YouTube Transcript:
Introduction to Nagarjuna's Middle View on Buddhism

Skip watching entire videos - get the full transcript, search for keywords, and copy with one click.

Video Transcript

before i

begin i think that what i would like to

do i'm a movie fan

and so i and so i thought that maybe

i'll start by showing you a clip

actually a couple of clips

from some blockbuster movies and that

indicated the sense of the

the

not exactly the buddhist ideas but

something to do with what we're going to

be talking about so the first one that i

would like to show

show is

is is

let me see this

this

is the construct

it's our learning program

we can load anything from clothing

to equipment weapons

weapons

training simulations anything

hair is changed

your appearance now is what we call

residual self-connect

it is the mental projection of your

is simply electrical signals interpreted

this is the world of you know

the world as it was at the end of the 20th

century it exists now only as part of a

neural interactive simulation

even living in a dream world near

this is the world

okay

have you seen this movie before you must

have seen this movie before

and i thought that this is a nice clip

to talk about reality yes

yes

thank you now how do i eject this okay

okay

all right

um well that is uh basically is uh keanu

reeves and he's a computer programmer and

and

he was shown

uh introduced to the real world uh by uh

going through some sort of a process i

think he took the blue pill or something

like that

and um and another one that i want to

show you another clip is is a clip

another uh

blockbuster movie

and it's called mib

uh men in black and this is a this clip

has to do with uh

with the aliens and the aliens uh

uh all over the place in new york many

of them are from out of space and this

clip shows the murder of an alien

emperor who came from

some other kind of galaxies but what is

interesting is what lies behind the

emperor and it's really

an indication of the

concept of ant-man and uh you know

there's the self that there is something

that the

controls us about our actions our

behavior our thoughts etc so

you can kill us both but you will not

this is when they

[Music] oh

approximately 112 degrees at time of

autopsy indicating an increase in body

temperature examiner tried to verify

this rectally only to find the subject

who's without rectum which is needless

to say really weird

i'm dr leo medical department of public

health it's dr white

there's a skeletal structure here unlike

anything i've ever seen before all right

i'll have a look at this one why don't

you and check out the other vinyl please

this way doctor

this one's even stranger

we did a full laparole i started with

the lesser curvature of the stomach but

we can start with the gastroesophageal

junction whichever you prefer

yes it is now it came in with the body

okay dive right in i'm sure you don't mind

of course

that's obviously the first thing i noticed

noticed

but what i was pointing out is the fact

that there are no um pieces

pieces

of them left

yeah you know so they're intact

wherever they are hold

somewhere that we can be sure of have we

met before

we're having a strangest feeling of deja vu

really okay do you know what i really

think but don't tell that guy he looks

like he's under enough stress

see i don't think this body's really a

body and think it's some kind of

transport you know for something else

altogether the question is what he's

contest in okay all right we are not

going to see the whole movie

um so basically i just basically want to

show you that clip

with the little person inside the head

of that emperor as an indication of say

perhaps that is where the self lies and

and

but the search for that cell for that

little person

has been going on in science for a long

for example

uh can somebody just turn this off for a second

neuroscientist and daniel wagner and in

his recent book he talked about

the illusion of conscious will

and if conscious will can be used as a

way of finding out that that is the

so-called self that

makes decisions for us etc

that it in fact doesn't really exist

that the experience of feeling that

there is

that we have made certain decisions for

example is only a by-product of some other

other

events that takes place

let me just basically read you a little bit

bit

it says that

the experience of consciously willing an

action and the causation of the action

by the person's conscious mind are two

separate things

that the feeling as though we are

causing the things we do

is really caused by psychological and

narrow mechanisms

so in other words

you may think that you have caused

something but in fact it is just that

another part of your brain that is doing

it so that in other words

the search for the self it doesn't you know

know

until now it's not uh it doesn't lead us

to anywhere so

where are we now well

okay um

there are two

basically there are two principles

in uh buddhism

now first of all i i wanna i wanna take

a step back and say that

this is really a discussion about

like ajuna's

middle view of buddhism and don't take

it as a lecture

so in the sense that

if i have missed some

important points or

misinterpreted something feel free to

add your

comments and then we can discuss more

from there

but i want to start by saying that there

are two principles

one is the practitioner

and basically you know so is so

essential to buddhism that

is really the first thing that we should

think about about buddhism

when other people asked buddha

what is his teaching all about

and he said that

that's that's what he's teaching

about so what is it well it's basically

it's something

like causality

the essence of it is that

when something happens

another thing will happen

when something stops another thing will

stop so in other words

in this world between things between

ideas between

images between events

that there is a relationship

and if something happened that's why

another thing happened and this is a

very important kind of

concept because

this is the concept that tells that says

that you cannot just have something you

cannot have essence for example

something that just exists without any

other reason

you know that it exists by itself it's

created by itself it's produced by

itself it's permanent etc etc because

with that it's contradictory to this

concept because if this one says that

everything is here for a reason

that's a very good point uh

the idea of the beginning and the end

comes from

time a certain concept of time

and um

for example something that happened before

before

if we say that there is a certain time

there's something called in front and behind

behind

right so let's say that the future is in

front and

and the past is behind and

and

what we are doing now is the present i'm

speaking at the present

and so um

before would be say when we are trying

to put you know put together this

you know this uh discussion

uh and after will be uh in the future we

are going to try to clean up and

and

because of that because of the presence

some people say

then we have past and future or

the you know and we as we try to find

the beginning well the buddha is saying

that you will never find the beginning because

because uh

the concept of time itself is uh

illusory and he is saying that

the idea of the present

for example when you talk about where's

the beginning where is the n where is

the middle

when you can talk about the middle only

if you know the beginning and the end

then in the middle of the whole

beginning and the end that is what the

middle is but if you don't even know

where the beginning is or the n is then

how can you find out where the middle is

it's too

okay thank you um

okay

the other concept that is really

important is uh

the self

being illusory now

now

the idea of self is usually we you know

we say that what is the self the self is basically

basically

well as we generally know is a

combination of say the mind and the body

and um so

and what is the mind the mind is you

know in in buddhist in in buddhism

really you know we talk about the five

uh elements or the five aggregates or

the five receptacles in other words

these are the things that

that

um uh that uh make up our or

all of our beings and what are they it's

the feeling

right it's our thoughts our memories etc

it's our behavior it's our consciousness

um it's all of this plus the body

that make up the

the self

self now

um let me try to say this so

what is this self really

the self is sort of like this

and so like

if i

put out my hand

and i say that well

each of the fingers represents one of

their aggregates

one of the dimensions

that makes up our being and

and

so they are all separate

but if we say that let us let the fist

represent the self

so what is this fist

this fist is made up by

the different elements

when you put the other elements together

that's what we call the self now

now

this is an interesting demonstration

really about

the elusiveness of the idea of self

why is it elusive because if i just let

go of my fingers the fist disappears

and so the idea of the self

if i say fist you think self that's that

will work

right and the sound will disappear when

you when you don't when

yeah when you let go like that and so

because because uh the the fist that's

you know

that that's why the fist is not permanent

permanent

it's not it doesn't have an essence

and so the self that we talked about also

also

uh has no essence that it really depends

on many many other causes causative factors

factors

all right

we'll get back to this

um now what i'm going to be talking about

about

will be based on uh

a few books that uh

sure did you make these transparencies yourself

yourself

yes i did

thank you

you are talking about uh writing i guess

uh well they are not that good but they

are okay

okay

now um

the few books that i i have uh uh

reference

there are three by reverend yin shun and

and

if you

you know i'm just translated this into

english yes i don't think that they

exist in english but if you can read

chinese i do encourage you to read

especially this one

because this one basically uh

reverend yinshan spent a whole year i

know ex well

well

let me step back

what i'm going to be talking about

this all right [Music]

[Music]

this is

70 stanzas based on nagarjuna's

nagarjuna's

and

reverend yin shan

will grow all of this around the 40s he

wrote this in

1944 i think and this in 1940

uh 43 and this and

1947 i think it's it's all around 1940s

and there's another book by

kashi wong

and that is written very recently it's

just written in 2002

which is based on the the

the

talk that reverend yin shan has done

about more than 50 years ago in in hong kong

kong

he spent about a month talking about

about the

i hope i pronounce it correctly i'm

going to call it the moolah from now on

so he uh so very mentioned talked about

this for about a whole month and then uh

50 some years later

mr wong uh you know talked about it for

about a year in in hong kong and at the

end of that he produced a book and

that's what the book is and uh i

strongly encourage you to take a look at

this book because this is uh simpler than

than

than some of this uh easier to

get into uh

uh okay

just step back a little bit and say well

this that i have handed out to you

is uh

the english is translated by professor

jay garfield

and in the book called uh

i headed down somewhere okay

okay

this is based on the work that is done

in tibet

now buddha existed about 2500 years ago

700 years later came nagarjuna who

who

lived in the present-day xinjiang

xinjiang

and he

uh i know excuse me uh another junior is

from india

did he travel to china no he has never

traveled to china he has basically

traveled between in india between the

north and the south

yeah and

and nagarjuna basically means the dragon

and the tree

and it has

some sort of story behind it basically

he uh

he was born under a tree and then he he

got some of the sutras by the dragons

and so he called himself

you know the the dragon tree or naga the

dragon juna is tree i hope right

and that is written in sanskrit

kumaraja a really actually

naga is actually cobra

cobra ah very interesting right exactly

which is close enough

right right it's a different

interpretation of what dragon means yeah

it's interesting right

kumaranja is a very important person in

to chinese buddhism because he's the one

who introduced a lot of

the buddhist scriptures to

uh to china for example the heart sutra

the most

sutra well then i should say that the

diamond sutra

you know one of the most uh important

important

sutra is translated by kumaraja and he

is from he was from jam

jam

you know and he learned about

about this and he's the one who

translated sanskrit

into chinese

and brought it to china

and that is how the

get to be known in

in china

that's about 300 years after nagarjuna

then buddhism was introduced to tibet

that's around 800 year 800

and so uh

nagarjuna's moonlight was also

introduced to tibet

what you see what you have in front of

you the english is

a translation by professor jay garfield

from tibetan

to english

and he did it two years two three years ago

ago

somewhere in the midwest

and he spent a lot of time in tibet and

also in india in uh

salah and you know and so he he really

did a lot of research to to to

to to get this so

the what i have here is is

the english version

and the chinese version which separates by

a few hundred years

all right

get back to some of this later because

uh there is a passage that

there is some discrepancy in terms of uh the

the

uh uh translation and

and

so we'll talk a little bit more about that

that

the most important message of the mullah

is contained in the first stanza

of the 446 as well as the 70s stanza

that reverend hinchen selected and

arranged he uh you know he didn't just

pick the 70 he picked them up and then

shuffle them around and then and he

thought that look this is good enough

for an introduction

and so that's how he did it

and the most important thing is the

eight i call it no notes

uh i think that uh

god view translated

somewhat differently but basically you

know i translated basically you know

from chinese into english you know as

simple as i can get no birth and no death

death

no permanence and no annihilation no

unity and no separateness no coming and

no no going

this eight no nose basically is

a reflection of four pairs

of opposites extreme opposites about

about existence

existence

or non-existence about

this

when something exists for example

and uh

in time this deals with existence this

still this deals with

time this deals with space and this

deals with movement

and so nagajuna

nagajuna

take it to represent basically everything

everything

when you have existence

in time it becomes permanent

and if it is

if that existence becomes non-existent

and in time then it becomes annihilation

the unity and the separateness deals with

with

the different parts that makes up the whole

whole

for example brooklyn

brooklyn

bronx manhattan

queens staten island

they are separate but together they make

up one municipality

the idea of new york city

or if you want to use a a as kind of

like a human example is you know the the the

the

you know the body itself the face the

nose the the eyes the ears etc you know

they make up the person

the same thing

and when the thing that exists

changes through time and space

that is what we get in terms of movement

coming and going now

now

now the junior is saying that

and this is quite a

a shocking

shocking

kind of

comment it seems because

for for example

birth and death

is such an inherent concept in hindi

hindi

that you have all these

births and deaths

things are happening and then they die

you you meet a friend you just started

something and then you started arguments

and then you hated each other etc all of

these things that the cycles are endless

cycles of uh you know a lot of birth and

death of relationships and other things

you know

it's the understanding of the life and

the death

that we see impermanence in

in things

things

and it's because of this impermanence that

that we

dislike and find uncomfortable that we

try to withdraw from

further births and deaths

and that it's from it's it's the

suffering that we want to avoid that get

us to a point where we will feel uh

salvaged or

live in nirvana

and so

for the hinayana it's very

but i have to say this we'll get back to

this but this

this

is what makes perhaps what makes nagajuna

nagajuna

recognized as the founder of mahayana and

and

because he's recognized as the founder

in many many different sects you know of

but

reverend yinshan who did

a lot of research

find that

all of this contained

contained

in the agama sutra

the first sutra that was put together

about a year after the buddha has

passed away

and in it

there are comments about no permanence

no at night

different comments but they're scattered

all over the agama sutra

it is nagarjuna who put it all together

in such a way that it becomes existence

time space and movement yes

yes

you said it was a year after

buda passed away right if there's no birthday

birthday okay

okay that's a

i don't know if i want to deal with it

right now in the sense that uh uh

uh the

the

you are you're talking about whether or

not a person can for example get born

and a person will die now

now

there is

you know it would be wrong to say that a

person does not get born and that person

does not die because that's contrary to

what we see and what we deal with every day

day

but it's the concept of birth and the

concept of death that

that

that is you know we we need to spend

some time on

and uh because

because because

because

i have my own answer to his question go

ahead i've always wondered whether it's

right or wrong and

you may have really disagreed

like for example let's suppose that you

turn on the television

and just now you saw these two men right

in black so then

then

somebody turned off the tv

right and we could say of those two men

where did they go

right but the point is that the men in a

certain way never existed all you had

was some dots on the television lighting

up and turning off and we created those

men there by the way we looked at it

and they never were there so there was

nowhere for them to go

that's a very interesting uh idea and i

think that that in some sense explains

uh a little bit maybe uh uh your

question but of course you're you're not

gonna be satisfied with that answer

because you're gonna say that i'm not

that person i i live i breathe

and i know i got problems and

and

and so uh how can you say that it

doesn't exist that it's just a figment

of somebody's imagination um

this is a different question but there's

no coming in no going have you tried to

the xenos paradox right okay

at every moment of time the arrow is

where it is

aha it's slightly different it's

slightly different from that

it's um

it's trying to say that the

the

idea of the concept of coming and going

is also

causative it's relative

and but

let me

you know and see if we can

give you

some uh clarification

clarification uh

uh before

before we

up just asking sure nagajuna

right right

nagarjuna rejected that

and that caused a lot of problem

it caused a lot of problems especially among

among

hinayanas because they say that

it's the birth and death and the

impermanence and all of that that

get us suffering and that's why we have

to get out of that cycle and now you say

that there's no birth and death so

you're saying that everything is empty

you know everything is you know we'll

get back we'll get

to that a little bit more but yeah he

you know the whole mula is talking about

that the second one for example the

second the third stanza from the third

stanza to the to the uh

uh eighth stanza

uh the argument that says that how can

it be

uh nothing how can it you know if it is

nothing then where are we and what are

the the sins that we have committed and

and then if we have no sense no

then uh where do we get a monk to absorb

is uh

a very important stanza

next to the eight no no's this is one of

the most important stanza

about mula

because this really tells us what moolah

whatever is dependently called horizon um

um that

that

deals with the practitioners and with pada

pada

codependently or dependently co horizon

that's that's what it means

it's exp that is explained to be emptiness

emptiness

whatever that is codependent that is

dependently co horizon it is empty now

what does that mean it means that

because it derives its being from

something else

when that condition change

then your being will change and

therefore that being is not very solid

your fame is dependent on

the recognition of certain achievement

that you have done

if something happens to that achievement

if something happens to the recognition process

process then

then

you know it will

happen to your you know it will do

something to your fame and it will do

and so what is it that we are seeing though

though

we have this self here

and uh you know you can't just say that

i don't exist you can't just say that

i'm that little per that person in that

in in the tv that you just turn off

because i know i'm not

i'm here talking to you right and you

are there listening

and so

what is that what is this right here and

and then

they say this is a temporary construction

i think that god view translated it as

designated something about dependent designation

designation

it's okay but i i prefer temporary

construction here

for this moment

he's saying that this is just a

temporary construction that

that changes

changes but

but

it may change but it's there

and so

we have something called

the principle of emptiness

and then

because you know things are not

solid they are not permanent they are not

not

you know

they don't exist forever

and this

temporary construction that we call it uh

i don't know how to translate that but

uh the idea of say

phenol phenomenon phenomenology perhaps

that it exists as a phenomenon

if we understand emptiness

emptiness

then we will not fall into the

nothingness trap nor

take on something as if it is totally real

real permanent

permanent

if we are able to stay away from that

from this

and from

that then

we will have

arrived at the middle way of looking at things

do i make myself

let me use the fist and the fingers as

the fact that we have a fist

is because okay

okay

it's because the fingers got drawn together

so this is a very important concept

and

this is what the

hinayanas truly believed in and this is

also what

the buddha said you know what are you

talking about

that's what i'm talking about so this is

really very very fundamental

and what about emptiness well

the thing is that

this fist

is not

really that fixed

because if i go like this the fist disappears

disappears

and so

the idea of that fist the concept of

that fist

the fist itself

is empty

it means that it has no essence

it's not something that is permanent

that is solid that you can you know uh

store aware something like that so

this is a fist

because if i put this fist to your nose

your nose will bleed so

there is something there

and so we call it a temporary construction

construction

yeah it's there

and if we understand the relationship

between the fingers

and the fist

and for that matter

the five aggregates and the idea of the self

self

then we have

that's the middle way that's the way of

looking at things

so we don't look at it like they're all empty

empty

oh there's nothing there

i might as well kill myself because it

doesn't make any difference

or that i'm so important i'm so real i

would do anything to keep alive i won't

do anything to you know

get what i want etc so you are able to

stay away from both of them

and then you are you have reached

the middle way of looking at things and

i just want to add one more thing here

and that is this

this

this is

stanza number 14 and now in the handout

if you look at the chinese

it says slightly differently

the chinese says that

is that that is explained to be emptiness

emptiness

it's it's in some sense perhaps some

sort of a cop-out because

in chinese it reads

i say therefore it is emptiness

so the question is who is this i

and a lot of people i think

in the west take it to mean nagajuna

but in fact

reverend uh yinshan

yinshan

indicated that the i

is really referred to the buddha

that this came from other passages

within the agama sutra

that this in fact is what the buddha said

said

and that

sure

since there are so many different

translations from chinese

from sanskrit from india and so forth

do they get involved

somehow are interpreted differently for

example just pointed out the chinese

there's a reference of i which is

supposed to do so

how accurate are the translations okay

well um you know the chinese translation

that you see here

here

really goes all the way back to uh

kumaraja's translation

and the same thing i assume is true for

the tibetan uh translation of uh

sanskrit you know into tibetan so

the question may arise that i have is

well is it the tibetan translation or is

it jay garfield's translation that

somehow you know didn't touch upon you

know say the eye aspect

aspect and

and

i don't know but

but

people pay of course a lot of uh uh

attention to the

the

word by word kind of uh

lineage so that

we don't lose it after so many years

because uh

now the thing is that

what you what you mentioned did not

appear in the you know

it's not just a chinese translation it

comes it comes from well

it comes from the agama sutra

so it's really something that's way back

you know when buddha died

a year later they have this conference

and uh they have uh

you know the conference of all the monks

who put his uh words together that's the

agama sutra it's from there that

you know

we find that that uh

mentioning of the eye

all right

so it's uh that is a translation from

there um of course you know at the time

of the buddha it's not just sanskrit

that there are many other kind of

languages in india as well so exactly

you know for example there's pali and

etc and there's a lot of questions about

exactly what kind of language was he speaking

speaking

you know the buddha

and trying to say perhaps get some more

originality that way you know but i

think that uh uh

it's getting more and more kind of

difficult and maybe a sign point is this

is that for example the

uh hinayanas especially the you know in

the translation the pali translation of

the agama sutra they kept it pretty much

intact throughout all this all this time

but uh

reverend yinshan

uh point out that

that may not the poly that they use may

not be the poly

that was used at that time

and that in fact the poly that they used

might have been translated from for example

example

sanskrit into pali et cetera and

and

this really gets very far a few there's

a real study about for example the idea

the concept of emptiness

inagama sutra came in pretty late

and so

if i can step back and i'll say this the

the

that immediately after

uh the buddha passed away

uh buddhism breaks into two basically

different sex and

the idea of emptiness

is not

you know

contained in some of the trans agamas

translated or kept by the hinayanas

and so

and so for buddhism there's a there's a

development process involved

i don't know if i answer your question

but the question about the

second stanza and the last lines yeah it says

says

it will refute the notion that their

existence is permanent right now the

thing is that in our ordinary

understanding also we we know the things

the things that the existence of things right

right

we know that everyone will die

i think

that the buddha is saying something more

right and what is that more i thought

that what is more was perhaps to say

that it's not really the existence it's

not permanent but that it's not independent

independent

exactly but independent

means that it has an essence it means

that it exists by itself without you

without him without her it exists by

itself it comes from it's a given and he said

said

there's no such thing

not even buddha is not is is un given

so he's saying that you know this is

what buddha said in the agama sutra in uh

when katyayana asked him

he has what is the

you know what is the proper view

of uh you know uh

of buddhism how do you look at things basically

basically

i'm paraphrasing quite a bit uh

and he's saying look

if you understand how

things are formed then

then

you won't think that it doesn't exist

if you know how the fist is fall

then you cannot say that the fist is

nothing it's you know non-existent

because you know that the fist

is formed by this

and if you

can see how the if you can really see

how the fist disappears

disappears

you will not say that the fist

is permanent

right so

in other words he's trying to clarify about

about

he says basically he says he said

something before this and what he said

was he said generally people fell into

two camps either you think something is nihilistic

nihilistic

doesn't exist nothing exists or you

think that they are all real or

permanent or independent as you say

and he said that it's both ways are

wrong and both are of the same essence

what is that is that there is something

that exists

because when that thing does not exist

then you know you talk about the nothingness

nothingness

and so he said this is not a good way of

looking at it this is not the truth the

truth is that it is

everything comes about with

certain process

with a reason you know you put your

fingers together that becomes a fist

the fist is not permanent but

but

that's a very good point

well i don't know

what do you think

i mean

the body for example

i wish it was

is the feeling permanent

is the suffering permanent here i would

like to quote uh

something that wangashi said in his uh

you know and that's why i find it easier

to read you know wangashi i mentioned

you know the gentleman who

wrote this book two years ago

the example is going to work

in a rainy day the

subway is crowded

he's late

and uh his

the clothes the wet clothes are sticking

to his to his body

okay and he's feeling miserable

he comes in

suddenly the boss

pat him on his shoulder and said you did

a great job on that deal

all of a sudden all the mystery disappeared

disappeared

and he felt fantastic

so the five elements

the feeling

all of that is that real

it's not

it's not because it changes

and why does it change it changed

because the conditions have changed

whereas before

you were

feeling miserable because you're late

you have this and that and the weather

and everything but all of a sudden you

know you you get a pat on the on the

shoulder so

because of those changes your feelings

change and so your feeling is not

let us move on [Music]

this is basically

what we talked about you know that the

people tend to go into either

nothingness or

that there is something that is essence

and it's through uh practice i'm a pada okay

okay

uh that uh you know you understand the

different sequence the different courses

the process et cetera you know through

that you understand the truth but this

what the hinayanas

uh uh you know really stressed on is the

same as emptiness

in fact this is uh talked about that in

the agama sutra because why because

because of this

that's why things are impermanent the

feeling is impermanent for example right

and so

because it's imper impermanent when you

get a pet on the shoulder the next

instant you could get a kick in the butt

and so you may feel really horrible and so

that because of that you're feeling

you know it's really

it's emptiness

it mean does not means it doesn't exist

or it doesn't count but it means that it

has no essence you really don't

bet on it

and what about this well this test says

that well what about that apparent thing

thing

you have that apparent euphoria that you

had when he patted you on the shoulder

that is real wasn't it well we call it a

temporary construction

and so basically

basically

this is a repeat of what of saying that

the middle way the mula

look at it this way

you don't step into the nothingness or

the essence aspect and you try to look

at things as perhaps

i don't know if it's right to say it's transformation

maybe touch um

if there's time

in terms of that like pat on the back or

being kicked in life like in general why

why

do we or why do i

i always want to get the pet on the back

i don't want to be kicked like i don't want to feel bad and is there some like

want to feel bad and is there some like how does that relate to

how does that relate to is that attachment like

is that attachment like absolutely absolutely and and and it's

absolutely absolutely and and and it's because of that because you know the pat

because of that because you know the pat on the shoulder

on the shoulder makes you happy

makes you happy so you crave for it

so you crave for it and when you crave for it

and when you crave for it you set yourself up for problems

you set yourself up for problems that's what basically what it is

that's what basically what it is okay we'll go to that

okay we'll go to that in more detail in this

in more detail in this just a little while

so emptiness is not

emptiness is not nothingness

nothingness and so the

and so the the stances that you have in front of me

the stances that you have in front of me from uh

from uh 9 to 13 for example is what

9 to 13 for example is what nagarjuna is saying that look

nagarjuna is saying that look you take emptiness to mean nothingness

you take emptiness to mean nothingness and that's why everything doesn't exist

and that's why everything doesn't exist that's why

that's why you

you you know condemn

you know condemn the concept or the idea of not emptiness

if everything has essence if everything is

everything has essence if everything is independent

independent you got a big problem

you got a big problem why

why he said well let's say that

he said well let's say that people

people wants to become buddha well buddhism

wants to become buddha well buddhism that's why buddhism is so

that's why buddhism is so you know

you know such equality because they're saying

such equality because they're saying that everybody can become a buddha

but if the concept of buddha is

if the concept of buddha is independent

independent it exists by itself

it exists by itself it's unchangeable

it's unchangeable then nobody can become a buddha

and if the ordinary people have that ordinariness

have that ordinariness in them

in them then how can you change that

then how can you change that ordinaryness

ordinaryness that independent

that independent idea into something that it's not

idea into something that it's not so

so essence means that it's unchangeable you

essence means that it's unchangeable you can't change it

can't change it and if it cannot be changed then nobody

and if it cannot be changed then nobody will become a buddha

and you can use that to mean other things as well that everything will stay

things as well that everything will stay as as they are if you're happy

as as they are if you're happy for whatever reason then you'll stay

for whatever reason then you'll stay happy nothing will disturb you

happy nothing will disturb you and if you're sad you know

and if you're sad you know if it is permanent then

if it is permanent then nothing can turn that around

nothing can turn that around and

and in other words

in other words nagarjuna is saying that the whole world

nagarjuna is saying that the whole world cannot be built

cannot be built upon the notion of essence it can only

upon the notion of essence it can only be built on the notion of emptiness that

be built on the notion of emptiness that they are able to change

they are able to change in the change they are empty but because

in the change they are empty but because of the change you have that temporary

of the change you have that temporary construction

construction and through that

and through that that's how the entire world is built

so everything is

everything is empty

empty so the troubles that we have

so the troubles that we have are empty

are empty the things that we do the karma they are

the things that we do the karma they are empty

empty the suffering therefore is also empty

the suffering therefore is also empty and the self

and the self again is empty

this is the point that was raised by the lady over here and i'll try to you know

lady over here and i'll try to you know comment on it

this is what garfield translated is that desire hatred and confusion

is that desire hatred and confusion all arise from thought it is said

all arise from thought it is said they all depend on the pleasant

they all depend on the pleasant the unpleasant and errors

the unpleasant and errors you mentioned about you like to you know

you mentioned about you like to you know people like to be to have a pat on the

people like to be to have a pat on the shoulder

shoulder and not a kick in the butt

and not a kick in the butt and uh

and uh and so

and so he said

he said well

well first of all

first of all let us take a look at the english

let us take a look at the english translation and the chinese translation

translation and the chinese translation of that

of that and

and in a chinese translation

in a chinese translation there is

there is some slight differences

some slight differences this means

this means memory so it's not just thought but also

memory so it's not just thought but also you know memory

you know memory things that happened in the past that

things that happened in the past that stay inside let's say

this desire

desire hatred and confusion

hatred and confusion they all are born from

they all are born from memories

memories thoughts

thoughts but there's a very important point that

but there's a very important point that is missing over there

is missing over there and it's this

and it's this the differentiation

the differentiation is from our differentiation

is from our differentiation that

that desire hatred and confusion came about

why because it comes into the pleasant

it comes into the pleasant the unpleasant

the unpleasant the errors or confusion they all come

the errors or confusion they all come from

from different

different causative

causative conditions

so a kick and a butt and a pen on the

a kick and a butt and a pen on the shoulder

shoulder we consider one to be pleasant and the

we consider one to be pleasant and the other to be unpleasant

so it's because of different reasons it's

it's because of different reasons it's this

this it's this the cr the craving of this

it's this the cr the craving of this the hatred of this of the unpleasant

the hatred of this of the unpleasant you know that drives us

you know that drives us into

into all kinds of problems

all right because

if we are able to not differentiate

we are able to not differentiate okay first let me say this

okay first let me say this things in the world we differentiate

things in the world we differentiate them a kick in the butt is

them a kick in the butt is unpleasant

unpleasant a pat on the shoulder is pleasant

a pat on the shoulder is pleasant and so you desire the pet on the

and so you desire the pet on the shoulder and you hate the kick in the

shoulder and you hate the kick in the butt

butt all right and let's forget about

all right and let's forget about confusion for a while all right

confusion for a while all right so

so because of the desire for this and the

because of the desire for this and the hatred for that it will lead to

hatred for that it will lead to actions

actions that either

that either try to get more of the pleasantness and

try to get more of the pleasantness and try to avoid the unpleasantness

try to avoid the unpleasantness and those actions

and those actions basically will lead us to suffering

basically will lead us to suffering i mean there's a whole process about

i mean there's a whole process about this

this and

and you know the the the 12

you know the the the 12 different steps of uh you know from

different steps of uh you know from ignorance uh to

ignorance uh to action and then you know and how it

action and then you know and how it leads to suffering etc it's all because

leads to suffering etc it's all because we grasp on that those things

we grasp on that those things why do we grasp those things because

why do we grasp those things because that feeling that euphoria is so great

that feeling that euphoria is so great i want it and so i would do anything for

i want it and so i would do anything for it

it and because of that

and because of that you will end up suffering

you will end up suffering so even the good things

so even the good things will

will give you

give you problem

problem later on

if we do not differentiate them you see this comes

differentiate them you see this comes from differentiation that's why i say

from differentiation that's why i say it's so important that that term and

it's so important that that term and it's not there i look at that i look at

it's not there i look at that i look at his commentaries

his commentaries and i don't seem to find

and i don't seem to find maybe i'm wrong but i

maybe i'm wrong but i it's apparently not there that the

it's apparently not there that the differentiation into something

differentiation into something you know

you know into the opposites

into the opposites that is what drives all the problem

that is what drives all the problem and remember we talked about the eight

and remember we talked about the eight no notes

no notes the eight normals are four pairs of

the eight normals are four pairs of opposites

opposites so if you don't differentiate them if

so if you don't differentiate them if you don't differentiate the pleasant and

you don't differentiate the pleasant and unpleasant

unpleasant then the things in the world you don't

then the things in the world you don't desire you don't hate you don't you know

desire you don't hate you don't you know you're not confused about it and

you're not confused about it and therefore you get away from the

therefore you get away from the suffering

okay you get joy joy

to yeah well to to um to uh

yeah well to to um to uh to the buddhists

to the buddhists joy

joy is something

is something that you have to be a little bit more

that you have to be a little bit more clear about

clear about the joy that many

the joy that many buddhists you know pursue

buddhists you know pursue is that liberation

is that liberation that calmness that total peace

that calmness that total peace the

the equality and that

equality and that essence of say

to many buddhists that

many buddhists that is a real joy

is a real joy that you are not you don't suffer

that you are not you don't suffer anymore

anymore all that confusion that goes around you

all that confusion that goes around you you know you look at it it's there but

you know you look at it it's there but you're not in love

you're not in love and then to the buddhist is joy

and then to the buddhist is joy if you talk about joy as say

if you talk about joy as say you went you're going to atlantic city

you went you're going to atlantic city and you hit the jackpot

and you hit the jackpot well there's certainly joy

well there's certainly joy but

but that joy can turn into

that joy can turn into sadness very easily you know if you

sadness very easily you know if you if somebody with a gun you know robs you

if somebody with a gun you know robs you right outside of the casino

right outside of the casino you may feel really horrible much worse

you may feel really horrible much worse than you if you didn't win at all

than you if you didn't win at all right

so that is a problem over there

so this

this to be able to see no difference

is a buddhist way of looking at things this is therefore the practitioner

this is therefore the practitioner you know how things get to where they

you know how things get to where they are

are the the suffering how it gets how it

the the suffering how it gets how it comes about

comes about so this is basically how the buddhists

so this is basically how the buddhists would look at it

would look at it so what about some of the non-buddhists

so what about some of the non-buddhists or at least some of the

or at least some of the non-madhya marcus let's say

the martial marquis this is stanza 44 they will say some say suffering is

they will say some say suffering is self-produced now this is a good this is

self-produced now this is a good this is a common way that nagarjuna use in his

a common way that nagarjuna use in his arguments this is perhaps what they call

arguments this is perhaps what they call the tetralemma methodology you set up

the tetralemma methodology you set up four different possibilities and show

four different possibilities and show that none of it works and therefore it

that none of it works and therefore it doesn't

doesn't you know it doesn't work so

you know it doesn't work so some say suffering is self-produced

some say suffering is self-produced or produced from another or from both

or produced from another or from both or that it arises without a cause

or that it arises without a cause it is not the kind of thing to be

it is not the kind of thing to be produced

this is trying to look at it from graphically

graphically suffering

suffering it comes from

it comes from with causes or without costs

with causes or without costs without cause

without cause means what

means what it means that it happens just have

it means that it happens just have fascinally you have absolutely no reason

fascinally you have absolutely no reason no control

no control what that means is it's totally against

what that means is it's totally against causality it's totally against all kinds

causality it's totally against all kinds of reason

of reason and

and it is

it is all kind there's no relationship that

all kind there's no relationship that exists

exists between

between things uh

things uh the very common sense that we have

the very common sense that we have uh you know doesn't exist no morality

uh you know doesn't exist no morality nothing

nothing and therefore it is not possible so we

and therefore it is not possible so we reject the no cause that has just

reject the no cause that has just happened you know

happened you know and

and if it has caused

if it has caused then nagarjuna said well it's caused by

then nagarjuna said well it's caused by the self

the self you suffer because you did wrong

you suffer because you did wrong you sin let's say

you sin let's say sin is terrible

sin is terrible well you did something let's say

well you did something let's say uh

uh or maybe

or maybe you suffer because

another person or another aggregates

aggregates did it to you

did it to you or it could be god for example

or it could be god for example you did something you know and you this

you did something you know and you this god who

god who uh you know dish out the punishment

uh you know dish out the punishment or maybe it is something both

or maybe it is something both you did something wrong and therefore

you did something wrong and therefore god punished you for that and so both of

god punished you for that and so both of them did you in

them did you in right

right so

so um

um he is saying that uh

here i would like to just uh read to you a little bit about

read to you a little bit about what i have

what i have collected

all right um

okay i'm gonna read to you what i what i

i'm gonna read to you what i what i wrote down i think it's perhaps a little

wrote down i think it's perhaps a little bit simpler

bit simpler can suffering be produced with the cause

can suffering be produced with the cause by the self or others or by them both

by the self or others or by them both when they're suffering

when they're suffering they're

they're ah okay

ah okay um

um wait a second let me uh

wait a second let me uh let me go back

this way by showing that it cannot be produced by

by showing that it cannot be produced by the self

the self by showing that it cannot be produced by

by showing that it cannot be produced by another

another by showing that it cannot be produced by

by showing that it cannot be produced by both

both then we would assume that

then we would assume that it has been proven that it's not

it has been proven that it's not produced by any

produced by any all right

all right in this way and remember that this is a

in this way and remember that this is a non-buddhist thinking not

non-buddhist thinking not along the lines of practitioner

so what

what can we do

can we do well

okay if

if you if you suffer

if you suffer there has to be somebody who suffers

suffering is a result of certain action karma the action

karma the action is intimately related to somebody who

is intimately related to somebody who acts as an actor

acts as an actor now

this is where the

the analysis goal

analysis goal the suffering

by the sufferer

sufferer can we say that it is this guy that did

can we say that it is this guy that did that make make him suffer

that make make him suffer now suffering is because of something

now suffering is because of something that has done before

the thing that the thing the

the thing the aggregate that does the act before

aggregate that does the act before is

is the aggregate of the past

the aggregate of the past this is the aggregate of the present

this is the aggregate of the present and therefore

and therefore you have two

you have two different aggregates before and after

different aggregates before and after they are not the same

they are not the same and so to say that

and so to say that suffering is caused by the same

suffering is caused by the same person

person it doesn't make sense

it doesn't make sense why because they're different

why because they're different one is now one is before you can say

one is now one is before you can say this is the aggregate of the passages

this is the aggregate of the passages aggregate of the present this is done by

aggregate of the present this is done by the aggregate of the past so therefore

the aggregate of the past so therefore it's not the same

i'm not miss disputing this i'm just trying to clarify more because of course

trying to clarify more because of course in some context it can happen like a 60

in some context it can happen like a 60 year old man has lung cancer and the

year old man has lung cancer and the reason he has lung cancer is because

reason he has lung cancer is because some 20 year old man was unchanging now

some 20 year old man was unchanging now they are not the same person but we

they are not the same person but we don't have any problems seeing how the

don't have any problems seeing how the smoking by one aggregate the 20 year old

smoking by one aggregate the 20 year old man led cancer to another aggregate the

man led cancer to another aggregate the 60 year old

60 year old so suffering must be of some other

so suffering must be of some other nature with cancer so that we have to be

nature with cancer so that we have to be puzzled okay

puzzled okay okay okay

okay okay okay i i accept that

okay i i accept that but

but i i would say that uh let's say

i i would say that uh let's say let's say how about if we

let's say how about if we look at your example and say the 20 year

look at your example and say the 20 year old man

old man who get a great kick out of smoking

who get a great kick out of smoking because he's the maverick man

because he's the maverick man right

right and

and versus

versus the 60 year old

the 60 year old who is coughing and going is about to

who is coughing and going is about to die and can't breathe and can't speak

die and can't breathe and can't speak now he really feels horrible

now he really feels horrible now that horrible feeling

to say that that horrible feeling is done by

is done by this person

this person by the 20 year old guy

by the 20 year old guy then

then the 20 year old guy

the 20 year old guy his

his his

his feeling now

feeling now then and his feeling now are entirely

then and his feeling now are entirely different his body is entirely different

different his body is entirely different he stopped

he stopped i mean

i mean this guy may be already in the suit

this guy may be already in the suit against the tobacco company

against the tobacco company but it's too late to the 20 year old

but it's too late to the 20 year old bank

bank no sue the company that sells the

no sue the company that sells the cigarette to the 20 year old man yes

cigarette to the 20 year old man yes right

right and so

and so so when they are different and their

so when they are different and their eggs are different

eggs are different this

this really thinks that

really thinks that you know there's the memorial

you know there's the memorial country and this is joining the the the

country and this is joining the the the the the the picket lines against the

the the the picket lines against the tobacco company right and how can you

tobacco company right and how can you say that it is this person that

say that it is this person that caused him to suffer it's this

caused him to suffer it's this and therefore they're different so you

and therefore they're different so you cannot say that they are the same

but at the same time this person the 20 year old man

this person the 20 year old man and the 60 year old man

and the 60 year old man the 60 year old

the 60 year old pop up

pop up from nothing

from nothing there's a gradual

there's a gradual change

change through the

through the you know times and places etc that you

you know times and places etc that you have

have that this 20 year old man became the 60

that this 20 year old man became the 60 year old man

year old man and maybe

and maybe through many things that he his

through many things that he his of course the smoking

of course the smoking change his body

change his body right

right but the feelings may have changed

but the feelings may have changed tremendously

tremendously the thoughts have changed tremendously a

the thoughts have changed tremendously a 40 or 60 year old man perhaps have

40 or 60 year old man perhaps have learned so much more

learned so much more about the world that

about the world that is living

is living so different from the 20 year old man

so different from the 20 year old man and so they behave differently it's a

and so they behave differently it's a in any sense it's a different person

and their consciousness of course is also different

of course is also different but

but can we say that therefore

can we say that therefore this is a different person and therefore

this is a different person and therefore we can say that the suffering is caused

we can say that the suffering is caused by another a different person

if we can say that then suffering can be caused by others

but nagarjuna is saying and also really nagarjuna is really reflecting what

nagarjuna is really reflecting what buddha is saying you know it would be

buddha is saying you know it would be totally wrong to imagine that buddha

totally wrong to imagine that buddha didn't say this and it is like a junior

didn't say this and it is like a junior who said it

then as i said before there's a gradual transition between this to that it's

transition between this to that it's just like this

just like this if this is the

if this is the sufferer

sufferer it took a long time for the fist to form

and so because of that relationship

because of that relationship because any time if you don't have that

because any time if you don't have that you don't have this

you don't have this so they're intimately related

so they're intimately related and therefore you cannot say that this

and therefore you cannot say that this is a different

is a different person

person and so

and so if you cannot

if you cannot say that suffering is caused by

say that suffering is caused by self

self and you cannot say that suffering is

and you cannot say that suffering is caused by

caused by another

then the two of them

the two of them you know won't make it either and so

you know won't make it either and so in that way

in that way nagarjuna

nagarjuna put away

put away this kind of explanation and it goes

this kind of explanation and it goes back to the previous explanation which

back to the previous explanation which is what

is what which is

which is the differentiation comes to you know

the differentiation comes to you know the all the craving the hatred etc and

the all the craving the hatred etc and then leading to to to uh uh

then leading to to to uh uh uh uh suffering and if you're able to

uh uh suffering and if you're able to transcend all of that that there's no

transcend all of that that there's no differentiation then you don't get that

differentiation then you don't get that at all

at all so basically he's trying to drive to

so basically he's trying to drive to that conclusion

okay now

now i want to uh i hope

i want to uh i hope well

well as you know i said that i

as you know i said that i i want to show you another clip

i'm not gonna do what uh schwarzenegger is gonna do

schwarzenegger is gonna do all right

the 80 monos talked about

talked about no birth no death no permanence and no

no birth no death no permanence and no at night not hilation no unity no

at night not hilation no unity no suffering there's no coming and no going

suffering there's no coming and no going when you see this

when you see this and then you

and then you see this

you see the disappearance the death of this image

disappearance the death of this image and you see the birth

and you see the birth the appearance of this image

for the same thing you know you can talk about the that

you know you can talk about the that let me just focus on this and then we

let me just focus on this and then we call it you know

call it you know so in other words

so in other words the

the birth

birth of this

of this and the death of this

and the death of this in the blink of and your eye

what not arjuna what the buddha is saying is that it really does not exist

that there is a relationship between the two

two and if you understand that relationship

and if you understand that relationship of how this comes into this

of how this comes into this then you would understand that there is

then you would understand that there is no

no death of this

death of this and there is no birth of this

am i getting my point across in the sense that about

my point across in the sense that about the birth and the death

because to to i would imagine to somebody who say that

somebody who say that from here

from here without understanding the dish to

without understanding the dish to suddenly go to another when you open

suddenly go to another when you open your eyes becomes this

your eyes becomes this that's how we look at things

we don't see this it is this

it is this that is

and it will stay with that the emptiness at the the nothingness aspect you know

at the the nothingness aspect you know then we get into all kinds of problems

then we get into all kinds of problems and basically that's what moolah is

and basically that's what moolah is trying to

trying to say

say so another

so another another important point

another important point especially uh

especially uh uh uh pointed out by uh reverend yinshan

uh uh pointed out by uh reverend yinshan is this yes

the african-american was looking at the whole thing happening

was looking at the whole thing happening he was the one who came upon the arm

he was the one who came upon the arm he could never account for how dawn came

he could never account for how dawn came out and actually came back from the

out and actually came back from the future

future so i mean it's kind of

so i mean it's kind of twisting the whole

twisting the whole very outcome science fiction okay so i

very outcome science fiction okay so i think that

i took that purely because

took that purely because i i i

i i i well actually

well actually i was going to read the whole thing

i was going to read the whole thing i i wrote out this because i was afraid

i i wrote out this because i was afraid that i may say something that i don't

that i may say something that i don't mean to but when i tried out on my wife

mean to but when i tried out on my wife she fell asleep

she fell asleep before i got to the second page

before i got to the second page so i said well that's not gonna work so

so i said well that's not gonna work so she fell asleep she fell asleep and

she fell asleep she fell asleep and so so i said well i got to do try to do

so so i said well i got to do try to do something else

something else and perhaps not refer to what i've

and perhaps not refer to what i've written and just to talk about it and i

written and just to talk about it and i think that it helps a little bit better

think that it helps a little bit better but if i really read it you would have

but if i really read it you would have fallen asleep i can guarantee you that

fallen asleep i can guarantee you that uh so this is what uh reverend yin shan

uh so this is what uh reverend yin shan is saying

is saying and he said that look

and he said that look all of what is this what is that it's

all of what is this what is that it's just temporary construction

just temporary construction and

and they are impermanent

they are impermanent but continuous

but continuous this is a very important point

this is a very important point that uh

this is impermanent this is impermanent but they are linked together they are

but they are linked together they are continuous

continuous and that is how

and that is how the world is

perhaps i should end it there

there and uh

and uh we can talk more if we want to but

so if you have any questions you know i'll

if you have any questions you know i'll be happy to try to answer them

be happy to try to answer them yeah

yeah all the way through to say to me that

what you are explaining that the focus is on oneself

that the focus is on oneself to the exclusion of other people for

to the exclusion of other people for example when he says

example when he says no suffering no joy

no suffering no joy differentiated

by differentiating clearly seems to be suffering for example kids

suffering for example kids in chicago

in chicago or in iraq or in new york city

or in iraq or in new york city it seems to me it's very self-esteem

it seems to me it's very self-esteem except how i want to get i want to

except how i want to get i want to achieve this

okay well i think that i think that i think that you raise a very important

think that you raise a very important point especially you know about say the

point especially you know about say the difference perhaps you see i

difference perhaps you see i a lot of the times the mahayanas write

a lot of the times the mahayanas write books and i read the a lot of the books

books and i read the a lot of the books written by the mahayanas and they always

written by the mahayanas and they always talk about how the hindu young is always

talk about how the hindu young is always that you know like this or that or that

that you know like this or that or that sometimes i think that you got to be

sometimes i think that you got to be careful about what you read but

careful about what you read but this is what they say

this is what they say that

that the hinayanas

the hinayanas are more focused on the achievement of

are more focused on the achievement of nirvana

nirvana and therefore the foregoing of all of

and therefore the foregoing of all of these problems of all of this and

these problems of all of this and therefore

therefore say

say self-wise that you can get that sense of

self-wise that you can get that sense of liberation

liberation whereas

whereas the mahayanas

the mahayanas while they can attain the same

while they can attain the same state of say

state of say consciousness

consciousness they

they somewhat different

somewhat different i look at it this way

i look at it this way and that is the hinayanas

and that is the hinayanas basically took the teachings of the

basically took the teachings of the buddha literally to heart

buddha literally to heart and practiced what he thought

and practiced what he thought and so that's how you get yourself

and so that's how you get yourself liberation yourself salvation

liberation yourself salvation you know away from all these problems

you know away from all these problems all this suffering etc that's exactly

all this suffering etc that's exactly what can happen and it works

what can happen and it works but

but the mahayanas would rather

the mahayanas would rather learn from the teacher

learn from the teacher buddha

buddha they said that look

they said that look if this guy

if this guy can do this

can do this why don't i learn to be this guy rather

why don't i learn to be this guy rather than just what he taught me to do in

than just what he taught me to do in other words why can i

other words why can i become just like him

become just like him and in other words to

and in other words to help other people to realize that

help other people to realize that liberation

liberation and so

and so it would be wrong to say for example the

it would be wrong to say for example the buddhists

buddhists you know look at

you know look at things

things and not reach out to

and not reach out to write the wrong uh you know save the

write the wrong uh you know save the helpless you know that sort of thing

but it would also be wrong i think i am sure it would be wrong i'm sure that the

sure it would be wrong i'm sure that the hinayanas

hinayanas are very much into helping other people

are very much into helping other people etc in fact it has been a common

etc in fact it has been a common knowledge among chinese intellectuals

knowledge among chinese intellectuals especially the intellectuals for say

especially the intellectuals for say about at the turn of the century

about at the turn of the century they say that the chinese

they say that the chinese they

they talk

talk mahayana but they practice hinayana

mahayana but they practice hinayana whereas

whereas the hinayanas

the hinayanas practice you know they talk hinayana but

practice you know they talk hinayana but they practice mahayana so in other words

they practice mahayana so in other words it's it's really not what you just say

it's it's really not what you just say but what you do

but what you do isn't it

isn't it and so

i think that's why they call it sound surrounding everyone

surrounding everyone so for example

not just for the individual so there's one school that says i want to make the

one school that says i want to make the acceptance of myself

yeah but that's the problem the four-year-old child does not see what

four-year-old child does not see what you see and uh you know and and so uh

you see and uh you know and and so uh hopefully that you know one gets older

hopefully that you know one gets older one sees a little bit better

one sees a little bit better the differentiation aspect sounds

the differentiation aspect sounds you know kind of obtuse how can you not

you know kind of obtuse how can you not differentiate

differentiate say

say happiness from sadness

happiness from sadness you know and

you know and it's not just that it's because of the

it's not just that it's because of the differentiation

differentiation so something is worthwhile for you to go

so something is worthwhile for you to go after something you have to go run away

after something you have to go run away from

from is saying that well if you see all these

is saying that well if you see all these things why they become pleasant why they

things why they become pleasant why they become unpleasant

become unpleasant and then you won't

and then you won't go after them like that and imagining

go after them like that and imagining that you are that those things are so

that you are that those things are so solid

solid let's take your example about say africa

let's take your example about say africa and so

and so the idea of say

the idea of say for me going to africa and save the

for me going to africa and save the african children starving that's such a

african children starving that's such a noble goal

noble goal and therefore it becomes something that

and therefore it becomes something that is

is extremely desirable on my part

extremely desirable on my part if i do it

if i do it if i take it to too literally

if i take it to too literally that it becomes something that is so

that it becomes something that is so uh entrenched

uh entrenched the very act of my going there to save

the very act of my going there to save them

them may in fact

may in fact you know not only hurt them but hurt

you know not only hurt them but hurt myself as well

myself as well i don't know if i you know

i don't know if i you know you know make my point but but the thing

you know make my point but but the thing is is that

is is that something that it i do want to make this

something that it i do want to make this point

point and that is the

and that is the confucianist especially

confucianist especially mentions

mentions talks about for example he talks about

talks about for example he talks about in chinese

select the good things

things and then stick to it

and then stick to it okay

okay now this can be really problematic if

now this can be really problematic if you know when you try to uphold the

you know when you try to uphold the confusion morale

confusion morale moral code

moral code the women for example the children for

the women for example the children for example suffer tremendously

example suffer tremendously for some sort of moralistic and you know

for some sort of moralistic and you know an encroachment and therefore the

an encroachment and therefore the holding on to that abstract principle of

holding on to that abstract principle of goodness

goodness in fact

in fact causes tremendous problems and

causes tremendous problems and and therefore what are we saying we are

and therefore what are we saying we are saying that

saying that it would be good if we can recognize how

it would be good if we can recognize how everything comes about

everything comes about how everything is interrelated and

how everything is interrelated and therefore see

therefore see the truth in them rather than this is

the truth in them rather than this is good because

good because confucius says so

confucius says so times change things change everything

times change things change everything change and therefore there may be

change and therefore there may be behavior may change and if you stick to

behavior may change and if you stick to that well

that well you cause

you cause suffering to yourself and to many other

suffering to yourself and to many other people

right and that's that's what i wondered recognitions

i agree with you i really do i just want to point out one more thing though

to point out one more thing though and this is

and this is kind of like personal experience

helping other people is a good thing

is a good thing and um

and um but if you hold on to it

but if you hold on to it as if it is something that is solid real

as if it is something that is solid real you may really suffer

you may really suffer and

and and i don't think

and i don't think that is a good thing and i don't think

that is a good thing and i don't think it's worth it for me i would feel that

it's worth it for me i would feel that it's not that i would

it's not that i would turn my eye and not look at the

turn my eye and not look at the suffering of many people around but

suffering of many people around but i would say that look it's important for

i would say that look it's important for me to see things as they are

me to see things as they are why am i doing this why you know why

why am i doing this why you know why i go you know and therefore

i go you know and therefore do whatever i can to change the

do whatever i can to change the situation

situation and in the process

and in the process that i myself need to stay calm need to

that i myself need to stay calm need to stay

stay unattached because if i attach so much

unattached because if i attach so much to it look

to it look i want to be the

i want to be the leader

leader because i think i'm doing a good job i'm

because i think i'm doing a good job i'm doing the right thing that is the most

doing the right thing that is the most wonderful thing etc etc other people may

wonderful thing etc etc other people may not think so and then there may be

not think so and then there may be competition and therefore

competition and therefore then you may get into actions and karma

then you may get into actions and karma bad karma

bad karma then what good is it

then what good is it so

so it's that

it's that the recognition of that

the recognition of that that is important

that is important once you recognize that look

once you recognize that look all of this is okay all of this is a

all of this is okay all of this is a temporary construction let's say

temporary construction let's say doesn't mean that i don't do it because

doesn't mean that i don't do it because it's empty

it's empty but i'll do it

but i'll do it without really thinking that

without really thinking that being the leader is such a big deal

being the leader is such a big deal right

right and in that sense being a do-gooder

and in that sense being a do-gooder is such a big deal

whether it's children or whatever does not mean that you shouldn't do it

not mean that you shouldn't do it it just means that when you do it let's

it just means that when you do it let's say that you are doing it and somebody

say that you are doing it and somebody else is also doing it both of you are

else is also doing it both of you are going for the same grant

going for the same grant and then what happened well

and then what happened well the buddhists would say look okay you

the buddhists would say look okay you know whatever happens happens i guess

know whatever happens happens i guess you know uh

you know uh but you're not so attached to it and

but you're not so attached to it and therefore you don't suffer

therefore you don't suffer as much

as much okay

okay yeah

i guess a question you were saying that um

guess a question you were saying that um i think

i think when you can discover for yourself the

when you can discover for yourself the relationship between the the birth and

relationship between the the birth and death like you can get an understanding

death like you can get an understanding of that

of that maybe that

maybe in that space that's where there's i don't know some kind of understanding

i don't know some kind of understanding to find more peace um

to find more peace um could you i wanted to just ask if you

could you i wanted to just ask if you could elaborate a little bit on

could elaborate a little bit on like how do you

like how do you find that

find that that what encompasses birth and death

that what encompasses birth and death and um

and um i also wanted to say that

i also wanted to say that i teach music for kids and

i teach music for kids and in my observation of them teaching music

in my observation of them teaching music for like two and three-year-olds

for like two and three-year-olds i mean to me they seem much more in the

i mean to me they seem much more in the present than i am as a as an adult i

present than i am as a as an adult i don't

don't they cry and they laugh but they forget

they cry and they laugh but they forget about it five minutes later so i i think

about it five minutes later so i i think they're closer to like i want to be

they're closer to like i want to be where they are

where they are i think that they understand but they

i think that they understand but they don't need to verbalize it

don't need to verbalize it [Music]

[Music] okay

okay um

um can you

can you so help

so help but it's a good question

but it's a good question i

i i'm not convinced that they understand

i'm not convinced that they understand more i think that they i think you're

more i think that they i think you're right that they have something that you

right that they have something that you know

know but i'm not convinced that they

but i'm not convinced that they understand

because there is something that's uh now i'm you

there is something that's uh now i'm you see i'm mixing up different varieties of

see i'm mixing up different varieties of but it is safe you see that the

but it is safe you see that the human birth is the best birth

human birth is the best birth because you're not too comfortable

because you're not too comfortable like in other words you're not so

like in other words you're not so uncomfortable

uncomfortable that you can't be enlightened

that you can't be enlightened but you're not so comfortable that you

but you're not so comfortable that you don't want to put in the effort right

don't want to put in the effort right and i think that being a comfortable

and i think that being a comfortable two-year-old or being an uncomfortable

two-year-old or being an uncomfortable that's too much that there isn't the

that's too much that there isn't the there isn't going to be the progress

there isn't going to be the progress maybe let me try to add a little bit

maybe let me try to add a little bit it seems that you are

it seems that you are you know

you know idealizing you know idolizing the you

idealizing you know idolizing the you know childhood the innocence and you

know childhood the innocence and you know

know pure happiness etc

pure happiness etc but

but to the child

to the child when the child cry is really pretty sad

when the child cry is really pretty sad i mean you know it's just that after you

i mean you know it's just that after you cry then you forget about it but isn't

cry then you forget about it but isn't that what we do all the time

that what we do all the time i mean you know the way that we

i mean you know the way that we sometimes get into relationships with

sometimes get into relationships with people the way we do things over and

people the way we do things over and over in the same way sometimes you know

over in the same way sometimes you know that get us into the same square one you

that get us into the same square one you know and so

know and so and so

and so to be able to

to be able to be like a child

be like a child means that

means that you know i like that innocence aspect

you know i like that innocence aspect right and then i like that chance of say

right and then i like that chance of say starting all over again and i like the

starting all over again and i like the chance of seeing as a little bit more of

chance of seeing as a little bit more of that simplicity

that simplicity but

but that endless cycle of

that endless cycle of birth and death this endless cycle of

birth and death this endless cycle of say you know something happening and a

say you know something happening and a relationship an event happened and then

relationship an event happened and then it dies you know my best friend you know

it dies you know my best friend you know becomes my best friend and then the best

becomes my best friend and then the best friend move away

friend move away you know that sort of thing

you know that sort of thing so

so the recognition of that

the recognition of that helps us to see ourselves better i think

helps us to see ourselves better i think and i think that a child probably have a

and i think that a child probably have a little bit more difficulty in terms of

little bit more difficulty in terms of see or say recognizing that that it is

see or say recognizing that that it is because of you who wants that who want

because of you who wants that who want to grasp your friend who you know you

to grasp your friend who you know you don't want your friend to leave the

don't want your friend to leave the neighborhood and now she is going to be

neighborhood and now she is going to be away how sad you know

away how sad you know it really is that right so

it really is that right so so uh

so uh i think that

i think that buddhism you know for me at least is

buddhism you know for me at least is there is the learning of that uh

you know seeing things happen like that and seeing that

things happen like that and seeing that this is the self uh you know uh that

this is the self uh you know uh that wants something

wants something next time i would really like to talk a

next time i would really like to talk a little bit about

little bit about uh the meme you know using the meme

uh the meme you know using the meme machine

machine you know the genes etc to explain uh a

you know the genes etc to explain uh a buddhist idea because they really did a

buddhist idea because they really did a fantastic job uh you know in terms of

fantastic job uh you know in terms of say science so scientifically explain

say science so scientifically explain how things are the whole construct of

how things are the whole construct of the self

the self you know is something you know from

you know is something you know from something called a meme you know

something called a meme you know the meme is basically you know what uh

the meme is basically you know what uh you know this guy dawkins uh uh uh

you know this guy dawkins uh uh uh talked about uh yeah coming from

very very interesting uh and because from that it talks about the self the

from that it talks about the self the construct of the self how the self is

construct of the self how the self is constructed this is one meme at a piece

constructed this is one meme at a piece at a time and then that puts together

at a time and then that puts together that person and that person is really

that person and that person is really just a construct

just a construct so it's really not that far away from

so it's really not that far away from you know the the matrix in that set

you know the the matrix in that set but that's another story i have to read

but that's another story i have to read more though

but that is not considered being selfish whereas buddhism is just not reasonable

whereas buddhism is just not reasonable i think there's some similarity that the

i think there's some similarity that the first beginning point is regal itself

first beginning point is regal itself whether there is

whether there is emptiness besides that you know it's a

emptiness besides that you know it's a beginning process for arrivals and

beginning process for arrivals and that's

that's [Music]

that's being selfish and i find that kind of contradictory

and i find that kind of contradictory because buddhism is trying to say that

because buddhism is trying to say that we have to find the cause of ignorance

we have to find the cause of ignorance and from that cause the suffering will

and from that cause the suffering will believe here

believe here for all not just for an individual

for all not just for an individual and because it's an asian

and because it's an asian concept i think therefore it's kind of

concept i think therefore it's kind of taken into one contract i think that's

taken into one contract i think that's just the story

just the story focusing on yourself is not necessarily

focusing on yourself is not necessarily selfish

well sometimes sometimes you know i think that a lot of this talks about how

think that a lot of this talks about how the cell it actually interferes with the

the cell it actually interferes with the functioning of this

functioning of this body the functioning of this aggregate

body the functioning of this aggregate yeah this is interesting because this

yeah this is interesting because this guy from chicago would talk about flow

guy from chicago would talk about flow how people got into the flow i mean the

how people got into the flow i mean the flow is really what a lot of people talk

flow is really what a lot of people talk about these days it's exciting behind

about these days it's exciting behind right exactly uh uh and he says that

right exactly uh uh and he says that for people who are in the flow

for people who are in the flow means that they are totally

means that they are totally oblivious of themselves

oblivious of themselves they really check themselves at the door

they really check themselves at the door when they are in competitions in the

when they are in competitions in the olympics and whatever because the self

olympics and whatever because the self is so

is so demanding that you have to satisfy that

demanding that you have to satisfy that self that if we are able to

self that if we are able to put the self aside and really just

put the self aside and really just interact with whatever that happens

interact with whatever that happens to us

to us then

then um

um that is what the flow is and that is

that is what the flow is and that is what

what uh optimal way of

uh optimal way of living is i imagine

living is i imagine that you check at the door of the eagle

that you check at the door of the eagle i would say yeah i won't mind calling it

i would say yeah i won't mind calling it ego

ego yeah i want mine but don't take my word

yeah i want mine but don't take my word for it i mean i'm just you know using

for it i mean i'm just you know using ego to

ego to mean self sometimes yeah yeah but for

mean self sometimes yeah yeah but for somebody to be able to check their ego

somebody to be able to check their ego at the door it it will help them to see

at the door it it will help them to see things much clearer

things much clearer i imagine yeah

i imagine yeah i want to thank you very very much you

i want to thank you very very much you have been most exciting audience thank

have been most exciting audience thank you

Click on any text or timestamp to jump to that moment in the video

Most transcripts ready in under 5 seconds

One-Click Copy125+ LanguagesSearch ContentJump to Timestamps

Paste YouTube URL

Enter any YouTube video link to get the full transcript

Most transcripts ready in under 5 seconds

Get Our Chrome Extension

Get transcripts instantly without leaving YouTube. Install our Chrome extension for one-click access to any video's transcript directly on the watch page.

Add to Chrome — Free

Works with YouTube, Coursera, Udemy and more educational platforms

Get Instant Transcripts: Just Edit the Domain in Your Address Bar!

YouTube

←

→

↻

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF8uR6Z6KLc

YoutubeToText

←

→

↻

https://youtubetotext.net/watch?v=UF8uR6Z6KLc

YouTube Transcript:Introduction to Nagarjuna's Middle View on Buddhism

Video Transcript

Paste YouTube URL

Transcript Extraction Form

Get Our Chrome Extension

Get Instant Transcripts: Just Edit the Domain in Your Address Bar!

YouTube Transcript:
Introduction to Nagarjuna's Middle View on Buddhism