. One time I got he he was he was

know. One time I got he he was he was like, "That didn't happen." I was like,

like, "That didn't happen." I was like, "But it did, boss." I was like, "Of

"But it did, boss." I was like, "Of course it did, boss." I said, "Uh, you

course it did, boss." I said, "Uh, you you we were negotiating my contract when

you we were negotiating my contract when I first came over and I wanted like a

I first came over and I wanted like a certain amount of money." Didn't want to

certain amount of money." Didn't want to do it. Dana was like kind of throwing a

do it. Dana was like kind of throwing a fit. Lorenzo goes, "It's fine. We'll

fit. Lorenzo goes, "It's fine. We'll figure it out." And by the time I got to

figure it out." And by the time I got to the airport, it was figured out.

the airport, it was figured out. Right.

Right. Right. And he was like, "That didn't

Right. And he was like, "That didn't happen." I was like, "It did." I was

happen." I was like, "It did." I was like, "It's not a big deal because I

like, "It's not a big deal because I understand you have to protect your

understand you have to protect your business, right?

business, right? And I have to protect myself as a

And I have to protect myself as a business because I have a small window

business because I have a small window to happen." But then when I was

to happen." But then when I was retiring, right, Hunter Campbell, who

retiring, right, Hunter Campbell, who now does a lot of the stuff with the

now does a lot of the stuff with the guys, he calls my manager and he goes,

guys, he calls my manager and he goes, "So guys, what do you think? Uh, same as

"So guys, what do you think? Uh, same as he made as champ plus pay-per-view."

he made as champ plus pay-per-view." Like, "Yeah, even though I wasn't a

Like, "Yeah, even though I wasn't a champ, they still gave me the same pay I

champ, they still gave me the same pay I made as a champion

made as a champion and the pay-per-view."

and the pay-per-view." So, it's like I I have nothing negative

So, it's like I I have nothing negative to say because I've had all great

to say because I've had all great experience.

experience. You had great experience with it.

You had great experience with it. The worst experience I had was that,

The worst experience I had was that, right,

right, when he said, "I don't want to give you

when he said, "I don't want to give you that." And I was like, "Well, okay, then

that." And I was like, "Well, okay, then I'll just fight and then I won't have a

I'll just fight and then I won't have a contract,

contract, right?

right? And then we can negotiate after that."

And then we can negotiate after that." And they're like, "Uh-uh. We ain't doing

And they're like, "Uh-uh. We ain't doing that. We ain't we ain't going to let you

that. We ain't we ain't going to let you get to Francis,

get to Francis, right?

right? We ain't letting you get to undefeated,

We ain't letting you get to undefeated, right?

right? Heavyweight or light heavyweight with no

Heavyweight or light heavyweight with no contract where other people can start

contract where other people can start going, "Hey, we want you."

going, "Hey, we want you." Right.

Right. Right. So then eventually I just resign

Right. So then eventually I just resign with the company.

with the company. If Dana were to ever stepped down, would

If Dana were to ever stepped down, would you run the UFC?

you run the UFC? That would be a dream job for anybody.

That would be a dream job for anybody. But of course, I would love to do

But of course, I would love to do something if if they ever if they ever

something if if they ever if they ever trusted me with that, I would do the

trusted me with that, I would do the best job I ever could do because it's

best job I ever could do because it's one of the greatest organizations in the

one of the greatest organizations in the world. It's one of the biggest sports

world. It's one of the biggest sports organizations in the world. Yep.

organizations in the world. Yep. And they've done such a great job of

And they've done such a great job of building it that

building it that the job itself is just don't don't [ __ ]

the job itself is just don't don't [ __ ] it up.

it up. Don't mess it up.

Don't mess it up. Don't mess it up.

Don't mess it up. Right.

Right. Cuz Dana does what he does is he's so

Cuz Dana does what he does is he's so passionate about it.

passionate about it. Yeah, he is.

Yeah, he is. That I can't imagine the UFC without

That I can't imagine the UFC without him. But if not,

him. But if not, but D stand on business now.

but D stand on business now. He stand on business.

He stand on business. You could be his best friend. He going

You could be his best friend. He going to get you. He going to put He going to

to get you. He going to put He going to walk you out the door and say, "Hey,

walk you out the door and say, "Hey, man. Give me a little Give me another

man. Give me a little Give me another little get that a little bit. I'm

little get that a little bit. I'm running out. You can give me a little

running out. You can give me a little small pour right there." Yeah. Hit me

small pour right there." Yeah. Hit me up. Yeah, that's good. Let me get that.

up. Yeah, that's good. Let me get that. That's pretty good, man.

That's pretty good, man. Oh, it's great.

Oh, it's great. I'm taking that bottle.

I'm taking that bottle. You can take it?

You can take it? That's coming with me.

That's coming with me. No, but we we'll get your address. We'll

No, but we we'll get your address. We'll send you send them to your dad.

send you send them to your dad. My passed away, but

My passed away, but Oh, my bad. I'm sorry to hear that.

Oh, my bad. I'm sorry to hear that. It's okay. But we make sure we make sure

It's okay. But we make sure we make sure you take care of.

you take care of. Yeah, you take I'm then I will drink it

Yeah, you take I'm then I will drink it in his honor. I'mma do exactly like him.

in his honor. I'mma do exactly like him. My pops show home. Yeah.

My pops show home. Yeah. My pops had them hard days, man. My pops

My pops had them hard days, man. My pops was working hard.

was working hard. Well, if you Louisiana, he grew up hard.

Well, if you Louisiana, he grew up hard. Grew hard and working outside. My dad

Grew hard and working outside. My dad used to show up,

used to show up, sit in that truck for two hours

sit in that truck for two hours because he knew hard at work got to come

because he knew hard at work got to come deal with us.

deal with us. Yeah, it was.

Yeah, it was. Yeah. He probably had to have couple of

Yeah. He probably had to have couple of drinks to come in the house.

drinks to come in the house. Yes, he did. Yes, he did. Joe Rogan.

Yes, he did. Yes, he did. Joe Rogan. Now, I didn't know a whole lot about Joe

Now, I didn't know a whole lot about Joe Rogan. I just knew him as the guy that

Rogan. I just knew him as the guy that Fear Factor. So, I didn't know that

Fear Factor. So, I didn't know that he became Joe Rogan.

he became Joe Rogan. Yeah. Cuz that's I mean cuz I love Fear

Yeah. Cuz that's I mean cuz I love Fear Factor and then they just got too they

Factor and then they just got too they just got too ridiculous with it. Me, I

just got too ridiculous with it. Me, I like I can't do this no more. Um it I

like I can't do this no more. Um it I mean it was really good. The first

mean it was really good. The first couple of seasons was really really

couple of seasons was really really good. And to see what he's turned into

good. And to see what he's turned into as a podcaster, but in the MMA in UFC,

as a podcaster, but in the MMA in UFC, he's your Howard Coale.

he's your Howard Coale. Yes, he is. He's he's he's very good.

Yes, he is. He's he's he's very good. He's I mean he is very very good.

He's I mean he is very very good. I've never met a person that actually

I've never met a person that actually remembers more than Rogan. We we go to

remembers more than Rogan. We we go to dinner after the fights.

dinner after the fights. Yeah.

Yeah. And uh he'll be talking about events at

And uh he'll be talking about events at UFC 15 and I'm like UFC 15. Was that in

UFC 15 and I'm like UFC 15. Was that in 2004?

2004? Bro, we at we at 300 now. You talking

Bro, we at we at 300 now. You talking about 15?

about 15? Yeah. He's like I'm telling you like

Yeah. He's like I'm telling you like this but his memory to recall all these

this but his memory to recall all these things and I've never seen anything like

things and I've never seen anything like it.

it. Right. But yeah, and and and Shannon, it

Right. But yeah, and and and Shannon, it says something when you do a job just

says something when you do a job just for the love of doing the job when you

for the love of doing the job when you don't have to do it,

don't have to do it, right?

right? Joe doesn't have to do UFC.

Joe doesn't have to do UFC. No, he don't.

No, he don't. With the Spotify thing that he has going

With the Spotify thing that he has going on and everything.

on and everything. And Dana said that when he first started

And Dana said that when he first started doing it, he did it for free.

doing it, he did it for free. Yeah. He love

Yeah. He love He called He called the fight for free.

He called He called the fight for free. like and you know then they worked it

like and you know then they worked it out something later but to just because

out something later but to just because he loved the sport so much

he loved the sport so much and and you know he he fights and

and and you know he he fights and obviously you know he you know he works

obviously you know he you know he works at it and uh uh but he does an

at it and uh uh but he does an unbelievable job.

unbelievable job. Yeah, he's tremendous man. I I think he

Yeah, he's tremendous man. I I think he does a great job of calling the fights

does a great job of calling the fights and

and I think that he

I think that he and you could tell his passion for it.

and you could tell his passion for it. Yes.

Yes. And everything. I mean you guys do so

And everything. I mean you guys do so you guys do like I mean hours and hours

you guys do like I mean hours and hours of TV a week. Mhm.

of TV a week. Mhm. You got to love this, too, or you can't

You got to love this, too, or you can't do it. Yeah. And you can feel it. I can

do it. Yeah. And you can feel it. I can see it in you, too.

see it in you, too. I've watched you from afar.

I've watched you from afar. Yeah.

Yeah. And I've admired how well you've done

And I've admired how well you've done and how you've really broke, you've

and how you've really broke, you've really broke through the glass ceiling

really broke through the glass ceiling because there was

because there was there was an idea of who you were

there was an idea of who you were supposed to be at Fox.

supposed to be at Fox. Yeah.

Yeah. And then eventually you said, "This idea

And then eventually you said, "This idea is not it doesn't work for me."

is not it doesn't work for me." Right.

Right. And you became bigger than that idea.

And you became bigger than that idea. And now it's like so I'm so happy. I

And now it's like so I'm so happy. I don't really know you well enough to say

don't really know you well enough to say I'm proud of you, but I'm happy for what

I'm proud of you, but I'm happy for what you've done and what you've accomplished

you've done and what you've accomplished because you deserve it, man. Hard work

because you deserve it, man. Hard work deserves to get uh credit for it. And

deserves to get uh credit for it. And I appreciate that.

I appreciate that. Yeah.

Yeah. Let me ask you this. What have you most

Let me ask you this. What have you most learned about money? Cuz growing up, how

learned about money? Cuz growing up, how you grew up?

you grew up? Um you know, living off 1,500 bucks a

Um you know, living off 1,500 bucks a month and you got a $1,200 rent and then

month and you got a $1,200 rent and then basically I got to eat for uh the next

basically I got to eat for uh the next 29 days I got to live off 150 bucks. Now

29 days I got to live off 150 bucks. Now that you have you make decent money.

that you have you make decent money. Yep. What have you learned about it?

Yep. What have you learned about it? Money's hard to keep. Money is very hard

Money's hard to keep. Money is very hard to keep. That's what people don't

to keep. That's what people don't understand. Money's hard to keep. You

understand. Money's hard to keep. You pay a lot. You pay a lot of taxes. You

pay a lot. You pay a lot of taxes. You pay a lot of other things. It just gives

pay a lot of other things. It just gives you an opportunity. I feel like money

you an opportunity. I feel like money gives you the ability. One, you're going

gives you the ability. One, you're going to be exactly who you ever wanted to be.

to be exactly who you ever wanted to be. Yes.

Yes. So, if a person's ugly because they have

So, if a person's ugly because they have money, they always were ugly. They just

money, they always were ugly. They just didn't have the ability to be ugly.

didn't have the ability to be ugly. Um, you're gonna be exactly who you want

Um, you're gonna be exactly who you want to be and you have access to more things

to be and you have access to more things that you have. And I also learned that

that you have. And I also learned that because you have the ability to pay for

because you have the ability to pay for stuff, most things are free.

stuff, most things are free. Yes.

Yes. Isn't that the craziest thing?

Isn't that the craziest thing? That's the crazy thing. People have the

That's the crazy thing. People have the most money, they get the most stuff for

most money, they get the most stuff for free.

free. When you were living off that 1,500, you

When you were living off that 1,500, you want to go buy, you want something, you

want to go buy, you want something, you got to pay for it. But when you have the

got to pay for it. But when you have the money that you have and you can pay for

money that you have and you can pay for it, everybody's like, "Could you please

it, everybody's like, "Could you please just take this and I just want to see

just take this and I just want to see you have it? Hold it. Shannon, could you

you have it? Hold it. Shannon, could you just hold it?"

just hold it?" Right.

Right. And you're like, "Okay."

And you're like, "Okay." And most times you're like, "I'd rather

And most times you're like, "I'd rather pay for it instead of hold it for you."

pay for it instead of hold it for you." Like it's like it's just it's just that

Like it's like it's just it's just that but also just that it gives you a free

but also just that it gives you a free it's it's it's freedom. It really is

it's it's it's freedom. It really is just freedom. Like

just freedom. Like it's it's the freedom to to do things

it's it's the freedom to to do things and take care of the people that you

and take care of the people that you love more than anything. I bought my mom

love more than anything. I bought my mom a house.

a house. Wow.

Wow. That was one of my greatest

That was one of my greatest accomplishments.

accomplishments. Yes.

Yes. To have her

To have her get a big house. Right. And then my mom

get a big house. Right. And then my mom was a house cleaner whenever I was

was a house cleaner whenever I was growing up. So she would take us to

growing up. So she would take us to these people's houses

these people's houses and while she worked uh the people were

and while she worked uh the people were beautiful. One family I still remember

beautiful. One family I still remember to this day called the Low family in

to this day called the Low family in Louisiana, Lafayette.

Louisiana, Lafayette. She'd go Monday and Wednesday there.

She'd go Monday and Wednesday there. They gave us a car. They gave us like a

They gave us a car. They gave us like a brand new car. Just this wonderful

brand new car. Just this wonderful family of people. I had I made sure she

family of people. I had I made sure she had house cleaners when she was older.

had house cleaners when she was older. Wow.

Wow. So instead of going to clean people's

So instead of going to clean people's houses like those are the things that

houses like those are the things that I'm so proud of in my life, in my career

I'm so proud of in my life, in my career that you were able to do for your mom

that you were able to do for your mom to do for your mom. I mean, you know

to do for your mom. I mean, you know that you do.

that you do. Absolutely.

Absolutely. It's like there are people in your life

It's like there are people in your life that mean more than anything and that's

that mean more than anything and that's uh you take care of them.

uh you take care of them. Finding a mate

Finding a mate obviously wrestling, you know, ain't it

obviously wrestling, you know, ain't it like they coming to L like they beat and

like they coming to L like they beat and down your door say, "Oh yeah, I want I I

down your door say, "Oh yeah, I want I I want to wrestle cuz it's not like you

want to wrestle cuz it's not like you know, you're not on television. It's

know, you're not on television. It's it's a hard job. It's a grimy job. Uh

it's a hard job. It's a grimy job. Uh you're moody. Some days are better than

you're moody. Some days are better than others." When you found a wife, how did

others." When you found a wife, how did you know?

you know? I've had multiple. Oh, so yeah, you

I've had multiple. Oh, so yeah, you can't you can't really I'm not the best

can't you can't really I'm not the best in love.

in love. You know what I and and and and I tell

You know what I and and and and I tell someone was telling me this the other

someone was telling me this the other day. They said, "Shannon, the best and

day. They said, "Shannon, the best and worst decision." When you made the best

worst decision." When you made the best decision, did you know it was the best

decision, did you know it was the best decision at the time? No.

decision at the time? No. No.

No. When you made the worst decision, did

When you made the worst decision, did you know it was the worst decision at

you know it was the worst decision at the time? No.

the time? No. No. You just live with the decisions you

No. You just live with the decisions you make. That's all you can really do. But

make. That's all you can really do. But you uh

part of being great is being selfish. You got to be.

You got to be. And when you're so selfish, it's hard

And when you're so selfish, it's hard for relationships to work.

for relationships to work. Absolutely.

Absolutely. And I think that is like probably the

And I think that is like probably the thing that athletes need to worry about

thing that athletes need to worry about the most because

the most because got to find somebody that understands

got to find somebody that understands it.

it. Yes. And not many people do.

Yes. And not many people do. They don't.

They don't. It's really hard.

It's really hard. Everybody say they can be, oh, I

Everybody say they can be, oh, I understand. Everybody can be second

understand. Everybody can be second until they actually have to be second

until they actually have to be second until also until everybody can be second

until also until everybody can be second when they don't have.

when they don't have. The moment there's a comfortability to

The moment there's a comfortability to life,

life, it's like, wait a minute, everything

it's like, wait a minute, everything that we hoped would happen has now

that we hoped would happen has now happened.

happened. Now worry about, but it's not done yet.

Now worry about, but it's not done yet. The job's never done.

The job's never done. No. I feel like for high thinkers like

No. I feel like for high thinkers like you and myself

you and myself to just retire,

to just retire, could you imagine that as life?

could you imagine that as life? You die. Some a part of you would die.

You die. Some a part of you would die. Yes.

Yes. And so for me it's like I need to be

And so for me it's like I need to be chasing career. I need to be

chasing career. I need to be I got to work.

I got to work. I'm a worker.

I'm a worker. Got to work. It's what I was put on this

Got to work. It's what I was put on this earth to do.

earth to do. But that can be seen as selfish.

But that can be seen as selfish. It is.

It is. Yeah.

Yeah. And but that's the

And but that's the that's the only way you can become

that's the only way you can become great. It's the only way

great. It's the only way there there. And and and greatness is

there there. And and and greatness is not a sometime thing.

not a sometime thing. It's an all the time thing.

It's an all the time thing. It's an all the time thing. You don't

It's an all the time thing. You don't get to be great just when you want to be

get to be great just when you want to be great in front of people.

great in front of people. You got to be willing to do that work

You got to be willing to do that work behind closed doors.

behind closed doors. Yeah. But you don't never know anything.

Yeah. But you don't never know anything. Your biological father was shot and

Your biological father was shot and killed by his second wife's

killed by his second wife's Yep. Yep.

Yep. Yep. father in self-defense.

father in self-defense. Dude,

Dude, you remember that? Oh,

you remember that? Oh, yeah. I remember

yeah. I remember I remember uh

I remember uh watching Thanksgiving Day of 1986.

watching Thanksgiving Day of 1986. We're at my aunt's house, Marjorie.

We're at my aunt's house, Marjorie. Mhm.

Mhm. We're all sitting down. We ate. We're

We're all sitting down. We ate. We're all watching The Color Purple. And uh my

all watching The Color Purple. And uh my mom getting a call and she goes crazy.

mom getting a call and she goes crazy. It was hysterical.

It was hysterical. I was a seven-year-old kid. I had no

I was a seven-year-old kid. I had no idea what was going on.

idea what was going on. my uh then they told her your dad's just

my uh then they told her your dad's just been killed.

been killed. Your you know Joseph has just been

Your you know Joseph has just been killed. Your ex has been killed.

killed. Your ex has been killed. She goes crazy.

She goes crazy. She has to sit down now and tell me that

She has to sit down now and tell me that my older brother is 12 years older than

my older brother is 12 years older than me. Imagine a 19year-old kid learning

me. Imagine a 19year-old kid learning that his father's been killed.

that his father's been killed. I'm at seven just

I'm at seven just crying because I don't have the greatest

crying because I don't have the greatest memories. I don't have the I don't have

memories. I don't have the I don't have the memories of my dad

the memories of my dad like the night like your brother does.

like the night like your brother does. Like my brother does. But I also don't

Like my brother does. But I also don't have like Shannon, I can retain one real

have like Shannon, I can retain one real vivid memory of my father.

vivid memory of my father. Okay?

Okay? And that was we were at a truck stop

And that was we were at a truck stop because he drove trucks. That's it.

because he drove trucks. That's it. That's the only real vivid memory I have

That's the only real vivid memory I have of my father.

of my father. But

But my dad Percy has had already moved into

my dad Percy has had already moved into my life when I was three. Right.

my life when I was three. Right. So I'm four years into that relationship

So I'm four years into that relationship with my mother.

with my mother. Right.

Right. And it was just sad, man. I remember

And it was just sad, man. I remember going to that funeral and

going to that funeral and I see my dad in that casket. He's got

I see my dad in that casket. He's got two families, right? Because while

two families, right? Because while my mom is not with him anymore, they

my mom is not with him anymore, they have kids.

have kids. Her reaction told me that she still

Her reaction told me that she still loved your dad.

loved your dad. I don't think they ever fall out of

I don't think they ever fall out of love. It's like something that they

love. It's like something that they don't really let go of, especially that

don't really let go of, especially that first one. Mhm.

first one. Mhm. Um, but my mom's sitting there with my

Um, but my mom's sitting there with my dad and let me tell you, you I I knew my

dad and let me tell you, you I I knew my mom still loved my dad. One time, I

mom still loved my dad. One time, I don't know if my dad I don't quite

don't know if my dad I don't quite understand if my dad was cheating. I

understand if my dad was cheating. I don't know what it was, Shannon, but my

don't know what it was, Shannon, but my mom took the car at a four-way stop. The

mom took the car at a four-way stop. The other woman was driving the other car.

other woman was driving the other car. She hit her. What? She hit her. My mom

She hit her. What? She hit her. My mom was an angel. You better hold You

was an angel. You better hold You better. My mom was an angel. Your mama

better. My mom was an angel. Your mama play

play was an agent. She play

was an agent. She play she play buba cars in real cars though.

she play buba cars in real cars though. Cop said why'd you hit her? She goes

Cop said why'd you hit her? She goes that's my car too.

that's my car too. This my car. That's my car. I want a

This my car. That's my car. I want a record. I can record. I said oh my god.

record. I can record. I said oh my god. She said but it was a little red light.

She said but it was a little red light. It was a bump.

It was a bump. Yeah.

Yeah. But it wasn't like a hard hit but she

But it wasn't like a hard hit but she like she hit her.

like she hit her. But yes. But yes. So yes. She must have

But yes. But yes. So yes. She must have still loved my dad. But yeah it was it

still loved my dad. But yeah it was it was it was awful. You mentioned that

was it was awful. You mentioned that your stepfather intervene came in your

your stepfather intervene came in your life at a very young age.

life at a very young age. Yes.

Yes. What did you learn from him?

What did you learn from him? Everything.

Everything. Everything.

Everything. Percy Benis was man he was the best. He

Percy Benis was man he was the best. He was the best. He uh

was the best. He uh he worked so hard. He made decisions him

he worked so hard. He made decisions him and my mother that made me appreciate

and my mother that made me appreciate them more than I I don't know if I ever

them more than I I don't know if I ever could appreciate anyone in my life. When

could appreciate anyone in my life. When we were like

we were like seven, eight years old at that time when

seven, eight years old at that time when my dad got passed, they uh they decided

my dad got passed, they uh they decided not to take government assistance

not to take government assistance anymore. We want to make it on our own.

anymore. We want to make it on our own. We were struggling, but they did. They

We were struggling, but they did. They took no help. They just made it on their

took no help. They just made it on their own. Then they bought their first house

own. Then they bought their first house together. And then I watched that man

together. And then I watched that man get up in the morning and he would go

get up in the morning and he would go and work for the city of Lafayette. It

and work for the city of Lafayette. It was hot, man. It was 95, 100°, 100

was hot, man. It was 95, 100°, 100 degree humidity. You know what

degree humidity. You know what Louisiana's like?

Louisiana's like? Mhm.

Mhm. He would he would take the lime and make

He would he would take the lime and make the baseball fields and he would cut the

the baseball fields and he would cut the fields and the grass

fields and the grass and he would come home at 5:30, eat real

and he would come home at 5:30, eat real quick.

quick. And he would get a a bath cuz we didn't

And he would get a a bath cuz we didn't have a shower,

have a shower, jump in his truck and go to a pizza

jump in his truck and go to a pizza parlor and wash dishes to make an extra

parlor and wash dishes to make an extra 60 bucks every time he did that. And he

60 bucks every time he did that. And he did that constantly. And then when he

did that constantly. And then when he when I got old enough, I realized more

when I got old enough, I realized more what he was doing. He when the days that

what he was doing. He when the days that he wasn't going back to uh there, he was

he wasn't going back to uh there, he was going to the cemetery and he was cutting

going to the cemetery and he was cutting it and he was weed eating next to the

it and he was weed eating next to the grapes to make more money. So when I got

grapes to make more money. So when I got old enough, he started taking me with

old enough, he started taking me with him and he's like, "You get $35 a

him and he's like, "You get $35 a month." So every time you do this, I

month." So every time you do this, I guess I made eight or $10, right?

guess I made eight or $10, right? Because it would take us a little bit of

Because it would take us a little bit of time. I learned to work. He taught me to

time. I learned to work. He taught me to work. And I think by him teaching me to

work. And I think by him teaching me to work, um it is

work, um it is defined my life. It's defined my life. I

defined my life. It's defined my life. I I don't

I don't I was the captain of the Olympic

I was the captain of the Olympic wrestling team

wrestling team and it's because I worked hard. They saw

and it's because I worked hard. They saw me. They saw me and said, "I want this

me. They saw me and said, "I want this guy to lead our team."

guy to lead our team." Is that the type of father you are? You

Is that the type of father you are? You try to be what Percy want to do to your

try to be what Percy want to do to your own kids.

own kids. That's what I try to be for my kids. I

That's what I try to be for my kids. I try to be present and show them I'm

try to be present and show them I'm working, man. I'm making a life for you

working, man. I'm making a life for you guys that can be and I hope that you see

guys that can be and I hope that you see and appreciate what I'm doing,

and appreciate what I'm doing, right?

right? Because while

Because while I don't see the struggle, they don't see

I don't see the struggle, they don't see the struggle that I saw, they do see

the struggle that I saw, they do see that their dad is willing to just

that their dad is willing to just I took my daughters to a photo shoot I

I took my daughters to a photo shoot I did for Monster Energy the other day

did for Monster Energy the other day and they were like, "Dad, you work

and they were like, "Dad, you work hard." I was like, I wanted to give you

hard." I was like, I wanted to give you just kind of see what what dad does when

just kind of see what what dad does when he gets up at 5:00 a.m. and he's back

he gets up at 5:00 a.m. and he's back home by 6:00 to make sure you guys have

home by 6:00 to make sure you guys have dinner.

dinner. Right.

Right. Right. It's like those types of things,

Right. It's like those types of things, they they mean the world to me. My dad

they they mean the world to me. My dad was the best.

was the best. You lost your a daughter.

You lost your a daughter. I did, man.

I did, man. To 18 wheeler accident.

To 18 wheeler accident. Yeah, that was that was the worst. That

Yeah, that was that was the worst. That was the worst. I've had a lot of things

was the worst. I've had a lot of things happen in my life that that

happen in my life that that um I try not to let define me. Like I

um I try not to let define me. Like I try like I try not to let like certain

try like I try not to let like certain things define me like the bad.

things define me like the bad. Mhm.

Mhm. But yeah, that was the worst. I uh I was

But yeah, that was the worst. I uh I was 23 years old. I had a daughter named

23 years old. I had a daughter named Kayan Emory.

Kayan Emory. Mhm.

Mhm. And uh

we were in college or just finishing college. So

college. So her mom was from Colleen, Texas.

her mom was from Colleen, Texas. Okay.

Okay. And they were driving home to see her

And they were driving home to see her parents and uh but her car didn't have

parents and uh but her car didn't have air conditioning.

air conditioning. Mhm.

Mhm. And she was like, "I'm going to put my

And she was like, "I'm going to put my kid in the car with my friend."

kid in the car with my friend." Mhm.

Mhm. Because they have a newer car,

Because they have a newer car, right?

right? Yeah. And it got rear ended by

Yeah. And it got rear ended by 18-wheeler. That was the worst, man.

18-wheeler. That was the worst, man. If she was with her mom,

If she was with her mom, she would have been fine. But

she would have been fine. But we make these decisions at times that we

we make these decisions at times that we think are the right decision. And

think are the right decision. And it has killed her mom's life.

it has killed her mom's life. I was You know what, DC? I was about to

I was You know what, DC? I was about to ask you. I bet she beat herself up.

ask you. I bet she beat herself up. She I should have I should have just

She I should have I should have just rolled the window down. She should have

rolled the window down. She should have been with me.

been with me. Yep. It her mom's life is

Yep. It her mom's life is It hadn't been the same, has it?

It hadn't been the same, has it? No. That girl, that girl was on a track

No. That girl, that girl was on a track team at Oklahoma State where I went to

team at Oklahoma State where I went to school and she had such a big future and

school and she had such a big future and now it's like she's at home taking care

now it's like she's at home taking care of her mother. That that losing that

of her mother. That that losing that kid, losing our kid, like it killed her.

kid, losing our kid, like it killed her. I was able to

I was able to I was able to spin it and say that every

I was able to spin it and say that every time I wrestle, every time I fight, I

time I wrestle, every time I fight, I have an angel sitting on the cage to

have an angel sitting on the cage to watch over me.

watch over me. Her mom was never able to do that. It's

Her mom was never able to do that. It's sad, man. Yeah,

sad, man. Yeah, that was the worst thing that's ever

that was the worst thing that's ever happened to my

happened to my Because as parents, we expect our kids

Because as parents, we expect our kids to bury us.

to bury us. Yes.

Yes. We don't expect to bury a child.

We don't expect to bury a child. Not that young.

Not that young. Not that young, man. She's three and a

Not that young, man. She's three and a half months old.

half months old. So like to put her in a casket.

So like to put her in a casket. Yeah. That [ __ ] sucks. Yeah. I even

Yeah. That [ __ ] sucks. Yeah. I even think just thinking about it like it

think just thinking about it like it sucks. Has it changed the relationship

sucks. Has it changed the relationship that you had with subsequent quid kids

that you had with subsequent quid kids that you hold them tighter that you like

that you hold them tighter that you like you realize how just how fragile life is

you realize how just how fragile life is that tomorrow is not promised even 3

that tomorrow is not promised even 3 hours from right now isn't promised?

hours from right now isn't promised? No, I know. Yeah, it's it's uh it is

No, I know. Yeah, it's it's uh it is it's bad to the point that Shannon at

it's bad to the point that Shannon at times you got to like you have to I have

times you got to like you have to I have to like

to like I have to like consciously try not to be

I have to like consciously try not to be as much of a like a helicopter parent.

as much of a like a helicopter parent. Mhm.

Mhm. I'm trying to like because I know how

I'm trying to like because I know how important it is for him to experience

important it is for him to experience things. But it is scary like my my son

things. But it is scary like my my son is getting older now. Like

is getting older now. Like I just started I let him ride his bike

I just started I let him ride his bike to the barber shop now to get a haircut.

to the barber shop now to get a haircut. That was something I could have never

That was something I could have never done.

done. Like never.

Like never. You talking about a bicycle or motor

You talking about a bicycle or motor bike or motorcycle?

bike or motorcycle? Like one of those electric

Like one of those electric electric bike. Okay. Electric. Okay.

electric bike. Okay. Electric. Okay. Okay.

Okay. So I let him but he but I always but I I

So I let him but he but I always but I I make him put his location on the moment

make him put his location on the moment he leaves the house. Location on.

he leaves the house. Location on. So I'm trying, dude. But yeah, it's

So I'm trying, dude. But yeah, it's hard. It it really has uh it really has

hard. It it really has uh it really has changed me in terms of parenting.

changed me in terms of parenting. You try. You try. It's important. Like

You try. You try. It's important. Like I did a lot growing up. I had a lot of

I did a lot growing up. I had a lot of freedom

freedom and it it it

and it it it it it gave me a little bit of like

it it gave me a little bit of like street smarts and ability to adjust and

street smarts and ability to adjust and make my way around life.

make my way around life. You I mean pro people probably wouldn't

You I mean pro people probably wouldn't know this about you, but you've had a I

know this about you, but you've had a I mean you've had a lot of death in your

mean you've had a lot of death in your family. Your grandmother, your cousin,

family. Your grandmother, your cousin, you lost a child at a very young age.

you lost a child at a very young age. People

People ask me because they know how close I am

ask me because they know how close I am with my grandmother. They will say,

with my grandmother. They will say, "Shannon, how did you get over?"

"Shannon, how did you get over?" Yeah.

Yeah. I say, "You never get over it." No,

I say, "You never get over it." No, you just get better at dealing with it.

you just get better at dealing with it. Yeah.

Yeah. How have you been able to get better at

How have you been able to get better at dealing with

dealing with loss? Uh well, at 20 when you lose a kid

loss? Uh well, at 20 when you lose a kid at that age, right, like you feel like

at that age, right, like you feel like nothing ever is going to feel worse.

nothing ever is going to feel worse. But I've I've done I've managed to

But I've I've done I've managed to I've managed to learn how to take those

I've managed to learn how to take those things and try to make them push me

things and try to make them push me forward. Okay. So,

forward. Okay. So, cuz my daughter like I had never made a

cuz my daughter like I had never made a United States team

United States team after my daughter passed I made six in a

after my daughter passed I made six in a row.

row. Wow.

Wow. Swear to God. The my daughter passed in

Swear to God. The my daughter passed in June or in May of uh

June or in May of uh You had a bigger purpose.

You had a bigger purpose. May of 20. Yes.

May of 20. Yes. That you didn't know.

That you didn't know. Yes. And from I by by all this I

Yes. And from I by by all this I wrestled in the world championships for

wrestled in the world championships for the first time

the first time then the Olympic Games and all the way

then the Olympic Games and all the way through.

through. My mom

My mom when she passed uh a couple years ago

when she passed uh a couple years ago obviously I don't do anything

obviously I don't do anything competitive anymore

competitive anymore but in terms of my media career has just

but in terms of my media career has just gotten bigger. Yeah. Because I work

gotten bigger. Yeah. Because I work harder now because I know that even

harder now because I know that even though I don't have to provide for her

though I don't have to provide for her in the way that I did before

in the way that I did before I still need to work

I still need to work because she was part of that work.

because she was part of that work. Yes. I want to do more TV because she

Yes. I want to do more TV because she watched everything, right? So even

watched everything, right? So even though she's not there watching now,

though she's not there watching now, like I know she watched it all. So I try

like I know she watched it all. So I try to uh

to uh I try to spin it. That's the only way

I try to spin it. That's the only way cuz otherwise it cripples you.

cuz otherwise it cripples you. It does.

It does. It really does [ __ ] you. Like you and

It really does [ __ ] you. Like you and like I've heard stories about you and

like I've heard stories about you and your grandmother and it's like and how

your grandmother and it's like and how special a lady she was to you.

special a lady she was to you. Y

Y but yeah, you don't you don't ever get

but yeah, you don't you don't ever get over losing somebody you love that much.

over losing somebody you love that much. You can't.

You can't. this cutting weight thing. You said that

this cutting weight thing. You said that in this Thanksgiving

in this Thanksgiving you weighed 257.

you weighed 257. Yeah.

Yeah. And basically 4550 days you were down to

And basically 4550 days you were down to 204.

204. Yep.

Yep. Obviously that's very taxing on the

Obviously that's very taxing on the body.

body. Yes, it is.

Yes, it is. Very taxing to cut that kind of water

Very taxing to cut that kind of water weight cuz that's not a that's not all

weight cuz that's not a that's not all just you know good weight.

just you know good weight. Yeah.

Yeah. And you went to renal failure at one

And you went to renal failure at one time, right?

time, right? I did at the Olympic Games. Yeah. But I

I did at the Olympic Games. Yeah. But I wasn't that big at the time. I was just

wasn't that big at the time. I was just in wrestling. I didn't have the access

in wrestling. I didn't have the access to the I didn't have the access or the

to the I didn't have the access or the resources.

resources. Mhm.

Mhm. I couldn't have done that without my

I couldn't have done that without my chef,

chef, right?

right? I had like Tyler Minton

I had like Tyler Minton Mhm.

Mhm. uh was working for me at the time.

uh was working for me at the time. He uh

He uh every meal, every meal, every drink, he

every meal, every meal, every drink, he would feed me, then he would write it

would feed me, then he would write it down.

down. He would feed me, then he would write it

He would feed me, then he would write it down. I got to drink a kombucha every

down. I got to drink a kombucha every day. That was it. outside of water,

day. That was it. outside of water, that's all I had,

that's all I had, right?

right? And some sort of uh like electrolytes

And some sort of uh like electrolytes stuff to make sure I wasn't cramping

stuff to make sure I wasn't cramping when I went to the uh the cage to train.

when I went to the uh the cage to train. But outside of like that, I had water

But outside of like that, I had water and eat every meal.

and eat every meal. Mhm.

Mhm. Here you go. And at the right times when

Here you go. And at the right times when I was wrestling,

I was wrestling, I would I would eat until Wednesday and

I would I would eat until Wednesday and then I just would not eat until I

then I just would not eat until I weighed in on Friday or Saturday. I

weighed in on Friday or Saturday. I would go three days without anything.

would go three days without anything. Rob DeWalis really still does that. the

Rob DeWalis really still does that. the champ at 135.

champ at 135. He just will not eat.

He just will not eat. I don't I don't You don't have to do it

I don't I don't You don't have to do it that way anymore.

that way anymore. You don't. He's got money. But yeah, I

You don't. He's got money. But yeah, I would uh

would uh my my kidneys quit on me at the Olympic

my my kidneys quit on me at the Olympic Games.

Games. Mhm.

Mhm. End up in the hospital. I wasn't a

End up in the hospital. I wasn't a diamond

diamond because they don't let you take

because they don't let you take diuretics, does it?

diuretics, does it? Can't take diuretics. Can't take IVs.

Can't take diuretics. Can't take IVs. Can't do nothing. If I could have took

Can't do nothing. If I could have took an IV after weigh-ins, I'd have been

an IV after weigh-ins, I'd have been fine. Right.

fine. Right. Right. It was right before the Olympic

Right. It was right before the Olympic Games that they did away with IVs. I

Games that they did away with IVs. I didn't want to cheat.

didn't want to cheat. I didn't want to cheat my body. Dude,

I didn't want to cheat my body. Dude, there it was. That was a

there it was. That was a What's What's the most weight you've had

What's What's the most weight you've had to cut?

So, by by design,

by by design, if I was fighting on

if I was fighting on if I was fighting on Saturday

if I was fighting on Saturday Mhm.

Mhm. when I showed up to Vegas on Tuesday, I

when I showed up to Vegas on Tuesday, I probably was like 220. if it was good.

probably was like 220. if it was good. But I remember one time I

But I remember one time I in New York against Rumble in Buffalo, I

in New York against Rumble in Buffalo, I was like 231 on Sunday

was like 231 on Sunday before the fight on Saturday the next

before the fight on Saturday the next what?

what? 231. Yeah.

231. Yeah. And you got to get down to 2 205.

And you got to get down to 2 205. Yeah. But I was like I was heavy. So I'd

Yeah. But I was like I was heavy. So I'd go run, lose like 5 lbs. You lose a lot

go run, lose like 5 lbs. You lose a lot of weight, Shannon.

of weight, Shannon. Yeah.

Yeah. And you drink a lot of water,

And you drink a lot of water, right?

right? Those these nutritionists are so good at

Those these nutritionists are so good at manipulating weight now.

manipulating weight now. Yes. You have no idea. So like

Yes. You have no idea. So like if I'm like 217, 218, 220, like 220.

if I'm like 217, 218, 220, like 220. Oh, you're a sweet spot. You in your

Oh, you're a sweet spot. You in your wheelhouse

wheelhouse because because now I've got that with

because because now I've got that with two gallons of water in a day.

two gallons of water in a day. Right.

Right. Right. That's 16 lbs at minimum. So by

Right. That's 16 lbs at minimum. So by the time I get in that sauna, I'm like

the time I get in that sauna, I'm like it all comes off.

it all comes off. But it's only for a short period of

But it's only for a short period of time.

time. Right.

Right. Like I'm at 204 and a half or maybe an

Like I'm at 204 and a half or maybe an hour.

hour. When you re when you re

When you re when you re hydrate. Yeah. What are you What are you

hydrate. Yeah. What are you What are you going back up to? You going to rebound

going back up to? You going to rebound to what? 220 225.

to what? 220 225. When Jon Jones for when I fought Jon

When Jon Jones for when I fought Jon Jones and I was in peak physical

Jones and I was in peak physical condition.

condition. Yeah.

Yeah. There was nothing I could do to get over

There was nothing I could do to get over 222.

222. Like I mean literally trained there at

Like I mean literally trained there at for the last four weeks of camp cuz I

for the last four weeks of camp cuz I was so locked in.

was so locked in. Right.

Right. When I fought Rumble Johnson, I weighed

When I fought Rumble Johnson, I weighed 231 on Saturday night when I fought him

231 on Saturday night when I fought him the next day.

the next day. Wow.

Wow. I weighed 205.

I weighed 205. Yeah. 20 I gained 26 pounds overnight.

Yeah. 20 I gained 26 pounds overnight. That's too much. I felt so sluggish and

That's too much. I felt so sluggish and horrible.

horrible. Right.

Right. But yeah, I've cut a lot of weight. I

But yeah, I've cut a lot of weight. I use you lose like 10 pounds an hour

use you lose like 10 pounds an hour though when you do those weight cuts.

though when you do those weight cuts. Wow.

Wow. Do you feel that your your height I mean

Do you feel that your your height I mean because like you little but probably a

because like you little but probably a tick under six foot tall.

tick under six foot tall. I'm five I've gotten shorter. I'm like

I'm five I've gotten shorter. I'm like 510 on a good day. 510 and a half. I've

510 on a good day. 510 and a half. I've I've shrunk. Shannon, have you shrunk at

I've shrunk. Shannon, have you shrunk at all? Have you gotten shorter at all?

all? Have you gotten shorter at all? Yeah, I think so too. I think as we get

Yeah, I think so too. I think as we get older we we we shrink it. I I believe I

older we we we shrink it. I I believe I have. But but when you when you you you

have. But but when you when you you you like for

like for I would think somebody your size your

I would think somebody your size your height would be ideal is ideal for

height would be ideal is ideal for wrestling.

wrestling. Oh wrestling

Oh wrestling because you you because you got a short

because you you because you got a short torso but you got long legs

torso but you got long legs compact. Yeah.

compact. Yeah. And I'm good at getting close. Once I

And I'm good at getting close. Once I get once I get if I get they say I'm

get once I get if I get they say I'm sticky,

sticky, right?

right? If I get close to you, I'm sticking to

If I get close to you, I'm sticking to you like you stuck in a fly trap. Like

you like you stuck in a fly trap. Like seriously, it's like

seriously, it's like So you're trying to close the distance.

So you're trying to close the distance. Oh, if I got close, you're in trouble.

Oh, if I got close, you're in trouble. If I can grab you by the head, I'm

If I can grab you by the head, I'm punching you uppercuts. If I can grab

punching you uppercuts. If I can grab your leg, then you're really in trouble

your leg, then you're really in trouble because I had a thousand ways to finish

because I had a thousand ways to finish a takedown.

a takedown. The moment I got your leg,

The moment I got your leg, Yeah.

Yeah. you're in a lot of trouble.

you're in a lot of trouble. Yeah.

Yeah. Because I'm either gonna move you here,

Because I'm either gonna move you here, left, right, up, down.

left, right, up, down. Mhm.

Mhm. It's all subtleties. It's the same thing

It's all subtleties. It's the same thing like how So like

like how So like Shannon, I could I could actually try to

Shannon, I could I could actually try to guard you right now and I could not.

guard you right now and I could not. Cuz even if you might not be able to run

Cuz even if you might not be able to run as fast as you did, right, you going to

as fast as you did, right, you going to give me something in the shoulders or

give me something in the shoulders or something in the eyes. You going to get

something in the eyes. You going to get some separation.

some separation. Correct. That's me and wrestling. I'm

Correct. That's me and wrestling. I'm just like here, here, here, here,

just like here, here, here, here, and they get lost.

and they get lost. Do you like It's It's funny like when

Do you like It's It's funny like when you grab somebody here cuz I'm watching

you grab somebody here cuz I'm watching these boxes and you watch him close up,

these boxes and you watch him close up, he'll throw a punch and he put his hand

he'll throw a punch and he put his hand up because he know what's coming and

up because he know what's coming and he'll do this and he'll throw that. Oh,

he'll do this and he'll throw that. Oh, he'll do this and he'll do that. So, you

he'll do this and he'll do that. So, you know, like if I got this, I know what

know, like if I got this, I know what he's going to do.

he's going to do. Absolutely. I'll I'll manipulate you to

Absolutely. I'll I'll manipulate you to do what I want you to do.

do what I want you to do. Wow.

Wow. Yeah. I'll manipulate you. That's why

Yeah. I'll manipulate you. That's why like my takedown offense, I think I

like my takedown offense, I think I might have landed 50% of my takedowns.

might have landed 50% of my takedowns. 40.

40. Wow.

Wow. They're like, "Dude, you only landed

They're like, "Dude, you only landed 40." Like, "Yeah, but the first few

40." Like, "Yeah, but the first few aren't designed to take you down,

aren't designed to take you down, right?

right? They're to set you up for number four,

They're to set you up for number four, five, and six.

five, and six. When I really want to get you down,

When I really want to get you down, when I really want to get you down, then

when I really want to get you down, then you get up in the air, I flip you or I

you get up in the air, I flip you or I trip you or it's like, yeah, it's like

trip you or it's like, yeah, it's like it's all setups."

it's all setups." You mentioned boxing was your first

You mentioned boxing was your first love, though.

love, though. Yep, I did. Cuz it's all I knew. It's

Yep, I did. Cuz it's all I knew. It's what we knew. Like they would watch my

what we knew. Like they would watch my uncles all watch the wild war the sports

uncles all watch the wild war the sports every weekend and we'd watch like George

every weekend and we'd watch like George Foreman clips and Muhammad Ali clips and

Foreman clips and Muhammad Ali clips and Mike Tyson.

Mike Tyson. So it's like we're watching this

So it's like we're watching this greatness and it looks like us,

greatness and it looks like us, right?

right? That is where the difference was.

That is where the difference was. You watch that greatness and it's like

You watch that greatness and it's like wow this dude looks like he could be

wow this dude looks like he could be where I'm from

where I'm from and he's making he's the man,

and he's making he's the man, right?

right? He's a superstar. That's what drew me

He's a superstar. That's what drew me into boxing

into boxing because every story was about a kid from

because every story was about a kid from a tough neighborhood.

a tough neighborhood. Yes.

Yes. He was from Michigan. He was from

He was from Michigan. He was from Louisville, Kentucky. He was from like

Louisville, Kentucky. He was from like just all these places. Yeah.

just all these places. Yeah. The main streets like wait a minute,

The main streets like wait a minute, this looks very familiar.

this looks very familiar. And look at him today, right?

And look at him today, right? So yeah, it it just drew me in like

So yeah, it it just drew me in like Bud and Canelo.

Bud and Canelo. That's a tough fight. I saw Bud

That's a tough fight. I saw Bud recently. He's big.

recently. He's big. Bud bigger than you think. He's stronger

Bud bigger than you think. He's stronger than you think.

than you think. Strong, too. Your bud son is ridiculous.

Strong, too. Your bud son is ridiculous. We had Wrestlemania right up the street.

We had Wrestlemania right up the street. He got a belt. He walked past me and he

He got a belt. He walked past me and he was looking at me the whole time. He

was looking at me the whole time. He looked at me said, "You the wrestler. I

looked at me said, "You the wrestler. I knocked you out on UFC." I was like,

knocked you out on UFC." I was like, "Bo, you crazy." When he crazy, Bud told

"Bo, you crazy." When he crazy, Bud told me he had to whip him. Bud said he went

me he had to whip him. Bud said he went to Sean uh what's his name? Sean

to Sean uh what's his name? Sean Crawford. Sean Taylor. Sean uh Sean

Crawford. Sean Taylor. Sean uh Sean Sean Porter.

Sean Porter. Sean Porter. Bud say Sean Bud say that's

Sean Porter. Bud say Sean Bud say that's him. went to Sean Porter said, "My dad

him. went to Sean Porter said, "My dad knocked you out." Sean Porter had to

knocked you out." Sean Porter had to call him and be like, "Man, your son's

call him and be like, "Man, your son's crazy." Buzz, I had to spank him.

crazy." Buzz, I had to spank him. He crazy. But yes, he's bigger. It's a

He crazy. But yes, he's bigger. It's a big time fight. Canelo better have his

big time fight. Canelo better have his game ready. Yeah, because if not, he

game ready. Yeah, because if not, he going to get beat by Bud.

going to get beat by Bud. Yeah, Bud. I mean, like I said, Bud B I

Yeah, Bud. I mean, like I said, Bud B I mean, Bud walks Bud fought at, you know,

mean, Bud walks Bud fought at, you know, last fought at, you know, Junior

last fought at, you know, Junior Middleweight at 154, but Bud walks

Middleweight at 154, but Bud walks around at like 180.

around at like 180. He's big, man. And he's tall, too.

He's big, man. And he's tall, too. Yeah,

Yeah, he's very tall. He looked big. I saw him

he's very tall. He looked big. I saw him inside the uh the Apex training. Yep. He

inside the uh the Apex training. Yep. He looked big. You went watch him train,

looked big. You went watch him train, too?

too? I uh No, we did a we did a interview

I uh No, we did a we did a interview with him and but he I say he's he's

with him and but he I say he's he's stronger than you think.

stronger than you think. He's stronger than you could tell.

He's stronger than you could tell. Yeah, he's stronger than you think.

Yeah, he's stronger than you think. Got his hands full.

Got his hands full. He does.

He does. You were bullied as a kid. Is that why

You were bullied as a kid. Is that why you got into wrestling and and fighting

you got into wrestling and and fighting because you were bullied? You're like, I

because you were bullied? You're like, I ain't taking this issue no more.

ain't taking this issue no more. So, I was bullied bad, Shannon.

So, I was bullied bad, Shannon. Okay.

Okay. Like this guy used to beat me up all the

Like this guy used to beat me up all the time. He would beat me up for no reason.

time. He would beat me up for no reason. It was like no reason to fight me. He

It was like no reason to fight me. He would just pick on me. If they they

would just pick on me. If they they could have three other kids fight, he

could have three other kids fight, he would show up to watch the fight. Then

would show up to watch the fight. Then once that fight was over, he's like,

once that fight was over, he's like, "Should I might as well give me one

"Should I might as well give me one until they get a dog."

until they get a dog." I was scared, too. I was so scared of

I was scared, too. I was so scared of him. And then I I learned to wrestle.

him. And then I I learned to wrestle. Once I got him, it was over, man. Right.

Once I got him, it was over, man. Right. Once I got him once, it was over. But

Once I got him once, it was over. But yeah. Yeah. It gave me self-defense. I

yeah. Yeah. It gave me self-defense. I think wrestling is so important for kids

think wrestling is so important for kids because then you learn to defend

because then you learn to defend yourself and also it gives you a

yourself and also it gives you a confidence. I got this academy in my my

confidence. I got this academy in my my in Gilroy, the Daniel Cory Wrestling

in Gilroy, the Daniel Cory Wrestling Academy. Kids walk in and they're

Academy. Kids walk in and they're hunched over looking like scared, right?

hunched over looking like scared, right? Cuz the ones that have been doing it for

Cuz the ones that have been doing it for a while have this intensity about them.

a while have this intensity about them. They're strong. They're confident,

They're strong. They're confident, right?

right? 6 months later, they're like

6 months later, they're like walking in with some I'm like, "Okay,

walking in with some I'm like, "Okay, this what I need." That's what wrestling

this what I need." That's what wrestling gives you. I I think it's the best.

gives you. I I think it's the best. Right. Have you ever been arrested for

Right. Have you ever been arrested for street fighting?

street fighting? One time I got arrested in college when

One time I got arrested in college when I was a freshman. I punched a guy, man.

I was a freshman. I punched a guy, man. What do you do?

What do you do? So, I went to a junior college in

So, I went to a junior college in Kansas,

Kansas, and uh

and uh one of the biggest mistakes that young

one of the biggest mistakes that young black men make when they go to different

black men make when they go to different places is they almost try to recreate

places is they almost try to recreate themselves.

themselves. You can be a great kid, but you will

You can be a great kid, but you will portray yourself as a gangster or a bad

portray yourself as a gangster or a bad guy, right?

guy, right? Because you want people to not only

Because you want people to not only respect you, you want to make sure you

respect you, you want to make sure you fit in and they kind of fear you a

fit in and they kind of fear you a little bit. Yep.

little bit. Yep. It's like very important. So I did that

It's like very important. So I did that and I'm at this party and we go to this

and I'm at this party and we go to this party and the guy comes out. It's his

party and the guy comes out. It's his house and he starts talking and he said

house and he starts talking and he said something that I viewed as disrespectful

something that I viewed as disrespectful when he came charging towards me. So I

when he came charging towards me. So I punched him, bro. He he I don't know if

punched him, bro. He he I don't know if his jaw was like super like loose

his jaw was like super like loose cuz he he went he went to

cuz he he went he went to he went down and his jaw broke really

he went down and his jaw broke really bad.

bad. So blood's like everywhere. We run off

So blood's like everywhere. We run off me and all my wrestler friends. The cops

me and all my wrestler friends. The cops come to get us. I we're in Kansas. I was

come to get us. I we're in Kansas. I was like, "Oh man, we saw I saw this Mexican

like, "Oh man, we saw I saw this Mexican dude do it and run away." They said,

dude do it and run away." They said, "Nah, man. It was you.

"Nah, man. It was you. It was you, Eric.

It was you, Eric. Try to put it off."

Try to put it off." I tried to put on a Mexican dude, man. I

I tried to put on a Mexican dude, man. I was like, "Oh, they ain't got many brown

was like, "Oh, they ain't got many brown people out here. They ain't got many

people out here. They ain't got many brown people out here." They said, "No,

brown people out here." They said, "No, it was you." They put me in jail. I was

it was you." They put me in jail. I was crying, dude. Then they put they put me

crying, dude. Then they put they put me in jail on a Friday night, Shannon. And

in jail on a Friday night, Shannon. And in those little towns

in those little towns Oh, you don't get till Monday.

Oh, you don't get till Monday. And then once Monday come, they got 72

And then once Monday come, they got 72 hours to see you. Yeah, man.

hours to see you. Yeah, man. They kept me in jail till Wednesday.

They kept me in jail till Wednesday. Damn.

Damn. I was crying. My mom actually to pay to

I was crying. My mom actually to pay to pay to get me out, she had to take like

pay to get me out, she had to take like put it up against her house.

put it up against her house. Wow.

Wow. To get me out of jail, she put her house

To get me out of jail, she put her house on the line as a as counter for the uh

on the line as a as counter for the uh for the bail.

for the bail. For the bail.

For the bail. Yep. And then I was like, "This woman

Yep. And then I was like, "This woman won't do anything for me. I'm the one

won't do anything for me. I'm the one that messed up."

that messed up." Right.

Right. I ran her phone bill up, calling her

I ran her phone bill up, calling her every day. Thousands of thousands of

every day. Thousands of thousands of dollars. They ain't had nothing to pay

dollars. They ain't had nothing to pay that. But she answered it every time.

that. But she answered it every time. That's why she was the best to me.

That's why she was the best to me. Everybody like, "Oh, you love your mama

Everybody like, "Oh, you love your mama more than you'll love anybody in the

more than you'll love anybody in the world." I was like, "You saw what she

world." I was like, "You saw what she did for me."

did for me." She She said she was the best.

She She said she was the best. You tried some everything. You sold

You tried some everything. You sold drugs as a kid.

drugs as a kid. I You tried to

I You tried to Shannon, I was a bad drug dealer.

Shannon, I was a bad drug dealer. What? So what? So

What? So what? So Shannon, you don't want to hear this

Shannon, you don't want to hear this story.

story. Shannon,

Shannon, we made hor we made fake drugs one time.

we made hor we made fake drugs one time. Oh, look. share a weed with.

Oh, look. share a weed with. So when you cut grass and just put

So when you cut grass and just put This was when I was a kid. No, no, no,

This was when I was a kid. No, no, no, no. Back when I was growing up, it

no. Back when I was growing up, it wasn't weed. It was crack.

wasn't weed. It was crack. Oh,

Oh, I tried to sell crack. Shannon, I was

I tried to sell crack. Shannon, I was broke. I needed $20.

broke. I needed $20. Bro, you don't know how to cook?

Bro, you don't know how to cook? I don't know how to cook. I don't know.

I don't know how to cook. I don't know. I don't know nothing about it. But

I don't know nothing about it. But listen what we did, though. We took some

listen what we did, though. We took some uh wax.

uh wax. Yeah.

Yeah. And put or gel on it cuz I guess that it

And put or gel on it cuz I guess that it must numb the face or something. One of

must numb the face or something. One of my friends told me that one. He was

my friends told me that one. He was Yeah. So I gave it to the drug. I gave

Yeah. So I gave it to the drug. I gave it to the dude who gave me the money.

it to the dude who gave me the money. He

He He start

He start He look up. I took off running.

He look up. I took off running. I took off,

man. He called me, man. I running back. I gave out. There you go, man. You got

I gave out. There you go, man. You got me.

me. Bad down. You You done ate the crack

Bad down. You You done ate the crack now. You You out of this.

now. You You out of this. That was the last time. That was the

That was the last time. That was the last time I ever tried some stupid [ __ ]

last time I ever tried some stupid [ __ ] like that. I was like, man, this is

like that. I was like, man, this is sports for me. It was bad. Could

sports for me. It was bad. Could a boxer ever be the MMA fighter in a

a boxer ever be the MMA fighter in a street fight?

street fight? No. No. They would get taken down. It It

No. No. They would get taken down. It It would happen too fast. I saw James Tony

would happen too fast. I saw James Tony fight Randy Couture.

fight Randy Couture. James Tony was one of the slickest, best

James Tony was one of the slickest, best boxers of all time.

boxers of all time. He tapped without actually tapping

He tapped without actually tapping Randy. He just waved at the ref like,

Randy. He just waved at the ref like, "Save me."

"Save me." Right.

Right. That's what happens when boxers fight.

That's what happens when boxers fight. The baddest man on the planet The

The baddest man on the planet The baddest man on the planet is a mixed

baddest man on the planet is a mixed martial arts fighter.

martial arts fighter. Mhm.

Mhm. Nothing else. in terms of hand-to-hand

Nothing else. in terms of hand-to-hand combat,

combat, right?

right? Yeah. The baddest man in on the planet

Yeah. The baddest man in on the planet is the UFC heavyweight champion every

is the UFC heavyweight champion every time. Unless Francis Andu is out there

time. Unless Francis Andu is out there fighting for someone else,

fighting for someone else, right?

right? Then there's a chance that he's the

Then there's a chance that he's the baddest man on the planet.

baddest man on the planet. There's a chance it might be somebody

There's a chance it might be somebody else.

else. He might beat whoever we have because

He might beat whoever we have because he's that good. But

he's that good. But if not, it's either Tom Aspenol,

if not, it's either Tom Aspenol, Francis, Ganu, or Jon Jones right now.

Francis, Ganu, or Jon Jones right now. Those are the baddest men on the planet.

Those are the baddest men on the planet. Nobody else. we come back and have a

Nobody else. we come back and have a conversation five years, 10 years from

conversation five years, 10 years from now.

now. Yep.

Yep. What's DC doing?

What's DC doing? Uh, probably the same thing. Probably

Uh, probably the same thing. Probably doing the same thing. Working UFC

doing the same thing. Working UFC fights. I love my job.

fights. I love my job. I love calling fights. I think I have

I love calling fights. I think I have the best job in the world.

the best job in the world. Yep.

Yep. Uh, podcasting, doing television. Same.

Uh, podcasting, doing television. Same. Cuz I don't think that right now uh

Cuz I don't think that right now uh I don't think that right now I'm willing

I don't think that right now I'm willing to stop you. Like we said earlier,

to stop you. Like we said earlier, you're a worker. I'm a worker.

you're a worker. I'm a worker. I just might be living in the town

I just might be living in the town wherever my son or my daughter goes to

wherever my son or my daughter goes to college. I just can't let it go. I told

college. I just can't let it go. I told my daughter the other day, if you I

my daughter the other day, if you I said, "Pick a school close and I'll pay

said, "Pick a school close and I'll pay everything."

everything." She wants to get far away. She want

you thinking of colleges yet? She goes, "What? No." She goes, "Dad, I'm 13." I

"What? No." She goes, "Dad, I'm 13." I go, "Could you go to Cal?" I like, "Stay

go, "Could you go to Cal?" I like, "Stay close." I go, "I'll pay you rent. I'll

close." I go, "I'll pay you rent. I'll give you a stipen. I'll do everything."

give you a stipen. I'll do everything." She was like, "No, you don't have to.

She was like, "No, you don't have to. You're you're good."

You're you're good." You want to get away from my ass.

You want to get away from my ass. My man.

My man. Daniel Cormier.

Daniel Cormier. Yes. You're the man.

Yes. You're the man. Is it Cormier or Cormier?

Is it Cormier or Cormier? Cormier.

Cormier. Cormier.

Cormier. Yeah.

Yeah. DC.

DC. That was good. All my life. Been

That was good. All my life. Been grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle.

grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle. Paid the price. Want a slice. Got to

Paid the price. Want a slice. Got to roll the dice. That's why. All my life

roll the dice. That's why. All my life I've been grinding all my life. All my

I've been grinding all my life. All my life. Been grinding all my life.

life. Been grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle. Paid the price. Want

Sacrifice. Hustle. Paid the price. Want a slice. Got to roll a dice. That's why

a slice. Got to roll a dice. That's why all my life I've been grinding all my

all my life I've been grinding all my life.

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Daniel Cormier On Jon Jones, Dana White, Conor McGregor, Khabib, LeBron, Tom Brady & Jake Paul