The conversation highlights the pervasive and often detrimental impact of technology, particularly social media and smartphones, on human well-being, relationships, and attention spans. It advocates for a more intentional and "human" approach to technology use to reclaim time, health, and genuine connection.
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Tik Tok Tourette's syndrome is a real
diagnosis. People are manifesting
Tourette's from Tik Tok. We're not
designed to be sedentary, screen
staring, meaning devoid creatures.
Abigail Shrier says that when we talk
about moderation in regards to
technology, it's like nurses going to
high schools telling students to
moderate ecstasy. It's the wrong conversation.
conversation.
>> Walk us through why that is, though.
>> You have to remember your algorithm is
dictating the perception of your
reality, which is not likely true.
>> Say that again. I think that's such a
good point.
>> I don't know what I just said. What are
the principles that people should know
to use this technology responsibly?
>> If you implement these 11 principles in
your life in 2026, will radically change
>> It's almost 2026 and I believe that it's
more important than ever for all of us
to get our houses in order for us to
figure out how are we being affected on
a daily basis by our habits, routines,
and the tools, devices, and technologies
that we use. Welcome back to the Lilaya
Rose Show. Today I'm sitting down with
Andrew Lawbacker. He is the executive
director of humanity, which is a new
organization focused on making humans be
more human and understanding the costs
and consequences of the technologies
that we are using while providing a
roadmap for how us to use them in a more
human way that helps our relationships
and our health. Please make sure to
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That's patreon.com/laose.
Thank you so much. Andrew Lawbacker,
welcome to the podcast.
>> It's great to be here.
>> Great to see. We have a lot of mutual friends.
friends.
>> A ton.
>> Including Emily and Daniel Husse. I want
to say Wilson. Obviously, it's >> Husam.
>> Husam. >> Mhm.
>> Mhm.
>> Yeah. I've known them for probably like
12 plus years.
>> That's awesome.
>> Godfather to Jedodiah.
>> I love that.
>> I met Emily at an event I think in El
Paso probably 2013. I was leading
worship. She was a speaker. >> Amazing.
>> Amazing.
>> And then yeah, Daniel moved here. We've
been friends.
>> But you still haven't gotten on the on
sacred spark yet? not gone sacred spark.
>> You will soon, guys.
>> We're in the discerning process if I'm
going to enter into that digital world.
But I love them. They're some of my best
friends on the planet.
>> Well, we were saying earlier that you
are the expert on the harm of the
digital world
>> and how to escape from the harm and
build outside of that world, have the
real life connections that God has
planned us for, designed us for. Um, but
you were saying earlier if there's an
app that's a dating app that is the most
human, that would be the Sacred Spark
app. So, anyways, I
>> I agree. It seems like they're creating
some modalities in there that can be
more human and not as swipy. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> And as transactional
and so, yeah, I think that what they're
doing is awesome. I enjoy meeting people
in the wild.
>> So, that's kind of been my my play so
far. Obviously, I'm still single, so it
hasn't really worked yet, but we're just
going to give it a little bit more time.
>> You're on the road a lot.
>> I'm on the road a lot. My life's been
really weird, which we can dive into at
a certain point, but um yeah, I've been
on the road a long time.
>> So, Humanity is the organization that
you're the executive director of. You've
been on this mission now for at least
since 2018,
>> but I think before that, you were being
prepared for the mission. >> Correct.
>> Correct.
>> And the mission is what? We are helping
people discover freedom through an
intentional relationship with
technology. We're helping people be
human and unpack a lot of the science of
how our technologies are impacting us
mentally, physically, spiritually and
use them as a tool. Thorough said that
we have become tools of our tools. So,
we're really trying to unpack how do we
live more human in a digital age and
it's I love what I'm doing. I love these
ideas and I'm seeing what we're doing
starting to work in people's lives and
it's really exciting.
Parents have said when they're surveyed
that one of their top, it's like a top
three. Sometimes it's a top top concern
about how to parent has to do with what
to do about technology, screens, social
media, the whole gamut of it. And a lot
of parents I think feel helpless against
this like overwhelming
uh movement of just this plastering of
the face to screens whether it's in the
classroom even getting iPads in the
classroom or it's you just walk down the
street and there's literally everywhere
you know you go to a restaurant it's
like there's screens everywhere there's
every kid has a screen. >> Um
>> Um
>> I want to go to your story because I
know that was really an onset for you
getting even interested in this. Mhm.
>> You haven't been on social media since when?
when? >> 2018.
>> 2018.
>> 2018. That's a long time for a younger
person. You're not a You're not an ex
Yeah. You're not even a You're a
millennial, right? Millennial. Yeah.
>> And now you're not the only millennial
who's gone totally scot-free, but that's
a long time. A lot of the times we take
breaks for like a month a year.
>> You're completely free of it. And now,
but you're also dedicated to helping
other people be free of it. Let's start
with your story. how why you went cold turkey.
turkey. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> On no social media in 2018.
>> Yes. So, I'm a millennial. I thought Are
we both millennials?
>> Of course,
>> we're both millennials. We look great. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> Um I think, you know, starting as early
as high school, I I think about these
things deeply and I do have time to
think about these things deeply. Uh you
know, I was on AOL instant messenger,
you know, in high school, right? And
that was like the first time where I
was, you know, you're starting to spit
game, you know, at least the guy in
eighth grade like, "Hey,
>> girl, you know, you want to meet up at
recess?" You know, it is like this first
like experience of like, you know,
family's here, but I'm in this digital
world starting to instant message people.
people.
>> What was your handle?
>> Oh, I It's so skater boy.
>> It's so bad. So, my nickname, well, my
my middle name is James.
>> So, it was AJ Weeman 11,
>> of course,
>> AOL.com. It's horrible. I can't believe
that's going to be in the interwebs now.
>> I was Alexia 8. >> Oh,
>> Oh,
>> cuz Alexa was my favorite Russian ice skater.
skater.
>> Wow. male Olympian ice skater and then
eight. I don't know why eight, but >> yeah.
>> yeah.
>> I'm not going to go into like the
psychological reasons for mine, but it
was like, you know, this weird I pretty
much left the faith in high school,
right? So, mind you, at that time, it
was like, yeah, I didn't want to be religious.
religious.
>> I wanted to fit in. I changed
everything, right? I changed the way I
dressed, changed the way I spoke. Uh,
and and at this point, you know, the
sidekick's coming out. You know, I got
the flip phone. You know, I'm like T9
texting. This is wild. You know, I got
my MySpace. And during that time, I
slowly left the faith. You know, I was
parting a lot, you know, and hiding it
from my family. Fast forward all this, I
graduate uh Ventura High School. I'm
just going to go I start playing music,
sorry, when I'm 12. So, I'm playing rock
and roll, reggae, rap, you know, this is
like Young Jeezy and T pay and Usher.
You know, they're getting big. >> Eminem.
>> I'm more the Eminem guy. Yeah. I played
basketball, which was like no one no one
told me, "Hey, this is probably a bad
sport for you to play. You're going to
be really short." you know, I'm as tall
as Leo Messi. I could be a professional
soccer player if I tried. Uh, but for
whatever reason, I played basketball my
whole life, right? And um, but that
crowd I was in was fully
rebelling, right? And no one really
believed in God. The people that did
were weird. I went to youth group cuz I
had to, and I just didn't connect with
really anyone in that realm. Now, mind
you, during that time, I'm also having
like pretty severe anxiety as a kid and
panic attacks and have no idea why. Kind
of runs on both sides of the family, but
I was really angry at God for that. It's
a very limiting, terrifying thing as a
young person to have these like panic
attacks, you know. So, I think I turned
to a lot of different things to help
um ease that pain in a certain sense.
And yeah, so there's a lot happening
there in high school, but I I graduate.
I'm just going to go to community
college and keep rock and roll,
partying. There's no God. Might as well
live it up. And I end up getting caught
by the cops and for drugs.
>> And I have to go to court. And obviously
family's incredibly disappointed. And
I'm depressed. I'm anxious. All those
friends that were my friends weren't
there for me anymore cuz I wasn't
partying anymore.
>> Can I ask really quick, was it marijuana
or another drug?
>> Uh, yes. And a little bit of some other
stuff. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
>> It's it's it's so um tragic cuz that's
now legal. >> Totally.
>> Totally.
>> So there's no
>> marijuana ruined my life.
>> There's no intervention
>> anymore. Now it's like you can smell
like literally you go outside and you
smell it on the streets.
>> Totally. And um yeah, so that time it
was very destructive in a lot of ways.
But uh so I went to court and then I got
invited to go to this Stubenville
conference. Stenville youth conference.
I've been to two before and you know
it's like I don't want to go to this
like Jesus thing where people are like
want to hug you and you know talk about
God and I kind of knew the spiel right
um but I was at such a low point uh and
my mother I think forced me to go wasn't
an option like you're going to go on
this retreat
>> you are a convict
>> shout out to the moms right shout out to
the moms um and yeah in adoration I mean
I went to confession it was Audrey Assad
Matt Marm I just had a life-changing
experience in worship and adoration. I I
experienced the weight of my sin and the
gospel just hit me. Every every
preacher, every everything of that
weekend just radically transformed my
life. So I went home just completely
different person. Threw away all the
drugs, you know, try to get rid of the
pornography. Uh started going to mass. I
was literally watching hours of Mother
Angelica every day as a 19-year-old man.
That's a little weird. Okay. I love you
EWTN. Oh my gosh, that makes me want to cry.
cry.
>> I was praying so beautiful. I was
praying with grandma's aftermass
rosaries. I was watching with Super
Saints, Beth and Penny Lord, like fell
in love with the truth. I found out that
you can go and study this thing called
theology, you know. So I was a music
major at Fentura College, Community
College, and then I went to Franciscan
and studied theology and philosophy. And
Franciscan changed my life even more.
There I encountered God, the Holy
Spirit. I started leading worship at
studentville conferences myself. And
then I just started getting calls to go
play places. This was nothing I looked
to do. This is nothing I looked to
build. I started playing at my church
for 30 kids at a Bible study and just
started leading worship. And I couldn't
sing. Like my mother literally would
tell me in I could literally picture her
in the kitchen being like, "Andrew, stop
singing. You sound horrible." You know,
and I was like, "Mom, you're supposed to
love me." You know, and uh God gave me a
voice. And I'm not like, you know, I'm
not some insane vocalist or anything,
but but God, you know, started to give
me a voice to sing. And so that led me
to starting to travel around the
country, just started getting calls, go
to lead worship, share my testimony. And
so, mind you, where technology ties in
all this is I'm on every platform at
this point. I'm on your Snapchat. I got
Snapchat in college cuz there's a cute
girl on Snapchat.
>> And I was like, wait, you can just watch
everything they do all day and see what
they're doing? This is incredible.
creepy when you think about me up. All
of social media is incredibly creepy
when you think about it. But
particularly for those who's like, "Oh,
there's a really cute girl. I can just
watch what she does all day. This is
amazing." That's why I went on Snapchat,
by the way.
>> Uh had Instagram, Facebook, Twitter at
the time. You know, this is when MySpace
is dying and everything. So, I'm on all
the platforms and now I'm starting to
travel and play music and I'm posting
all my life
and sharing all the crowds that I'm in
front of and posting everything, right?
I'm just starting to notice some of
these trade-offs, right? Which are very
subtle, but I start to experience them
more and more, which um you know,
Instagram really started to get, you
know, really, I don't know how else to
say it, but pornified pretty pretty
quickly. And then so my scroll would be
like Father Mike Schmidz and Bishop
Aaron and then like booty shorts, you
know, it was like this is not helpful
for me. like I'm entering into this
world that has so much good and then so
many um different images that are
affecting for me purity. And as a man
that's trying to live on my Catholic
faith, I'm trying to be pure, right? I'm
trying to be chased. I'm trying to
um prepare myself, you know, for
marriage and my vocation. And so I
noticed that a lot of these technologies
were once starting to lead me to lust on
a regular basis. All of them. pretty
much all of them. Uh now at this time,
you know, you graduated Franciscan
friends are starting to get married,
starting to post their engagements,
starting to post their families. You
know, I'm not I'm not finding that
person. Um you know, I'm not, you know,
getting that next thing, the next thing.
I noticed the social comparison thing
happening pretty regularly, right, for
me, too. It's like each scroll was like,
"Oh, look at what they're doing that I
don't have." That became very regular.
And then also I definitely noticed the
just wasted time. And then this one idea
I want to kind of drive home on the back
of our smartphones. If you're an Apple
user, you know is a halfeaten apple. You
know, you might be have heard this
before, but you know what was the lie in
the garden? It was, you know, the devil
tempted Adam and Eve. Hey, if you eat
the at the tree of knowledge, good and
evil, you become like God. So with the
smartphone, we are participating in an
attribute of God, namely his omniresence
that we were never designed to
participate in. >> Wow.
>> Wow. >> So
>> So
>> that's an interesting thought.
>> Now think about that and then think
about the two temptations to be omni
benevolent and then omnipotent. So with
the smartphone, we're present to all
things. And I remember feeling this like
cuz I remember started to see all of the
world's problems in the palm of my hand.
The earthquakes, the tsunamis, the
killings, the drama, the political. I
started to get so overwhelmed with
reality that I I remember kind of
starting to just get more numb, you
know, from people's pain. And now, mind
you, I'm trying to do ministry. I'm on
the road. I'm experiencing a plethora of
human experience all over the world that
I'm trying to like wrestle with and pray
with and minister to. And then, mind
you, I go back to my scroll and it's
just all the world's problems in the
palm of my hand.
>> So, I realized pretty early we were not
designed to participate in omnipresence.
And then temptation is now that we have
to solve the world's problems, be all
loving, and then actually we have the
power to do so. Omni potent. So those
weren't ideas that I was thinking of
then, but I look back and I'm like,
whoa, I was omnipresent. There's
multiple data points showing that
empathy has decreased 40% the last 30 years.
years.
>> Empathy has decreased how much?
>> 40% the last 30 years amongst college students.
students.
>> I noticed in my own life,
>> I see it, by the way.
>> Yep. Well, I noticed
>> they're laughing about Charlie Kirk's
murder as an example.
>> Go down the list, right? It's like the
things that I was starting to see in
this digital landscape, right? We have
to understand that what our biology is
experiencing, we've never experienced
before, right? It was like really
200,000 years ago is like language
starts to get introduced. You have a
whole trajectory of technologies, right,
that from the printing press, which took
about 500 years to really start to
impact culture. the digital landscape
that we're in now literally is like 15
20 years boom entering us putting us
into worlds we were never designed to be
in. Right? So, so I'd say it was a loss.
I'd say it was a social comparison. I'll
say it was a waste of time. The overload
of information I actually noticed I was
consuming so much information, even
really good information, I wasn't
retaining it. So, I got super deep in
the health and wellness space. I loved
healing. Okay. I got super fascinated
with like Jesus's healing ministry very
early on. That's why you Sean Tobin's a
good friend. Yeah.
>> Yes. I started praying for healing
pretty early on. We started to see
people getting healed of like real diseases.
diseases.
>> And then I noticed on the road traveling
too, we were starting to pray away
things that were largely due to our
lifestyles, diet, diet and exercise related
related
>> meaning like I'm obese. I need to be
thin. And like well you can pray for a
miracle or you can stop >> right
>> right
>> downing seven up or whatever it is. We
were going to all these events, a lot of
charismatic settings and praying for
people that you know had illnesses that
I believe were largely due to our
lifestyles and all the data I think now
is pointing to that right which is an
effect of technology which we'll get
into. So during that time I was
fascinated with all these topics and I'm
also like okay I want to be a saint and
I want to be holy and if I'm being
honest I think social media also is
making me really focused on myself. I
think the best way to be unhappy in life
is to focus on yourself. And I noticed
my posts every day was all me right. I
mean every post is me and it was always
my best day. It was not my lonely. I
mean, it's extremely lonely doing what
I've done, you know, in a lot of
different ways.
>> You mean the traveling music as a as a musician?
musician?
>> As a musician. I mean, you're playing in
front of hundreds of thousands of
people, but a lot of your time is is not
with people, you know, but my Instagram
looked incredible.
>> Are you were you with a band?
>> Yeah, I had a I've had a band.
>> Were you guys very tight or you went off
to your own separate ways?
>> Um, everyone lived everywhere. We were
kind of flying. You guys fly out. The
Catholic world is, you know,
>> but your daily routine is not like you
like like there used to be back in the
day your daily routine is like your
family, your your neighbor, the butcher,
you know, like whatever it was.
>> Today, we almost don't we don't even
know the names of our neighbors. We
don't see our families. They go to the
office. They go to the school. It's like
>> we're alone in the in the evenings of
parents are working, kids are by
themselves. So, there is this incredible
uh disintegration of human beings. I
want to get into that cuz that's all
techreated actually
>> and to be human is to be technological.
So what we're going to nuance here
throughout this whole conversation which
is why I wrestle with this stuff every
day is that there's infinite good that
can come out of technology and infinite
evil. So it's really hard for us to
nuance this while we were just talking
earlier like Facebook Marketplace
incredible tool helps people find all
these great things. That's my dining
room table. And I'm so proud of my
dining room table.
>> It's like this extremely unique thing
that was a few hundred, but it's
>> totally like I press a button and random
people come and pick me up and take me
places. It's called a lift and Uber.
Incredible technology.
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>> There's trade-offs, right? It's this and
that. This is Neil Postman's idea. He
said, "A new technology doesn't just
change this or that. It changes
everything." So we have to think about
in regards to media, in regards to the
technology of the fork and the knife and
the axe and the car and the light bulb,
all these technologies have impacts on
us, right? They're not just one thing.
It's both. And
>> so what I'm trying to kind of dissect is
the burdens and the blessings that are
being unveiled to us through these
different modalities. Right? So, back to
um at least my time on the road, I I I
definitely noticed me sharing my day
every day, sharing all my thoughts,
sharing all the crowds I I was in front
of. The question just kept coming up. Am
I trying to share my faith or am I just
trying to share me? Cuz I'm the brand
technically. And I just found that that
was making me really focused on myself.
And the more I started to study the
lives of the saints, I was like, Mother
Teresa hated getting pictures taken of
her, right? And um I really love the
Cartisian uh Carthusian the monks they
would you know with a spoon. This is a
little intense but I love this kind of
intense stuff. With a spoon they dig a
bit of their grave every day to remember
their mortality. And actually at the end
of their lives this is Nicholas Diott's
book A Time to Die. He goes through
this. Um they would burn all of their
pictures and writings. They wanted to be
solely known by the Lord instead of the
world. That's a little radical. I'm not
saying that we all need to do that. But
I noticed that my scrolling of myself
every day was making me very focused on
self. So here's a long story short.
There's a lot more there. But in 2018, I
was like, all this is leading me to be
unhappy ultimately and I'm a I'm trying
to be a student of Dr. Arthur Brooks.
He's he's a hero of mine, I'd say, in a
lot of ways.
>> He'll come on the show, I think, in two weeks.
weeks.
>> Yeah, he's
>> I just met him at Franciscan. His whole
talk he just gave at Franciscan was
essentially on humanity.
>> I love it. Tech detox.
>> You're like, you're my spokesman.
>> Yes. It was literally all on like the
meaning of this crisis is largely due to
our digital interactions.
>> They're just they're shallow, right?
It's not real.
>> Anyway, so I delayed everything in 2018.
>> And here's some of the fruits that
happened. I I went to a flip phone. So
this is this wasn't cool yet, right? The
digital minimalism movement hasn't
really started. I knew this was leading
me to sin in many different ways and I
wanted to be free and I definitely felt
the algorithms controlling me which I
didn't like. And so a couple things I
noticed really quickly after was
>> my friendships radically.
>> Before you tell me about the good fruit
of deleting social media and it wasn't
just to be clear, you didn't just delete
social media. You deleted a smartphone.
You deleted your your your supercomput
that was in your phone. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> So it wasn't just I mean Right. I mean so
so
>> um but I've got to ask you so 2018's an
early time to do that. Yeah. Too. I mean
I have one of my best friends also who's
been on the show a few times. Stephanie
Gay Connors now. She went social media
free cold turkey I think in maybe 2020
maybe and she was like again an early
adopter for this. Um and but she like
will ask me who has social media hey can
you share my book or share this or that.
So she understands still the use of the
thing right
>> you were in ministry you had a band that
I got that was your career that's how
you made money. How when you were like
just going cold turkey and deleting
everything. Did you think
>> I mean you could have you could have
done the CIA thing.
>> Seia the artist, the musician. She's
like never shows her face.
>> Oh, that's fun.
>> And then it's definitely not about her,
but she's still promoting her and her
music obviously. But how did you square that?
that?
>> Oh, this was Yeah, obviously I was a
single guy at the time uh and still am,
but at the time I realized I didn't have
a family that I was dependent. But I had
bills. So this is where people I I get
the argument. They're like, "Well, you
don't have a family and you don't have I
had plenty of bills. I had, you know,
college debt. I mean, I had things that
had to be paid, right?" So, I thought of
all those things for sure. Here's what's
crazy. What happened that year, I
deleted everything.
I went more places around the world. It
was the wildest year. Like, I got more
gigs. I had too many events. I went all
over Canada, South America, Europe, and
I think Jerusalem.
>> How did they know about you?
>> Word of mouth. And I say, "God." And I
was playing in front of big crowds in a
lot of places, right?
>> People heard you. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> Did that continue?
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah. So 2020 hit.
>> Oh. Well, then
>> I was in Jerusalem in March of 2020
leading worship. And mind you, that year
I just played my biggest show yet. It
was 10,000 people in DC. It was amazing.
And here's one thing that came up that really
really
um it I felt it deeply. I remember
playing the show. It's 10,000 people.
It's 2020. I remember people coming
like, "Dude, you made it, bro. This is
incredible." Blah, blah, blah. And this
thing like came up in me that was like,
"I wish I could post this so people
could see me,
that they can know that I'm doing this
thing, right?" And when I felt that, I
was like, "Oo,
you know, I didn't like that about about
that experience because it was like
here's this thing I'm doing and I deeply
want to be seen, known, and loved like
all of us. And this is what and I
thought about a couple ladies, you know,
that I'd like to see me playing in front
of all these people, you know what I
mean?" And uh and it really it was a
kind of a turning moment where I was
like, well, I'm definitely
noticing that me sharing me all the time
is a is is
affecting my perception of reality and
of myself and who I am and who I'm
called to be. I was looking for
affirmation. I love the like button like
we all do. I was getting just as much
dopamine as everybody else. I'd look at
all my comments. I'd look at who liked
it, who didn't, how many likes I got.
Um, I was addicted to all these things.
You know, we'll get into all the
mechanisms at play that are doing that
to us. But that really was a kind of
turning point where I'm like, I don't I
don't think I'm ever going to go back to
these platforms in this capacity. Right?
So that was 2020. I'm in Jerusalem 2020.
March I'm playing in in the holiest
places in the world, right? And CO's
hitting that's early on, right? So I'm
at that point where I'm flying back.
Literally CO's hitting our hotel in
Jerusalem and I'm like, "Oh, we're all
going to die."
>> At this time, I'm living
>> and no social media to talk about.
>> Right. Right.
>> Anonymous death like the Carians.
>> And I went to I flew back home here cuz
I'm like, if we're all going to die, I
want to be surfing at least, you know,
while this is happening.
>> You're not allowed to surf during co.
>> I know. I got we got in trouble. But
anyway, I went back to surf and be with
my family.
>> The ocean might give you CO.
>> That's right. Cuz there's CO on the
ocean. Yeah. Um I came right
>> Yeah. I came to very different
conclusions with that whole experience
which we don't have to talk about here
but I'm home and um the funny thing is
during that time I'm like everything
turned to Zoom all my events were on
Zoom and I literally started this it was
like a a live I just used the live
Instagram thing where I like interviewed
friends or whatever and I
>> So you did go on Instagram.
>> Yeah. So, I like literally went back.
I'm like, "Okay, I'm going to do this
for two months during quarantine." And
when quarantine's done, I'm just going
to get off this, but I'm going to have
these like interviews. And we just
talked about scripture each day. And it
was kind of cool. Even at that moment,
when I had that again, I found myself
scrolling again. I found myself
comparing again. I found myself seeing
things online that were not helping my
purity. It's like this all the same
things came back. And mind you, prior to
2018, I tried to be moderate like
multiple times. I did the month fast.
the 3 months. Okay, I'm just going to go
in here. I can never find that
moderation. Abigail Shrier says that
when we talk about moderation in regards
to technology with teenagers, at least
it's like nurses going to high schools
telling students to moderate ecstasy,
>> it's the wrong conversation, right?
>> Walk us through why that is though.
Like, and folks listening, you know,
most people by now have heard a study or
maybe they're familiar with Jonathan
Height, the ancient Generation, his
amazing New York Times bestselling book.
Um, I know there's an article that you
sent us about his the devil's plan to
ruin the next generation, which we're
going to talk about, but give us what
are would you say the most compelling
data points that every person you think
should know about the
negative consequences
of social media use. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> In terms of its drug-like
>> capacity to addict us and to short
circuit our brains and
>> harm us ultimately.
>> And this is great. This can take us down
like a very deep long rabbit hole. So if
you need to bring me back to what we
were unpacking prior, let me know.
>> Let's start walking into the rabbit hole
at least a little bit.
>> I love this. You're very good at this. >> Okay.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. So this is a really good quote
that I think you have to start with
first. Okay. Actually, there's a few
things to walk into this. Okay. So we
have to think about this precautionary
principle that has not been applied to
these technologies. Right? Again, think
of technology as a light bulb, the car,
the train. media has its own
technologies, the printing press, um,
you know, computers, etc. So, and Neil
Postman, you know, said this as well, is
that, you know, to begin a critique of
technology, one must first acknowledge
its its success.
>> So, I have to, as a critic of a lot of
these media platforms and technologies,
I have to acknowledge technology has
given us incredible amazing goods. This
is the best time to be alive, full stop,
for many reasons. Now in Anna Lumpky's
book uh Dr. John Finukuain she quotes
he's a John's Hopkins professor he says
quote we are cacti in a rainforest
simply meaning that because of the
abundance the technologies have created
there's been incredible trade-offs that
have happened because of this right so
this precautionary principle looks at
different technologies and actually says
okay what's the possible trade-offs of
some of these things no one gave us any
informed consent when we were given a
smartphone that hey this could actually
really affect your attention. This could
actually really affect your mental
health. This is going to have a library
of pornography that's incredibly
addictive more than methamphetamine. Uh
this is going to largely create a lot of
issues with your sleep
>> and uh you know a whole plethora of
other stuff
>> and it'll distract you from your real
world relationships. It's a physical
time commitment that you're not
realizing fully you're signing up for
that when you're on now, you know, with
your friends, with your kids, with your
spouse, with your parents, right?
>> This is going to be popping up to
command your attention.
>> So, no one entered into these
technologies with any precautionary
principle. What's the possible trait? We
just went into this. I got my
smartphone. I don't even remember the
day I got it, to be honest. It was a
part of my life. There's literally a
clinical diagnosis now called nomophobia,
nomophobia,
which is a phobia of being separated
from your device, which I think we all
experienced to some capacity, but young
people are literally having full-on
panic attacks if they have any time of
separation from their device. So, it's
literally becoming a part of us, right,
to a certain degree.
>> Well, mine's right here. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Full disclosure, guys.
>> You're right. And
>> my baby right here on I have it in part
because I like reference it for
interviews, but I mean, I guess
sometimes it's in my bag, but >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Really fun.
>> It's true. It's with me a lot. Like most
of my phone,
>> but but it's also because the tools are
so mixed together, right?
>> Where's your phone, by the way?
>> Uh it's over there. My I have a light phone.
phone.
>> It's a It's a flip phone or no?
>> Uh it's called the light phone. It's a
dumb phone. I'll show it to you. I like it.
it.
>> We should actually look at it during the interview.
interview.
>> Yeah, it' be great. Sandy, if you want
to go get it,
>> but you were in the rabbit hole. I want
to keep going.
>> Yeah, I'm going to keep going. I'm going
to keep venturing through this
intellectual realm.
>> Uh so this precautionary principle we
have to understand, no one told us what
was going to happen to us. We really
think as a as a species that convenience
is the best thing in all situations, all
times. My argument actually, and this is
in a lot of uh the comfort crisis with
Michael Easter, his book, uh comfort's
killing us in a lot of different ways.
And the convenience of a lot of these
communication platforms and a lot of
these social media platforms are
creating a lot of problems, right? So
convenience, we have to think, is always
not a good it's not always a good thing.
Think of McDonald's, right? Incredibly
convenient. If you eat McDonald's every
day, you are going to get incredibly
sick. So, right now, your average screen
time for young people is about 8 hours
and 39 minutes a day
>> for young people. What's that age group?
>> Uh, so that's high school and and young adults.
adults.
>> High schoolers are spending an average
of eight hours a day on screen.
>> 8 hours and 39 minutes a day.
>> But what about school?
>> Is that is some of that question? So,
there's a big transition now of
obviously schools getting out of uh or
phones getting out of school in the
daytime, but this is literally after
school still racking up eight hours.
>> Okay. low income.
>> I mean, I believe you, but like so
there's 24 hours in a day. Let's just
say you're sleeping 8 hours, which I
know a lot of high school kids aren't.
That's part of the problem. They're on
their devices till like 1:00 a.m.
>> But so if they're in school for what, 8 hours?
hours? >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> I was homeschooled. So, how long did you
go to school? You went to real school.
>> I went to real school.
>> Was it 8 hours a day?
>> I guess. Yeah.
>> 8 hours. Then I guess Yeah. There's
another 8 hours
>> that you could be on that phone. Yeah.
>> If you're sleeping 8 hours, you're on
your phone 8 hours, and then you are in
school for 8 hours. It's in it's insane.
I mean, I was I was on a retreat once
and talking to, you know, kids and I was
like, "Raise your hand if you feel like
you don't hear God." You know, some kids
raised their hand and I was like,
"What's your screen time?"
>> One kid's screen time was 14 hours a
day. This is actually pretty common. Um,
actually, so here,
>> sorry, sorry to interrupt screen, but
just to get to the bottom of this in
particular, for example, my screen time
includes text time.
>> It includes maps time. Yes,
>> this is my like excuse, I guess, right?
Yeah. text time, maps time, basically
any app on the phone is considered
screen time, >> correct?
>> correct?
>> Including actually a phone call. >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> So, um, what how much of that 8 hours?
>> Yeah. Let's break those down. So, about
5 and a half hours is the average social
media time that young people are on on
social media. So, after 30 minutes, you
are 2xing your risk of depression and anxiety.
anxiety.
>> 30 minutes on social media. After 30
minutes on social media, you are double
xing your risk of mood disorders,
anxiety and depression. now and I don't
think this is just so here's the thing
too this is why this is so complex it's
impacting different generations in many
different ways right so uh it's up to 10
hours actually screen time for
low-income communities which is even
more horrible I think
>> well I've noticed um if when there's
children after school the parents are working
working >> correct
>> correct
>> a lot and and you know higher income
families can work a lot too so it's like
but they might be you know if they're
like doing janitorial work or they're
doing retail work they're going to be
out doing that and the kid is going to
be on a screen, >> right?
>> right?
>> And that's their after school program is
watching cartoons. >> Totally.
>> Totally.
>> It's really hard to find good content to
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>> So, here's a projection of what this
looks like, though, young people's
lives. Your average 18-year-old, if you
break down your life into months, right?
Your average 18-year-old with a 90-year
lifespan. Third of your life is asleep,
right? It's like 27 months like, you
know, working, there's like 22 months in
the bathroom or something hilarious like
that. You know, break it down. And
there's about 334
months of free time that you're going to
have right now for young people with an
average lifespan of 90 years.
18-year-olds are on pace to spend 93% of
that time on a screen which is going to
amount to 27 years of their life. >> Okay.
>> Okay.
>> On a screen.
>> This is wild, but it's extremely
fascinating and important what you're saying.
saying.
>> Yeah. So if you break up 90 years of
life, which is a long lifespan into months,
months,
>> 22 months in the bathroom,
>> there's some fun. Yeah. You break down
like this, these amount of months is
work. This is like going to be
>> so the 330ish
months of free time over a 90 year
lifespan after you take out personal
care, eating,
>> uh sleeping, and you take out work.
>> So this would be like time you could be
>> This is when you're falling in love.
This is when you're going on trips. This
is when you're playing an instrument.
This is when you're reading a book. This
is when you're learning a new recipe.
Like, name the human things
>> that we're losing. 93% of that time
right now for them is going to be spent
on the screen
>> and they're going to look back on their
life and look at 27 years of screen
time. So, really a huge part of why I'm
doing what I'm doing is I want to help
people get their time back into their
lives. I was just on Tammy Peterson's
show and shared this data. I was like
talked to a lot of pastors and people
that you know accompany people on their
deathbed and what do people talk about
when they're dying? I'm very interested
in that topic. And guess what? It's not
the company you built.
>> It's not how much money you had.
>> It's not how many followers you've had.
It's not how much Netflix you watched
even. It's not the movies. It's not It's
not anything but people. It relates to
regrets with not spending enough time
with people or wishing they did more
things with people. And Tammy's like, I
can confirm that when I was dying,
because Tammy Tammy was dying, cancer,
she said she literally thought of her
son and thought of her son having
children. It's all people orientated.
So, I think what I'm realizing is that
it's not necessarily what the phone is
doing to us and screens are doing to us.
It's what they're undoing in our lives.
It's what they're eroding, I think, that
is actually more alarming than what
they're giving us. because they seem to
give us a lot, but they're actually
designed to take away more from us than
they give. So, this is where we maybe
get back into a little bit of the
history of these platforms. This is from
Sean Parker. He's the founding president
of Facebook with Zuckerberg. Uh, this
quotes in every book, so I'm just going
to give kind of highle points to help
people understand the history of these
technologies, how they were designed,
and how they're manipulating us, and
then your decision on how you want to
use them. because ultimately I'm
realizing yeah social media is not going
away for me it's been better to not
participate in that but I get for
people's businesses or for Facebook
marketplace like there's things in that
that I realize people are utilizing for
good which is obviously a lot of my
friends um that I realize have their
place but we have to understand that
trade-offs are massive for most people right
right
>> well you're going to read that quote and
what we're going to get to and I know
we've said like let's be sure to talk
about this with humanity all of what
you're doing is laying the groundwork
for the problem to wake up to the
problem, be very sober minded about what
are we actually dealing with and then
there is a solution and so I'm excited
to get to that.
>> Yes, we're going to get to very happy
stuff. This is all the intense stuff
that like I read every day that's super
depressing. Like it's really hard
sometimes to be happy when I understand
the amount that's happening in the world
in people's lives. And mind you, I'm on
the road speaking all over the world
essentially on this topic. I have sixth
grade girls coming up to me telling me
Tik Tok's ruining their life. Yes,
people are dying because I have a story
with that too. Maybe remind me that
story uh after this.
>> The dying Tik Tok story.
>> Dying. Well, sadly connected to
Snapchat, but I would like to share that
story. This is Sean Parker, the founding
president of Facebook. He says, quote,
the thought process that went into
building these applications, Facebook
being the first of them, was all about
quote, "How do we consume as much of
your time and conscious attention as
possible?" And that means we sort of we
need to sort of give you a little
dopamine hit every once in a while
because someone liked or commented on a
po post or a photo or whatever. And
that's going to get you to contribute
more content and that's going to get you
more likes and comments. It's a social
validation feedback loop. Exactly the
kind of thing that a hacker like myself
would come up with because you're
exploiting a vulnerability in human
psychology. It's Kevin Sister on
Instagram. It's Zuckerberg. It's all
these people understood this consciously
and we did it anyway.
So you have to understand the people
that created these technologies were
purposely trying to consume our
attention. So here's the genesis of
that. There's a few important names.
We'll get into some of the science. BF
Skinner is one of them. BJ Fog's another
one. I don't know what the B thing is
with these like psychology professors,
but it starts with Skinner cages, right?
Have you heard of the Skinner cages?
Tell me what
>> essentially studies with rats that
actually showed that um you know it was
how they were getting addicted to different
different
>> you know drugs and it was really trying
to you know unpack addiction science
right so they put them in Skinner cages
they they saw
>> what is a Skinner cage
>> it was essentially BF Skinner was a
psychologist that created these
environments for rats
>> to do test test
>> to do testing on them and they were
incredibly isolated and they got
addicted to the morphine and they
noticed instead of just giving it a
perfect hit at the same time they
noticed that this intermittent positive
positive feedback or variable reward
system made the rats more addicted to
the drug. So instead of just knowing at
a perfect time they're going to get it,
it was the uncertainty, the novelty that
created addiction. Right now think of
every slot machine, think of every
social media swipe. It's all novelty and
intermittent positive feedback. So guys
like BJ Vog, he's teaching in the 1990s
I think at the Stanford persuasive uh
technology lab. Do you want to know the
name of the website for this lab? I'll
tell you, Laya. It is machines designed
to change humans.com.
>> Mach. Is it still up?
>> I don't know actually. Stanford
>> designed to change humans.
>> Designed to changehumans.com.
This is definitely a 90%.
>> It doesn't look like it exists.
>> They probably took it down.
>> Yeah. I'm like, that's not that's not a
good look anymore. Yeah. Not a good
looking just like Google took out of
actually their company. Don't be evil.
>> They took that out in 2018. That's a fun fact.
fact.
>> The Wayback Machine. Okay. Keep going.
I'm actually serious about the Wayback
Machine now. But
>> BJ Fog has this class now called the
Facebook class. Now, this is all of your
founders of all of the major tech
platforms you can think of. He starts to
teach them these Skinner principles and
many other different principles on how
to addict people and change their human
behavior through incentives. Right? He
calls them put you know putting hot
triggers in front of motivated people
was one of his main quotes. So he took
this Facebook class was sharing these
studies from BF Skinner and others
called behaviorism. This is literally
how to manipulate people's behavior and
showed that actually with this those
principles they were applied they used
them in 10 weeks they created over $16
million of revenue and like a million
users on some some app.
>> This was what year?
>> This was like in the early 90s. Okay.
and voila, all of your social media
platforms are born. So, they start with
BJ Fog and he's tried to, you know,
share that he's not, you know, he
regrets, I think, a lot of these things.
You start to find out a lot of these
guys knew what they were doing and and
knew that this would literally transform
the way people thought they related to
themselves and each other. So, BJ Fog
started with these kind of principles.
This equation B equals MAT. Behavior
change equals motivation, ability, and
trigger. So now think of every social
media platform to change our motivation.
We're social creatures. So Daniel
Lieberman, I think he's at UCLA,
neuroscientist, talks about how actually
our brains reflexively think social. And
this is how God created us, right? So
this is what's so amazing. God created
us to be social creatures. These
platforms are actually hijacking this
deep gift that God has given us for the
social. Literally Daniel Liber Lieberman
talks about this. Our brain's reflex is
to think about people, right? So these
platforms are praying upon us in these
multiple different ways all using this
equation. Behavior equals motivation,
ability, trigger. What's our motivation?
It's to be social. Most of social media
is just people watching. When you kind
of get above what you're scrolling,
you're just watching people cuz we're
social, right? So they know that. They
know our deepest motivation, especially
for teenagers, is a social, right?
Remember me in high school, I changed
the way I dressed. I had to start
cussing. I had to start listening to
Usher and do the drugs and go to the
parties to fit in, right? Because as
social creatures at that development
time, we need connection. We can't get
out of the tribe. If we get pushed out
of the tribe, that's death. Right? Now,
go into a digital framework. You're
getting a dopamine hit with this
intermittent positive feedback, this
variable reward system because you don't
know what's coming next. That keeps you
in the scroll. And I know you know about
dopamine, right? So, dopamine is this
neurotransmitter in the brain. Makes you
feel good. Again, a gift from God. If
you have if you don't have dopamine, you
die, right? Makes you feel really good
when you don't have dopamine, you die.
>> Well, because you'll have no motivation.
You'll lose all motivation. So, Anna
Lumpky talks about this too in her book,
Dopamine Nation. But that anticipatory
motivation for the social is what keeps
you in the doom scroll. And literally
gaming, this is Dr. Nicholas Keras's
work. He wrote a book called Glow Kids
and Digital Madness. He's on our board
of adviserss, but he talks about
actually the dopamine released during
gaming in 1998
was 100%. It was 100% increase from your
base level dopamine state with gaming in
1998. Guess what else releases dopamine
at 100%. Sex.
Sex.
So sex is usually a timelmited thing you
know and with gaming it can actually be
12 plus hours long of gaming on these
platforms that is increasing these super
physsiological states of dopamine right
now think of your social media platforms
super physiological I talked to a lot of
people and I experienced this myself
there's this almost loss of time right
that happens you don't realize how long
you're scrolling hours can go by it's
because you're getting a dopamine hit of
novelty from this variable reward system
in the brain that is keeping you glued
to more more more more. Right? So, what
does that do to us after? It's a crash.
There's all these studies that show that
Facebook depression is actually a real
thing. And actually, this euphoric
recall is what they call it. So, when
you scroll for a long time after
Facebook, you most likely feel depressed
after. Here's the thing, Laya. I've
never heard anyone in all the years I've
kind of been thinking about this,
talking about this. After 4 hours of
scrolling, name a social media platform
that people are like, "Oh my gosh, the
world is in such a great place. I love
my life and I can't wait to do my 3:00
a.m. workout tomorrow morning. You know,
most people after a scroll are like,
"What did I do with my time? That was
incredibly wasteful." And
>> and we're all going to die because AI is
going to take over the world, which it
might be. It might be, and we will all
die, right?
>> Because we do die,
>> but like,
>> right, but it's this thing called
euphoric recall. We look back on that
dopamine experience of feeling good
about watching people. And again, this
is what's so difficult. I love that we
get to watch our grandma and I love that
I can FaceTime my grandpa and you know
there is something good within that.
That's why it's really hard to nuance
this. But along with that viewing of
what your friend is doing over there,
you're also getting a really angry
person is talking about something
political, right? You're also getting uh
something hor I mean I literally
remember watching on my Instagram scroll
like the Sri Lankan tsunamis. Literally
watched a guy just get hit by a 30-foot
tsunami and die and then I went on to my
next scroll.
>> Yeah. It's
>> right. So there's so much happening. But
so these guys founding these companies
knew this. Steve Jobs in a 2010
interview was asked, "How are your kids
loving the new iPad?" He said, "We do
not give them these technologies. We
limit their use."
>> Shamoth also worked with uh Facebook
starting and he literally said, quote,
"I don't use this crap. I don't even
give this to my kids." All of the
founders of all these big tech platforms
went to what's called Waldorf schools
>> which are low tech to zero tech schools
and they don't send their kids to
schools with technology. So when the
they when they aren't getting high on
their own supply it's something to
acknowledge right because it's shaping
who we are. So that's one two major
mechanisms, right? Social approval is
huge. I can't even dive into how deep
that is, especially for young people on
why we're stuck in these platforms and
then the intermittent positive feedback.
Those are two really big mechanisms that
are being deployed on purpose. So again,
that's motivation. Now let's think of
the ability. The convenience of the ease
of these technologies creates that
misuse of it, right? There's no
friction. So if you read atomic habits
and you look at James Clear's work on
changing habits, right? A huge part of
what he talks about is creating friction
in some of these um you know
conveniences that are maybe detrimental
in our life.
>> What does that mean?
>> So friction is just making something a
little bit more difficult. So instead of
your Instagram being on your phone, put
it on your computer.
>> So this is Atomic Habits. Who's the
author again? James Clear. And it's his
advice for how to create better habits
or or root out bad habits. Yes. And to
root out the bad habits, you need to
create the thing that you were doing
that was easy and fun and comfortable
that you're addicted to. Make it harder
to do.
>> Yes. And this what's so hard about the addiction.
addiction.
>> If you love to eat Oreo cookies, don't
put them in the house. You have to go to
the grocery store, buy the cookies.
>> Just like you've never put alcohol in in
a room with an alcohol.
>> Or if you have a porn habit, you should
install Covenant Eyes on your phone with
the code Laya. But one month free. What
is it? Anyways, covenant is great, but
you make it harder to do the bad thing.
>> Correct. Now, this is what's so hard
with the phone with the screen just to
your point. You you have maps, you have
communication, you have information, the
information is ubiquitous, right? But
the impact of being again omnipresent uh
what's happening and this is in Nicholas
Carr's book uh the shallows and his
latest book superloom I highly
recommend. He talks about the reality
that when we were being proposed all
these technologies when Zuckerberg named
the guy we're going to connect the
world, right? What were they saying?
This is going to be the most incredible
thing ever. We're going to connect the
world, right? We didn't realize that
connecting the world would have so many
trade-offs, right? Polarization. Think
about how many families don't talk to
each other now because family members
because of stuff people are posting
online politically. It's destroying so
many relationships in so many different
ways, right?
>> Just because of people uh voicing
opinions, sometimes bad opinions,
terrible opinions, but they they see the
family member doing it. They're like,
"Well, I can't have you over for dinner."
dinner."
>> Totally. I mean, literally, there's
people that Nicholas Carr quotes that
were talking about that electronic
communication is literally going to
abolish war. It's going to abolish war.
It's going to create this incredible
socioeconomic um equality. Like, people
are going to have more understanding and
information and be empowered. We're
seeing actually the complete opposite.
There's a study called Brain Drain. I
think it was 2017 that actually just
showed researchers took students, they
put them in a room, had them do
different cognitive tests, IQ tests, all
these things, had the phone completely
outside the room. As the phone got
closer and they took cognitive tests,
their scores declined. Even the phone
next to them face down, not on, their
performance on the cognitive test decreased
decreased
>> because there was like a hyper alert alert.
alert.
>> Just the mere presence is literally
mental energy away from us. Right.
>> This is all very compelling, of course,
but just to play devil's advocate for a moment.
moment.
>> I like this. Um there is of course the
trade-offs like you keep mentioning
>> and you know I've seen just in my bubble
you let's call it or my little um
anecdotes of pro-life activism
>> live action has like now over combined 8
million social media followers right 3
billion video views all of this and it's
all this pro-life content
>> that clearly you're not one of the
followers or the views but that's okay
but it's all this pro-life content and
it's exposing abortion it's celebrating
human dignity
upgrade, your car, your outfit. It's not
designed to be like, "Look, I'm so cool
and you're not." It's designed to help
you feel
>> sympathy, empathy
>> for the unborn baby,
>> and see that abortion is bad and connect
people to resources. So, we're a hub to
connect people to the,
>> you know, thousands of pregnancy
resource centers out there and all of
this, right? >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
If you could give me a button that would
I could press that would delete all
social media everywhere for everyone, I
would press that button. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> But because we live in because there's
people promoting abortion misinformation
relentlessly online and they have more
money than we do by like 100x.
>> Um and the tech lords overlords are all
proorts, right? So you're dealing with that.
that.
>> Um so I would press the delete button
for the whole world if I could, but
provided we don't have the delete
button. Um, obviously we're we're we are
out there. So, I guess I'm answering my
own question. I was going to do the
devil's advocate of like, does the can
the good outweigh the bad? >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> Well, can the good outweigh the bad if
people use it responsibly or if the tech
overlords took out some of these incentives?
incentives? >> Yes.
>> Yes.
>> That are so um pernicious to make people
continue to click click click.
>> Yes. I love this question and I want to
acknowledge again how
nuanced and complex this is and and how
we're literally in a storm. I mean,
we're we're navigating a digital
overwhelm world where there's people
literally doing amazing thing like like
you're doing in this realm and then
also, you know, the plethora of other
things that are happening, right? So,
I'm I'm trying to look at this at a
macro level and then a personal level
and see what the data is pointing to um
and then really hear what is going to be
the best way to move forward in your
day-to-day. And so, there's a lot to
unpack there. Particularly, I think I
want to keep diving in a little bit more
to exactly how this is impacting the
individual person because I think it'll
connect to your to your point with
continuing to pump out all this amazing
content because if people are on these
things, this is how they're going to
engage with that information.
Now, it's really hard to have some type
of metric to say how many people have
watched how many good videos and how has
that changed their thinking and their
life and their actions, you know, and I
guarantee you there's so many
conversations of really good people that
we all know that are doing great things
that are creating incredible fruit in a
lot of people's lives, right? So, I
can't deny the good that can come out of it.
it.
To me, per person right now, depending
on yeah, your relationship with this
supercomput in your pocket, it's really
hard to give a one-sizefits-all answer
to a very complex situation. Cuz if you
are 90 years old right now, you had most
of your life to develop neurologically,
relationally, career-wise. Boomers are
having a very different experience from
this. Boomers are doing great.
>> Boomers got money. They got they got
they're doing great. They have friends.
They're I see most boomers around
walking, getting outside. They're doing
things. They're bike riding.
>> They are. They're so like on top of it.
I think there's a subset of boomers who
are actually really unhappy because they
feel like their family ties have disintegrated.
disintegrated.
>> Well, that's also this whole no contact
thing happens.
>> But but generally speaking, I think I
mean it would be interesting the health
actually this is a really interesting
question. Are the health outcomes for boomers
boomers
better than they're anticipated to be
for Gen Xers and millennials?
>> Oh, I mean, it has to be. So, we're also al
al
>> Well, yeah, there has to be.
>> Well, we're also in a chronic disease
epidemic, obesity epidemic, loneliness
epidemic. These these epidemics
>> that's hitting the younger younger. I
mean, I like like testosterone. I've
heard like younger men have dramatically
lower testosterone at large than their predecessors.
predecessors.
>> Yes, that's just one example. There's a
lot of reasons to that largely due to
technology. Dr. Cardara said, "We're not
designed to be sedentary, screen,
staring, meaning devoid creatures." So,
what what builds testosterone? Sunlight,
lifting heavy things, low-level movement
throughout the day. We get none of those
things. We're we're sitting 8 hours a
day. Anna Lumpky talks about this. You
know, 100 years ago, we were out, we
were outside working 6 and a half days a
week, 10 to 12 hour days with about 2
and a half hours of leisure a day. Right
now, fast forward 100 years. We um are
indoors 97 to 98% of the time and we
have about five and a half hours of
leisure a day.
>> We invest all that back into technology.
That's the average screen time actually
for the adult. So all the washing
machine, the dryer, your sink, the car,
all these time-saving technologies have
given us back incredible time, but we're
actually wasting that time on mostly
useless technological interaction. Or
I've noticed we are working more
>> that too.
>> A lot of the white collar jobs today and
I'm not saying blue collar jobs you
don't work more too but like
>> like if you have a boss in corporate
America whether you are an attorney or
you're working in business or tech or
whatever there's this expectation of
working in the evenings and early
morning and weekends. Yes.
>> You're always on. You're never off. You
got to check emails all day. We're
messages all day. So I want to dive into
more of the trade-offs still because I
think it's going to better answer your question
question
>> um of ultimately okay. Can there does
the good outweigh the bad in these
certain circumstances? So there's a lot
of trade-offs happening right now. Our
attention span now 2013 Microsoft had a
study that showed our attention span is
now fallen below the goldfish. The
goldfish is at 9 seconds. The human
person now is at 8 seconds. Okay. So our
attention span is falling.
>> What is it supposed to be at?
>> It's well I don't know if it's like
quote supposed to be at anything but
it's falling like
>> but what did it what was it before technology?
technology?
>> That's a great question. Yeah, that
study was simply quoting that we fallen
behind the goldfish which is unfortunate.
unfortunate.
>> I'm curious about that. So the so um
what should Yeah. What what should the
average I mean
>> I just like very anecdotally I look at
the letters that soldiers would write
their families during the Civil War. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> I look at the letters that Roman
soldiers would write their families
during like the Roman wars against the
barbarians or whatever and I'm like
shocked at the eloquence and the
thoughtfulness of these letters. And
then I look at the sorts of notes and
letters that are written to each other today.
today. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> And they are like, you know, love you.
Thanks. You know, you're the best. I
love you so much. Like we we we don't
even know how to communicate in long
form with each other anymore.
>> Yes. I love letter writing. I'm trying
to bring it back. We're trying to bring
it back. If you want to write a letter,
go to humanity.
>> I mean, I remember doing that in high
school. I would write my friends. We
would pen out. we'd write and I had this
box in my attic
>> of these beautiful letters that I
received because I would receive and
write them and my husband thankfully
when we were dating he would still write
me beautiful letters and I would write
him some I guess not maybe not as good
as his cuz he's a so smart and like he's
a so such a good writer but I think
about right now do I write any letters I
mean I write emails
>> but when was last time I wrote a
handwritten letter to somebody letters
yeah it's hard for my
>> it's like because how why would you take
time to write a letter when you You
could send a text and the text is say,
"I love you." And they get it
immediately. You know, they're going to
be touched by it. They're going to feel
affirmed and they got it. You did it.
So, why would you write a person a letter?
letter?
>> Yeah. There's something so special about
letters, though.
>> No, I'm saying. Yeah, I agree.
>> Yeah. No, but to your point, too, that's
again, this is a trade-off. Convenience.
>> Yeah. Let's go through a little bit more
of the trade-offs because it's vast,
right? So, when you're entering in the
digital landscape of a personal
supercomput, there's more. And I just
want to hit this briefly because it is
part of my experience too
>> and I think it will answer again some of
this question more. Taking into account
is this a greater risk for you to be on
every platform and have a supercomput in
your pocket or is it better to remove
yourself from these completely? Uh right now there's more views each month to
now there's more views each month to pornography than X uh Netflix, OpenAI
pornography than X uh Netflix, OpenAI and Zoom and Amazon combined. Right? So
and Zoom and Amazon combined. Right? So there's more traffic to these sites than
there's more traffic to these sites than any of these other platforms. Right?
any of these other platforms. Right? Average age is 11. It's getting close to
Average age is 11. It's getting close to seven.
seven. >> Average onset age.
>> Average onset age. >> Onset age of exposure is 11. Getting
>> Onset age of exposure is 11. Getting closer to seven. So that's a huge topic
closer to seven. So that's a huge topic right in itself. The way that's warping
right in itself. The way that's warping the human brain. Obviously dopamine. We
the human brain. Obviously dopamine. We go into that a lot with our curriculum.
go into that a lot with our curriculum. And that's a m you are if you are a high
And that's a m you are if you are a high school student with no boundaries or no
school student with no boundaries or no guardrails with that you are looking at
guardrails with that you are looking at pornograph. There's no way you're not
pornograph. There's no way you're not somehow being exposed at least, right?
somehow being exposed at least, right? Massive risk going to affect your future
Massive risk going to affect your future in every way possible. There's literally
in every way possible. There's literally Dr. Cardar talks about this. There's
Dr. Cardar talks about this. There's different uh s uh seminars he's been
different uh s uh seminars he's been going to where physicians are literally
going to where physicians are literally talking about erectile dysfunction in
talking about erectile dysfunction in high school students. I mean, if you
high school students. I mean, if you want to have an amazing intimate
want to have an amazing intimate >> like compulsive masturbation.
>> like compulsive masturbation. >> Oh, yeah. But if you want to have an
>> Oh, yeah. But if you want to have an amazing intimate sex life with one
amazing intimate sex life with one person for the rest of your life,
person for the rest of your life, >> the worst thing you can do is be
>> the worst thing you can do is be addicted to porn, you know, throughout
addicted to porn, you know, throughout your your childhood, right? So huge
your your childhood, right? So huge risk, right? Can't even go into depth of
risk, right? Can't even go into depth of how big that risk is. Then obviously the
how big that risk is. Then obviously the mental health crisis which is largely
mental health crisis which is largely unfolding with Gen Z, right? Which all
unfolding with Gen Z, right? Which all the data shows, Jonathan Heights work,
the data shows, Jonathan Heights work, it's 100%, you know, over 100% increased
it's 100%, you know, over 100% increased anxiety since 2010, depression since
anxiety since 2010, depression since 2010. Self harm has quadrupled amongst
2010. Self harm has quadrupled amongst 10 to 14 year old girls the last 10
10 to 14 year old girls the last 10 years. these body image issues. There's
years. these body image issues. There's literally a diagnosis now called
literally a diagnosis now called Snapchat dysphoria where young girls are
Snapchat dysphoria where young girls are going to plastic surgeons to literally
going to plastic surgeons to literally manipulate their face to look like their
manipulate their face to look like their Snapchat.
Snapchat. >> It's an Instagram thing, too. And Tik
>> It's an Instagram thing, too. And Tik Tok, but yeah, it's I mean, I think
Tok, but yeah, it's I mean, I think there's like the Kardashian look that
there's like the Kardashian look that everybody has to have like really big
everybody has to have like really big lips.
lips. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> And the Kardashians are lovely ladies.
>> And the Kardashians are lovely ladies. I'm not trying to, you know, fault their
I'm not trying to, you know, fault their physiques, but they they've obviously
physiques, but they they've obviously achieved a certain look using
achieved a certain look using augmentation, using plastic surgery, and
augmentation, using plastic surgery, and they they're open about it. They talk
they they're open about it. They talk about it and so it's between a certain
about it and so it's between a certain shape of the nose, a certain shape of
shape of the nose, a certain shape of the lips, you know, certain even the
the lips, you know, certain even the brow. I think there's a huge um popular
brow. I think there's a huge um popular wave I'm seeing. It's called what is it
wave I'm seeing. It's called what is it called? It's for bluff bluff. Blleest
called? It's for bluff bluff. Blleest blasty. What is it called?
blasty. What is it called? >> Bluff upper bluff is what it's called.
>> Bluff upper bluff is what it's called. Basically, they cut their eyelids. Gosh.
Basically, they cut their eyelids. Gosh. >> To lift their eyebrows.
>> To lift their eyebrows. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> Um but it's all because of how you look
>> Um but it's all because of how you look in pictures. This is what I've been So I
in pictures. This is what I've been So I mean a quick rant.
mean a quick rant. >> Yeah. Let's go rant me. When you meet
>> Yeah. Let's go rant me. When you meet people who have had plastic surgery
people who have had plastic surgery done,
done, >> you can tell most of the time. There's
>> you can tell most of the time. There's some very light Botox maybe that you
some very light Botox maybe that you won't notice, right? But with lip
won't notice, right? But with lip fillers, you can tell most of the time
fillers, you can tell most of the time with lip fillers, as an example, or
with lip fillers, as an example, or >> you know, certain facial things that are
>> you know, certain facial things that are done on social media, it's how you
done on social media, it's how you photograph. it looks maybe great or it
photograph. it looks maybe great or it looks like how AI would look or the
looks like how AI would look or the Kardashians or whatever, but in real
Kardashians or whatever, but in real life. So, it's like you're getting the
life. So, it's like you're getting the plastic surgery done for how you look on
plastic surgery done for how you look on Instagram or on Tik Tok. It's not even
Instagram or on Tik Tok. It's not even how you look in real life
how you look in real life >> because in real life people actually
>> because in real life people actually like more natural faces and there's
like more natural faces and there's studies that have been done that prove
studies that have been done that prove this.
this. >> I like that. I mean, so here so yeah,
>> I like that. I mean, so here so yeah, let's just keep going. Again, technology
let's just keep going. Again, technology is influencing us to literally change
is influencing us to literally change our bodies, not just to be addicted and
our bodies, not just to be addicted and screen time, but to change our bodies
screen time, but to change our bodies for how we're going to look on
for how we're going to look on technology.
technology. >> 100%. And this is why it's so important
>> 100%. And this is why it's so important to understand all of the trade-offs that
to understand all of the trade-offs that are happening. I don't think parents or
are happening. I don't think parents or millennials, I don't think most people
millennials, I don't think most people know how bad it is. And that's why I
know how bad it is. And that's why I think these conversations to me are more
think these conversations to me are more I want this to be more informational
I want this to be more informational that leads to action. I don't want this
that leads to action. I don't want this to be entertainment, right? I don't want
to be entertainment, right? I don't want people to view this and be like, "Oh,
people to view this and be like, "Oh, wow. That's really sad. like I'm not
wow. That's really sad. like I'm not going to do anything about it. Neil
going to do anything about it. Neil Postman's greatest fear is that politics
Postman's greatest fear is that politics and religion in a new media medium,
and religion in a new media medium, right? Marshall McLuhan said the medium
right? Marshall McLuhan said the medium is the message, right? The medium is
is the message, right? The medium is shaping us like in this digital world
shaping us like in this digital world that people are viewing us, you know,
that people are viewing us, you know, right now like this is shaping your
right now like this is shaping your thinking, your reality, your actions.
thinking, your reality, your actions. His greatest fear was that we would turn
His greatest fear was that we would turn religion and politics, two incredibly
religion and politics, two incredibly important topics, into entertainment,
important topics, into entertainment, right? And I think we're entertaining
right? And I think we're entertaining ourselves to death, right? Neil
ourselves to death, right? Neil Postman's book, Amusing Ourselves to
Postman's book, Amusing Ourselves to Death, is actually what's happening. But
Death, is actually what's happening. But let's keep going. So, you have
let's keep going. So, you have Tourette's. Tik Tok Tourette's syndrome.
Tourette's. Tik Tok Tourette's syndrome. Tik Tok Tourette's syndrome is a real
Tik Tok Tourette's syndrome is a real diagnosis that is happening where people
diagnosis that is happening where people are manifesting Tourette's from Tik Tok
are manifesting Tourette's from Tik Tok where influencers in the mental health
where influencers in the mental health space that are, you know, actually have
space that are, you know, actually have this diagnosis through social contagion
this diagnosis through social contagion effect. I talked to Jordan Peterson
effect. I talked to Jordan Peterson about this and I asked Jordan, I was
about this and I asked Jordan, I was like, "Is this a real thing?" saying and
like, "Is this a real thing?" saying and he's like social contagion effect is
he's like social contagion effect is nothing new. There's hysterical dancing
nothing new. There's hysterical dancing that happened you know the last like two
that happened you know the last like two centuries or something like social
centuries or something like social contagion is a very well doumented
contagion is a very well doumented documented phenomenon. There's literally
documented phenomenon. There's literally people that don't have Tourette's that
people that don't have Tourette's that are watching these influencers with
are watching these influencers with Tourette's and manifesting Tourette's
Tourette's and manifesting Tourette's syndromes and going into hospitals and
syndromes and going into hospitals and being diagnosed. Right. So you
being diagnosed. Right. So you >> by Tourette's you mean like just having
>> by Tourette's you mean like just having ticks?
ticks? >> Yes. Yes. You know what?
>> Yes. Yes. You know what? >> But they don't Yeah. But they don't have
>> But they don't Yeah. But they don't have them. They don't have them. They
them. They don't have them. They literally will do these detoxes for
literally will do these detoxes for >> Isn't that the entire transgender
>> Isn't that the entire transgender ideology wave if that there's like a I
ideology wave if that there's like a I don't what's the number? Is it a fifth
don't what's the number? Is it a fifth of students or there's like some crazy
of students or there's like some crazy percentage? It's like 10 10% to 20% of
percentage? It's like 10 10% to 20% of young people think they might be the
young people think they might be the other gender. Can you look it up Paris?
other gender. Can you look it up Paris? Actually, I don't know if you know
Actually, I don't know if you know >> 1400% increase at least in Ireland. I
>> 1400% increase at least in Ireland. I was just reading of transgender and and
was just reading of transgender and and I think Cardaris talks about a 4,000%
I think Cardaris talks about a 4,000% increase once these technologies were
increase once these technologies were released. So, here's the 2010 number
released. So, here's the 2010 number when Jonathan Height's talking about
when Jonathan Height's talking about what happened in 2010 where all this
what happened in 2010 where all this just got ramped up. Do you actually know
just got ramped up. Do you actually know what he says in this? No, tell me.
what he says in this? No, tell me. >> I think it's real.
>> I think it's real. >> The frontfacing camera on the
>> The frontfacing camera on the smartphone.
smartphone. >> Wow.
>> Wow. >> Because all of a sudden, life became
>> Because all of a sudden, life became something that was performed. Car
something that was performed. Car Nicholas Carr talks about this. We are
Nicholas Carr talks about this. We are now the watcher and the watched.
now the watcher and the watched. >> So, the sharp decline in mental health.
>> So, the sharp decline in mental health. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> The sharp increase in these social
>> The sharp increase in these social contagion illnesses. Yes. including I
contagion illnesses. Yes. including I would say transgenderism
would say transgenderism >> and I think LGBTQ identification has
>> and I think LGBTQ identification has like just mushroomed in the last decade.
like just mushroomed in the last decade. >> Jonathan Height says it starts with the
>> Jonathan Height says it starts with the front-facing Yes.
front-facing Yes. >> camera on the iPhone.
>> camera on the iPhone. >> 2010 is when that came out. Yeah, I
>> 2010 is when that came out. Yeah, I think it's sense because that is the the
think it's sense because that is the the it isn't it is a curious design because
it isn't it is a curious design because I remember I mean you mentioned self
I remember I mean you mentioned self harm. What was the increased number for
harm. What was the increased number for self harm in young
self harm in young >> it's quadrupled amongst 10 to 14y old
>> it's quadrupled amongst 10 to 14y old girls specifically
girls specifically >> in the last decade or what's the time
>> in the last decade or what's the time frame? I mean, in high school, I
frame? I mean, in high school, I remember Zangga. I would journal on
remember Zangga. I would journal on Zangga. Do you remember Zangga?
Zangga. Do you remember Zangga? >> Kind of. Yeah.
>> Kind of. Yeah. >> Okay. I wasn't really MySpace. I was
>> Okay. I wasn't really MySpace. I was Zangga. Okay.
Zangga. Okay. >> But anyways, we would journal and I had
>> But anyways, we would journal and I had my girlfriends and we But there was a
my girlfriends and we But there was a social contagion of self harm in my
social contagion of self harm in my friend group. All these girls having
friend group. All these girls having existential crises, going through
existential crises, going through puberty, not get we didn't have very
puberty, not get we didn't have very good support, some of us. Anyways,
good support, some of us. Anyways, everyone was self harming. One girl
everyone was self harming. One girl starts. I experimented with it at a
starts. I experimented with it at a certain point cuz I was suffering
certain point cuz I was suffering depression. Anyways, it was all
depression. Anyways, it was all connected to social contagion. Yeah. And
connected to social contagion. Yeah. And this was before. I mean, I didn't grow
this was before. I mean, I didn't grow up with Tik Tok. I did not grow up with
up with Tik Tok. I did not grow up with Instagram. Thanks be to God. I didn't
Instagram. Thanks be to God. I didn't have those things, right? It would have
have those things, right? It would have been it would have, you know, sounds
been it would have, you know, sounds like would have ruined both of us, even
like would have ruined both of us, even worse than, you know, our issues were.
worse than, you know, our issues were. Um, but I think about the fact that that
Um, but I think about the fact that that existed then, like self harm was an
existed then, like self harm was an issue that was growing among young girls
issue that was growing among young girls back in the early 2000s, right?
back in the early 2000s, right? >> Now, it is like everywhere. And then
>> Now, it is like everywhere. And then there's the extreme self harm of like,
there's the extreme self harm of like, I'm going to be the other gender. I'm
I'm going to be the other gender. I'm gonna get a double masectomy. I'm going
gonna get a double masectomy. I'm going to take hormones and stunt my puberty
to take hormones and stunt my puberty and my my sexual social sex sexual
and my my sexual social sex sexual development and everything else. Um,
development and everything else. Um, >> and and you're saying, and Jonathan
>> and and you're saying, and Jonathan hates saying the real cliff moment for
hates saying the real cliff moment for the changes here was 2010 with the
the changes here was 2010 with the iPhone's frontfacing camera.
iPhone's frontfacing camera. >> Yeah. And this is some of Car's, you
>> Yeah. And this is some of Car's, you know, critique, too, is like now
know, critique, too, is like now everyone is famous, right? Your life,
everyone is famous, right? Your life, every moment of your day. Just think
every moment of your day. Just think about your Tik Tok scroll, your
about your Tik Tok scroll, your Instagram scroll. It's people
Instagram scroll. It's people communicating, you know, through a
communicating, you know, through a screen ideas. Again, we're social
screen ideas. Again, we're social creatures, so we're getting a dopamine
creatures, so we're getting a dopamine hit from just learning what they're
hit from just learning what they're saying. But here's some of the other
saying. But here's some of the other things that are being fractured, right?
things that are being fractured, right? Is our attention span, but also our
Is our attention span, but also our thinking. So, Dr. Car or Dr. Cordar
thinking. So, Dr. Car or Dr. Cordar talks about this as well. We're actually
talks about this as well. We're actually experiencing more dichomous thinking
experiencing more dichomous thinking compared to spectrum thinking. And so,
compared to spectrum thinking. And so, dichomous is really black and white,
dichomous is really black and white, really binary. We actually can't think
really binary. We actually can't think on a spectrum anymore. And that's
on a spectrum anymore. And that's actually what creates the best that's
actually what creates the best that's the best predictor of success. So uh Dr.
the best predictor of success. So uh Dr. Paul Torrance did this torance tolerance
Paul Torrance did this torance tolerance test. They followed uh university
test. They followed uh university students out of Michigan like for 70
students out of Michigan like for 70 years or something like that and studied
years or something like that and studied their trajectory looked at their life
their trajectory looked at their life and actually showed that creativity was
and actually showed that creativity was the best projector uh predictor sorry of
the best projector uh predictor sorry of success in their life. It wasn't
success in their life. It wasn't soioeconomic status, their IQ or even
soioeconomic status, their IQ or even the amount of money they made. It was
the amount of money they made. It was the level of creativity that actually
the level of creativity that actually created the most success in their life.
created the most success in their life. Sher Turkl talked about this in
Sher Turkl talked about this in reclaiming attention and uh or sorry
reclaiming attention and uh or sorry reclaiming conversation and alone
reclaiming conversation and alone together. Those two books are crucial,
together. Those two books are crucial, but she's talking about this. We're in a
but she's talking about this. We're in a creativity crisis. So we're not thinking
creativity crisis. So we're not thinking about again all the other things that
about again all the other things that are happening. So while you're scrolling
are happening. So while you're scrolling and possibly looking at something
and possibly looking at something amazing, possibly looking at something
amazing, possibly looking at something bad, what it's eroding is actually your
bad, what it's eroding is actually your capacity for nuance and deep thinking.
capacity for nuance and deep thinking. >> So Dr. Arthur Brooks talks about this.
>> So Dr. Arthur Brooks talks about this. I'm sorry. I might steal some of his
I'm sorry. I might steal some of his stuff for this next show. But you know
stuff for this next show. But you know this default mode network of the brain
this default mode network of the brain actually boredom is the birthplace. It's
actually boredom is the birthplace. It's the oasis of creativity. So if you want
the oasis of creativity. So if you want to be successful in life, in business,
to be successful in life, in business, in relationships, you want to prioritize
in relationships, you want to prioritize creativity in your life for many
creativity in your life for many different reasons. Again, just think of
different reasons. Again, just think of your normal scrolling day. you're
your normal scrolling day. you're actually being inundated with
actually being inundated with information on such a intensive overload
information on such a intensive overload that you aren't given the capacity to
that you aren't given the capacity to deeply think through these ideas. So
deeply think through these ideas. So here's what I even noticed in the
here's what I even noticed in the podcast world. I am obsessed with
podcast world. I am obsessed with information, right? I have a problem.
information, right? I have a problem. I'm obsessed with knowledge. I was
I'm obsessed with knowledge. I was listening to podcasts on my drive, on my
listening to podcasts on my drive, on my workout, on my walk, in bed. I wanted to
workout, on my walk, in bed. I wanted to learn at all times, right?
learn at all times, right? I noticed that learning in this way just
I noticed that learning in this way just even through podcasts which are really
even through podcasts which are really good information and it was Bishop Baron
good information and it was Bishop Baron and it was named the people and it was
and it was named the people and it was every health podcast you could ever
every health podcast you could ever imagine. I noticed I wasn't retaining a
imagine. I noticed I wasn't retaining a lot of information. I was indulging in a
lot of information. I was indulging in a lot but it wasn't actually creating real
lot but it wasn't actually creating real change in my life. It was mostly just
change in my life. It was mostly just turning into entertainment and it wasn't
turning into entertainment and it wasn't being actualized and it was also
being actualized and it was also overwhelming me in many ways. So that's
overwhelming me in many ways. So that's happening along as well. We're in an
happening along as well. We're in an information overload right today. Just
information overload right today. Just today on this show, there's going to be
today on this show, there's going to be over a million downloads of a podcast
over a million downloads of a podcast onto the internet. There will be enough
onto the internet. There will be enough information today for anyone who's going
information today for anyone who's going to live the next whatever 60 70 years to
to live the next whatever 60 70 years to not be able to listen to the amount of
not be able to listen to the amount of information just released today. So just
information just released today. So just think about how how much information is
think about how how much information is happening, the amount of quantity, it's
happening, the amount of quantity, it's overwhelming, right?
overwhelming, right? >> You were saying something just a moment
>> You were saying something just a moment ago. Um, it's all very compelling and
ago. Um, it's all very compelling and important, but you were saying
important, but you were saying >> we are all like the number one predictor
>> we are all like the number one predictor of success for anybody isn't
of success for anybody isn't socioeconomic, isn't IQ, isn't any of
socioeconomic, isn't IQ, isn't any of this. It is actually creativity which is
this. It is actually creativity which is very human made in God's image because
very human made in God's image because what is the creator designed us to be?
what is the creator designed us to be? >> I've actually never made that
>> I've actually never made that connection. We are we are to create like
connection. We are we are to create like that is and that was the command to Adam
that is and that was the command to Adam and Eve is um have dominion over the
and Eve is um have dominion over the world which is you know use the created
world which is you know use the created order and good to continue to create and
order and good to continue to create and to have life in full and abundant and
to have life in full and abundant and then multiply literally co-create with
then multiply literally co-create with me for new souls you know to populate
me for new souls you know to populate this beautiful world that I've created.
this beautiful world that I've created. So creation is like
So creation is like >> is such a deeply and uniquely human
>> is such a deeply and uniquely human thing because we're made in God's image
thing because we're made in God's image unlike any other animal in animal
unlike any other animal in animal kingdom. Anyways, um and if we are
kingdom. Anyways, um and if we are crushing our ability to create
crushing our ability to create >> you then we are hurting our own humanity
>> you then we are hurting our own humanity and the future and every relationships
and the future and every relationships everything else. But then you said
everything else. But then you said something about boredom and is that
something about boredom and is that connected I'm going to guess to leisure
connected I'm going to guess to leisure like creating space where there's no
like creating space where there's no agenda.
agenda. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Where
>> Where >> we don't know how to have leisure.
>> we don't know how to have leisure. >> We don't know how to have leisure.
>> We don't know how to have leisure. >> So I work I live in Lander Wyoming right
>> So I work I live in Lander Wyoming right now and that university the students are
now and that university the students are not allowed to have cell phones.
not allowed to have cell phones. >> There's a no cell phone policy at
>> There's a no cell phone policy at Wyoming Catholic College. I literally go
Wyoming Catholic College. I literally go there and I'm looking at the 90s. You
there and I'm looking at the 90s. You kids are I remember being shocked by
kids are I remember being shocked by this. I was just watching a a kid at the
this. I was just watching a a kid at the bus stop just looking around. It was so
bus stop just looking around. It was so shocking to me because what he wasn't
shocking to me because what he wasn't looking down his phone
looking down his phone >> so they can't even have the cell phone
>> so they can't even have the cell phone outside of the classroom.
outside of the classroom. >> Oh, there's no cell phones. You have to
>> Oh, there's no cell phones. You have to go to this university without a cell
go to this university without a cell phone. It's hilarious.
phone. It's hilarious. >> How do you call people?
>> How do you call people? >> They don't.
>> They don't. >> Can you have a Can you have a dumb
>> Can you have a Can you have a dumb phone?
phone? >> Nope.
>> Nope. >> Do is there a phone a phone line?
>> Do is there a phone a phone line? >> I don't probably. Yeah, they they
>> I don't probably. Yeah, they they >> in the dorm you can
>> in the dorm you can >> Yeah, probably. They like tell people do
>> Yeah, probably. They like tell people do a dial.
a dial. >> Yeah, probably. They tell people, "Hey,
>> Yeah, probably. They tell people, "Hey, go meet here. We're going to have a
go meet here. We're going to have a party tonight." Or the, you know,
party tonight." Or the, you know, >> no computers.
>> no computers. >> They can use computers,
>> They can use computers, >> but that's not They can't walk around.
>> but that's not They can't walk around. Obviously, if you're The point is you
Obviously, if you're The point is you can go sit down and do a dedicated work
can go sit down and do a dedicated work on a workstation computer, but you can't
on a workstation computer, but you can't be walking around with a super computer.
be walking around with a super computer. >> They're not allowed to have cell phones,
>> They're not allowed to have cell phones, no social media, all that stuff. I am
no social media, all that stuff. I am literally watching an experiment. I
literally watching an experiment. I mean, we're all in an experiment. This
mean, we're all in an experiment. This is what we have to understand. If you
is what we have to understand. If you are a modern human being today with the
are a modern human being today with the supercomput, you are in a social
supercomput, you are in a social experiment, right? That I'm trying to
experiment, right? That I'm trying to unpack for the world. what's happening
unpack for the world. what's happening to to give us some real answers of how
to to give us some real answers of how to move forward. And one of the other
to move forward. And one of the other things that's really important on the
things that's really important on the creativity side and the boredom side is
creativity side and the boredom side is that again that default mode network of
that again that default mode network of the brain, it has to turn on and it
the brain, it has to turn on and it doesn't turn on unless you're given
doesn't turn on unless you're given space. So now think about all of our
space. So now think about all of our days, right? We're in constant
days, right? We're in constant communication. I think the text message
communication. I think the text message has done more damage to human to humans
has done more damage to human to humans than almost anything else. This is like
than almost anything else. This is like a Oh, I think the text message was so
a Oh, I think the text message was so detrimental in so many ways and so
detrimental in so many ways and so great, right? This is again this
great, right? This is again this infinite good and infinite bad. There's
infinite good and infinite bad. There's there's parents that tell me just text
there's parents that tell me just text threads ruin their kids' life. And
threads ruin their kids' life. And >> what's the worst outcome in your view of
>> what's the worst outcome in your view of the text message? I mean, we talked
the text message? I mean, we talked earlier. I don't write letters anymore
earlier. I don't write letters anymore to my friends. I text them.
to my friends. I text them. >> Yeah. Well, this is for young people
>> Yeah. Well, this is for young people obviously more specifically, but think I
obviously more specifically, but think I even think about myself. How many
even think about myself. How many relationships were done over texting,
relationships were done over texting, texting late into the night, someone not
texting late into the night, someone not responding to my text, me watching that
responding to my text, me watching that they've seen the text and didn't respond
they've seen the text and didn't respond to the text, people breaking up over
to the text, people breaking up over text. Again, there's so many
text. Again, there's so many possibilities on just the text message.
possibilities on just the text message. It would take us the whole hour to go
It would take us the whole hour to go through. But for young people
through. But for young people specifically, cyber bullying, you know,
specifically, cyber bullying, you know, sending bad images,
sending bad images, >> texting,
>> texting, >> you know, uh just texting has this
>> you know, uh just texting has this possibility of so many negative
possibility of so many negative outcomes. And then it's great to check
outcomes. And then it's great to check in with the family and send a fun
in with the family and send a fun picture and have the group text with the
picture and have the group text with the fam and send all these amazing things.
fam and send all these amazing things. So that's why again it's it's so
So that's why again it's it's so difficult to make a prescription per
difficult to make a prescription per person because it's going to be so
person because it's going to be so individual.
individual. >> Let's go to principles then because I
>> Let's go to principles then because I know this is what you do and I think
know this is what you do and I think it's really important. You do obviously
it's really important. You do obviously workshops and trainings on this but for
workshops and trainings on this but for humanity what are your prescriptions?
humanity what are your prescriptions? Yes,
Yes, >> I know they include these principles for
>> I know they include these principles for how to use social media technology
how to use social media technology >> and you know back to those Wyoming
>> and you know back to those Wyoming Catholic kids as an example for the
Catholic kids as an example for the college familiar with Lander. Great
college familiar with Lander. Great great spot. um the you know I think
great spot. um the you know I think about them I think okay if you're not
about them I think okay if you're not using those media forms
using those media forms so much of business today drives is
so much of business today drives is driven by those media
driven by those media >> totally forms
>> totally forms >> totally
>> totally >> and that's not going away likely
>> and that's not going away likely >> and so how do you responsibly use it not
>> and so how do you responsibly use it not just how do you responsibly use social
just how do you responsibly use social media in your personal life if you're
media in your personal life if you're going to use it at all
going to use it at all >> how do you responsibly use it if you are
>> how do you responsibly use it if you are working
working >> yes
>> yes >> and you are creating Because a lot of a
>> and you are creating Because a lot of a lot of creation is happening in a way
lot of creation is happening in a way that is more um that is less about like
that is more um that is less about like you know how many how do I meet my
you know how many how do I meet my immediate physical needs
immediate physical needs >> right
>> right >> like the robots are going to do that for
>> like the robots are going to do that for us in the future right and it's more
us in the future right and it's more about well what are the very uniquely
about well what are the very uniquely human things
human things >> that I can create that maybe technology
>> that I can create that maybe technology can help me do
can help me do >> right yes so we're so my idea obviously
>> right yes so we're so my idea obviously reading like 40 plus topics on what this
reading like 40 plus topics on what this is doing to us and we just scratched the
is doing to us and we just scratched the surface of the problems that are
surface of the problems that are unfolding right there's an insane amount
unfolding right there's an insane amount more and then there's a lot of good
more and then there's a lot of good that's happening on a lot of these
that's happening on a lot of these platforms like this one we're on today,
platforms like this one we're on today, right? So for a personal prescription,
right? So for a personal prescription, right, on how to use this tech and let
right, on how to use this tech and let it not and how to let it not use you,
it not and how to let it not use you, you first have to understand, okay, what
you first have to understand, okay, what what technologies are you going to
what technologies are you going to interact with and how are you going to
interact with and how are you going to interact with them. So when you start
interact with them. So when you start our program, our detox program, you
our program, our detox program, you start with your digital plan of life,
start with your digital plan of life, right? So I stole a little bit from
right? So I stole a little bit from Escrea, Jose Maria Screva,
Escrea, Jose Maria Screva, >> but this idea of creating a plan. Okay.
>> but this idea of creating a plan. Okay. So certain technologies I would say are
So certain technologies I would say are upgrading our lives and then certain
upgrading our lives and then certain technologies are downgrading our lives.
technologies are downgrading our lives. For most people I would say
For most people I would say our age and younger most people share
our age and younger most people share with me they don't I don't hear anyone
with me they don't I don't hear anyone saying I want to scroll more. I don't
saying I want to scroll more. I don't really hear anyone coming to me saying
really hear anyone coming to me saying you know I want to be on my phone more.
you know I want to be on my phone more. It's mostly okay I know I have to be on
It's mostly okay I know I have to be on this. I can't get off of it. I wish I
this. I can't get off of it. I wish I could do what you're doing but I have to
could do what you're doing but I have to be on these things for XYZ. How do I get
be on these things for XYZ. How do I get my time back? Right? One of the things
my time back? Right? One of the things that's super important for longevity and
that's super important for longevity and health that we touched on is
health that we touched on is relationships is is relationships. So,
relationships is is relationships. So, the longest standing study since 1938 is
the longest standing study since 1938 is the adult uh development study at
the adult uh development study at Harvard. The number one data point from
Harvard. The number one data point from that is healthy relationships is the
that is healthy relationships is the best predictor of longevity. Actually,
best predictor of longevity. Actually, more than diet, more than exercise, more
more than diet, more than exercise, more than socioeconomic status, more than
than socioeconomic status, more than your area code. Right? So, right now
your area code. Right? So, right now there's a study called the American
there's a study called the American usage of time study. It it it followed
usage of time study. It it it followed 15 to 24 year olds from 2000 to 2019 and
15 to 24 year olds from 2000 to 2019 and showed that their FaceTime their
showed that their FaceTime their in-person FaceTime dropped from 167
in-person FaceTime dropped from 167 minutes I think to uh 66 minutes a day.
minutes I think to uh 66 minutes a day. >> Wait, what?
>> Wait, what? >> So their their their amount of FaceTime
>> So their their their amount of FaceTime per day was about 166 minutes a day of
per day was about 166 minutes a day of FaceTime.
FaceTime. >> What age group?
>> What age group? >> Uh 15 to 24.
>> Uh 15 to 24. >> So it used to be that if you're 15 to 24
>> So it used to be that if you're 15 to 24 years old, you had 166 minutes of
years old, you had 166 minutes of FaceTime. And now the 15 to 24 year olds
FaceTime. And now the 15 to 24 year olds have how much facetime?
have how much facetime? >> It's like under 66 minutes which per
>> It's like under 66 minutes which per year is 400 less hours of relational
year is 400 less hours of relational facetime. Twothirds of
facetime. Twothirds of >> all Americans or that that's 15 to 24
>> all Americans or that that's 15 to 24 and
and >> for is the are these Americans we're
>> for is the are these Americans we're talking about? Sorry.
conservative liberal, doesn't matter. Everything is becoming a threat.
Everything is becoming a threat. >> I think that is a problem on the right
>> I think that is a problem on the right that I'm seeing and being more on the
that I'm seeing and being more on the right. I can say this and I think it's
right. I can say this and I think it's good for us to acknowledge it's all
good for us to acknowledge it's all about they are out to get this. They
about they are out to get this. They they they they
they they they who is they
who is they >> is it an ideology? Is it an individual?
>> is it an ideology? Is it an individual? is an institution. But if it's the big
is an institution. But if it's the big broad they this is where conspiracy
broad they this is where conspiracy theories find their root and we become
theories find their root and we become we become hyper vigilant and uh you know
we become hyper vigilant and uh you know scared of everything and everyone.
scared of everything and everyone. >> Here's one point I want to make so
>> Here's one point I want to make so deeply every like we're turn technology
deeply every like we're turn technology is largely turning people into a
is largely turning people into a quantifiable data set. The views on this
quantifiable data set. The views on this aren't views like you listening you're a
aren't views like you listening you're a person.
person. Human pe persons are beautiful. You know
Human pe persons are beautiful. You know what's so crazy? Since I've been off a
what's so crazy? Since I've been off a lot of this world, I I will literally
lot of this world, I I will literally have moments I live my life in airports.
have moments I live my life in airports. It's the worst, right? And everyone's on
It's the worst, right? And everyone's on their phone, so no one looks at me. But
their phone, so no one looks at me. But when I make contact with some people,
when I make contact with some people, they literally get scared, right? It
they literally get scared, right? It happened the other day. I was flying
happened the other day. I was flying like someone just looked up and I looked
like someone just looked up and I looked and I smiled and like, you know, they
and I smiled and like, you know, they got like scared, right?
got like scared, right? >> It's true.
>> It's true. >> But people are amazing.
>> But people are amazing. >> Like every person you see is made in the
>> Like every person you see is made in the image and likeness of God. And one of
image and likeness of God. And one of the things I've noticed getting out of
the things I've noticed getting out of these platforms and these algorithms,
these platforms and these algorithms, you have to remember your algorithm is
you have to remember your algorithm is dictating the perception of your
dictating the perception of your reality, which is not likely true.
reality, which is not likely true. >> I say that again. I think that's such a
>> I say that again. I think that's such a good point.
good point. >> I don't know what I just said.
>> I don't know what I just said. >> Your algorithm is dictating the
>> Your algorithm is dictating the perception of your reality, which is
perception of your reality, which is likely not true.
likely not true. >> Yeah, that is a good line.
>> Yeah, that is a good line. >> It's a good line and it's so true.
>> It's a good line and it's so true. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> I mean, it's true that it's not true
>> I mean, it's true that it's not true what you see, what what what X feeds you
what you see, what what what X feeds you about what's wrong in the world or
about what's wrong in the world or what's what matters, what Instagram
what's what matters, what Instagram feeds you what's wrong in the world,
feeds you what's wrong in the world, what matters. really what any kind of
what matters. really what any kind of feed feeds you
feed feeds you >> is not really what's wrong in the world
>> is not really what's wrong in the world and what matters for you.
and what matters for you. >> Uh one of the main books even though it
>> Uh one of the main books even though it claims that it is
claims that it is >> 100% one of the main books that just
>> 100% one of the main books that just came out called Careless People by Sarah
came out called Careless People by Sarah Win Williams. She worked with Zuckerberg
Win Williams. She worked with Zuckerberg closely for 10 years. I highly recommend
closely for 10 years. I highly recommend that book. They're trying to ban it from
that book. They're trying to ban it from Amazon right now. It's her story. I'm
Amazon right now. It's her story. I'm really going through working with the
really going through working with the company. One of their main one of Meta's
company. One of their main one of Meta's main sayings was to move fast and break
main sayings was to move fast and break things. Sadly, I think they happen to
things. Sadly, I think they happen to break the human person
break the human person >> at a deep level. So, here I want people
>> at a deep level. So, here I want people to understand you're not just a number.
to understand you're not just a number. You're not just a view. You're not just
You're not just a view. You're not just a comment. You're not just a
a comment. You're not just a transaction. Like, every human person is
transaction. Like, every human person is so beautiful and amazing. And this is
so beautiful and amazing. And this is like what's so weird for me is like I'm
like what's so weird for me is like I'm out of the matrix. And I start to look
out of the matrix. And I start to look around and I just I like look at people.
around and I just I like look at people. I'm like, I love people.
I'm like, I love people. >> Like, I love people. People are so
>> Like, I love people. People are so interesting.
interesting. >> They really are
>> They really are >> and amazing and a gift.
>> and amazing and a gift. >> Every one of them.
>> Every one of them. >> Every one of them. And right now we're
>> Every one of them. And right now we're just turning all of us against each
just turning all of us against each other. The polarization happening in our
other. The polarization happening in our world is 100% due to our technology.
world is 100% due to our technology. There's no doubt about that. There's no
There's no doubt about that. There's no doubt about that. So, how do we help
doubt about that. So, how do we help people get into reality and actually
people get into reality and actually start to connect with themselves and
start to connect with themselves and nature and one another? I have so many
nature and one another? I have so many more stories and so many more things I
more stories and so many more things I want to say. There's one flight I was on
want to say. There's one flight I was on recently where a woman next to me, I'll
recently where a woman next to me, I'll never forget this. A huge point of what
never forget this. A huge point of what these technologies are not giving us is
these technologies are not giving us is getting to know ourselves. What's the
getting to know ourselves. What's the commandment that God gave us? love our
commandment that God gave us? love our neighbor as our self. If I'm being
neighbor as our self. If I'm being honest, that second one has been the
honest, that second one has been the most difficult my entire life. I have a
most difficult my entire life. I have a really hard time loving myself. That's
really hard time loving myself. That's been the hardest. I can love atheists
been the hardest. I can love atheists and gays and left and liberals. I I can
and gays and left and liberals. I I can love them all. I don't care.
love them all. I don't care. >> We can we're better at abusing
>> We can we're better at abusing ourselves.
ourselves. >> I that loving yourself thing is really
>> I that loving yourself thing is really hard. And one of the things I noticed is
hard. And one of the things I noticed is and if you look at a lot of the saints,
and if you look at a lot of the saints, they were huge about entering inwards
they were huge about entering inwards where they can encounter God. Christ in
where they can encounter God. Christ in us the hope of glory. Felicia Wu Song
us the hope of glory. Felicia Wu Song says in a book Restless Devices that
says in a book Restless Devices that with our technologies we're forever
with our technologies we're forever elsewhere. Oh my gosh, Joey ODM said
elsewhere. Oh my gosh, Joey ODM said this incredible quote. This is the first
this incredible quote. This is the first generation, I quote, "This is the first
generation, I quote, "This is the first generation, meaning millennials and Gen
generation, meaning millennials and Gen Z, that's going to have more memories of
Z, that's going to have more memories of other people's lives than their own."
other people's lives than their own." >> Think about that for a second. Think
>> Think about that for a second. Think about your scroll. You are looking at
about your scroll. You are looking at people's memories of moments of their
people's memories of moments of their lives. And guess what? You're missing
lives. And guess what? You're missing out on your own. This is the first
out on your own. This is the first generation that's going to have more
generation that's going to have more memories of other people's lives than
memories of other people's lives than their own. I want to get people's
their own. I want to get people's memories back into their own life with
memories back into their own life with real people that when they look at the
real people that when they look at the end on their deathbed, back at their
end on their deathbed, back at their life, they're not going to have those
life, they're not going to have those regrets, right?
regrets, right? >> So, give me the give me like the top 10
>> So, give me the give me like the top 10 tips. I mean, we you just 11 ways. Let's
tips. I mean, we you just 11 ways. Let's go through the 11 ways. You just taught
go through the 11 ways. You just taught me this thing.
me this thing. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> My screen just went
>> My screen just went >> I love that.
>> I love that. >> Gray. Okay. Great.
>> Gray. Okay. Great. >> So, here's what you just did. You
>> So, here's what you just did. You glances. You decreased your glances to
glances. You decreased your glances to your device by 47%. Your average
your device by 47%. Your average American is just glancing at the device
American is just glancing at the device 352 times a day to 2,000 times a day.
352 times a day to 2,000 times a day. That's almost every 2 minutes and 45
That's almost every 2 minutes and 45 seconds.
seconds. >> The graying itself decreases your
>> The graying itself decreases your glancing how much?
glancing how much? >> By 47% in that range.
>> By 47% in that range. >> That's great. Yeah. It's just like a
>> That's great. Yeah. It's just like a boring old paper now.
boring old paper now. >> You're almost going to cut that in half.
>> You're almost going to cut that in half. You know, it's funny and it's going to
You know, it's funny and it's going to be kind of funny for you. It's going to
be kind of funny for you. It's going to get kind of boring. I mean, you're not
get kind of boring. I mean, you're not going to be as as interested, right? So,
going to be as as interested, right? So, that's a huge part. So, in our digital
that's a huge part. So, in our digital plan of life, we start with a device. I
plan of life, we start with a device. I use a light phone. So, this is my cell
use a light phone. So, this is my cell phone.
phone. >> That's so cute.
>> That's so cute. >> So, this is a cute little phone. We give
>> So, this is a cute little phone. We give these out. The lightphone
these out. The lightphone lithelyphone.com.
>> This is a tool, right? So, I use this. >> We should have them. We should get them.
>> We should have them. We should get them. Are you Is that your company or is that
Are you Is that your company or is that >> No, we partner with them. We
>> No, we partner with them. We >> should partner with them on the show. I
>> should partner with them on the show. I love that. This is so cute. Can I see
love that. This is so cute. Can I see your phone?
your phone? >> You can. You can.
>> You can. You can. >> Okay. So, and like if you have a job
>> Okay. So, and like if you have a job like mine, which is a social media job,
like mine, which is a social media job, this might not work.
this might not work. >> So, you can still use that. Here's the
>> So, you can still use that. Here's the good news about that. This actually
good news about that. This actually started with a lot of executives using
started with a lot of executives using it on the weekend. So that's your
it on the weekend. So that's your superco computer for the week. On the
superco computer for the week. On the weekend, you want to be connected with
weekend, you want to be connected with just the people for emergency calls or
just the people for emergency calls or hey, you got to hit a text
hey, you got to hit a text >> or maybe I just you like cuz the reality
>> or maybe I just you like cuz the reality is I should only be working certain
is I should only be working certain hours a day cuz when I'm with my kids,
hours a day cuz when I'm with my kids, I'm supposed to not be on my phone. But
I'm supposed to not be on my phone. But there's some things that are like a
there's some things that are like a phone call I have to make to the doctor
phone call I have to make to the doctor or something like this. So it's still my
or something like this. So it's still my super computer. So I could have a second
super computer. So I could have a second phone that's personal and the work
phone that's personal and the work phone. You This is such a good idea,
phone. You This is such a good idea, right? So I have what? So hot.
right? So I have what? So hot. >> So you got a phone, you can text and
>> So you got a phone, you can text and call, you got an alarm clock, you got a
call, you got an alarm clock, you got a calculator, you got directions.
calculator, you got directions. >> How do I go back? Sorry, I
>> How do I go back? Sorry, I >> just press the side button. Uh that
>> just press the side button. Uh that middle one.
middle one. >> Okay. And then there's alarm. Great.
>> Okay. And then there's alarm. Great. >> There's alarm. You can download podcast.
>> There's alarm. You can download podcast. You can download music. It takes a
You can download music. It takes a little bit.
little bit. >> Can you listen on this? So it still
>> Can you listen on this? So it still makes sound
makes sound >> like like if you want.
>> like like if you want. >> I don't use it for that. I don't really
>> I don't use it for that. I don't really listen to much anymore,
listen to much anymore, >> but you could listen to podcast.
>> but you could listen to podcast. >> And then um you can download and is the
>> And then um you can download and is the camera. Can you put my podcast on here?
camera. Can you put my podcast on here? Um and then you can take pictures. Are
Um and then you can take pictures. Are the pictures as nice as the iPhone? Oh
the pictures as nice as the iPhone? Oh gosh, no. They're horrible. But they're
gosh, no. They're horrible. But they're kind of cool. They're so vintage.
kind of cool. They're so vintage. >> They are vintage. But what about my
>> They are vintage. But what about my kids?
kids? >> They're going to look really cool.
>> They're going to look really cool. >> I know. But like, can we have one of
>> I know. But like, can we have one of these with a nicer camera?
these with a nicer camera? >> Uh, they're probably building that.
>> Uh, they're probably building that. >> Okay,
>> Okay, >> here's one thing, too, with like the
>> here's one thing, too, with like the memory thing. So,
memory thing. So, >> all right. It is kind of a cool looking
>> all right. It is kind of a cool looking thing, but yeah. I mean, for all
thing, but yeah. I mean, for all >> starts incredible pictures I'm taking of
>> starts incredible pictures I'm taking of my kids. I mean, again, moms should not
my kids. I mean, again, moms should not be whipping out their phone every 10
be whipping out their phone every 10 minutes to take pictures of their kids,
minutes to take pictures of their kids, >> but if you take one pick a day, that's
>> but if you take one pick a day, that's not too bad.
not too bad. >> That's actually one of our challenges is
>> That's actually one of our challenges is photo fast. So, one pick a day, just not
photo fast. So, one pick a day, just not of yourself. That's a challenge, right?
of yourself. That's a challenge, right? >> It's good.
>> It's good. >> But here's the kind of fin.
>> But here's the kind of fin. >> The great way to do that, by the way, is
>> The great way to do that, by the way, is to have children.
to have children. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Before I got married, I was like I had
>> Before I got married, I was like I had to I did selfies regularly.
to I did selfies regularly. >> Post marriage, I've got the love of my
>> Post marriage, I've got the love of my life. I've got the cutest human beings.
life. I've got the cutest human beings. >> I'm not interested anymore taking
>> I'm not interested anymore taking pictures.
pictures. >> But you have to I mean that's even if
>> But you have to I mean that's even if you're single and you don't have kids,
you're single and you don't have kids, you should still lay off on the selfies
you should still lay off on the selfies as well.
as well. >> Well, so here's the funny thing. There's
>> Well, so here's the funny thing. There's actually quite a few studies that show
actually quite a few studies that show that memory consolidation through a
that memory consolidation through a screen is diminished. So, and I've now
screen is diminished. So, and I've now heard firsthand studies of of this as
heard firsthand studies of of this as well where young people told me one of
well where young people told me one of our clubs, Christendom, he went to
our clubs, Christendom, he went to Guatemala, took 500 plus pictures on his
Guatemala, took 500 plus pictures on his camera, literally came back, couldn't
camera, literally came back, couldn't remember his trip.
remember his trip. >> Wow.
>> Wow. >> Couldn't think of images back to memory.
>> Couldn't think of images back to memory. So, relying on the device.
So, relying on the device. >> So, literally what's happening right now
>> So, literally what's happening right now when you are taking pictures all day of
when you are taking pictures all day of your life, you're actually not
your life, you're actually not consolidating the memory properly and
consolidating the memory properly and you won't be able to recall it.
you won't be able to recall it. >> That is true about taking pictures of
>> That is true about taking pictures of kids though, too. And I actually am sort
kids though, too. And I actually am sort of proud of myself sometimes when I
of proud of myself sometimes when I don't take pics of my children for
don't take pics of my children for multiple days and then I get like a
multiple days and then I get like a little bit, oh, I didn't take, you know,
little bit, oh, I didn't take, you know, my daughter's so cute. I need pictures.
my daughter's so cute. I need pictures. Totally.
Totally. >> So, but if you're playing with your kids
>> So, but if you're playing with your kids or you're on an outing with your kids
or you're on an outing with your kids and it's all about the picture we're
and it's all about the picture we're going to take as a family because
going to take as a family because pictures are a little bit stressful to
pictures are a little bit stressful to take.
take. >> Well, and even just the idea is the
>> Well, and even just the idea is the picture is being
picture is being >> designed to be shared with others for a
>> designed to be shared with others for a quantifiable peer review.
quantifiable peer review. >> That's where this if they're designed
>> That's where this if they're designed for Instagram. Yeah. But it's a problem.
for Instagram. Yeah. But it's a problem. >> But this is like kind of everything.
>> But this is like kind of everything. people are go, you know, going places
people are go, you know, going places just to get the pick to share with
just to get the pick to share with people. And and to me, I've really,
people. And and to me, I've really, like, honestly, the last eight years of
like, honestly, the last eight years of just living my life and not capturing it
just living my life and not capturing it in a lot of ways, I still go in
in a lot of ways, I still go in pictures. I still take pictures. It's
pictures. I still take pictures. It's not like I don't take pictures,
not like I don't take pictures, >> but I'm but I'm mostly living my life
>> but I'm but I'm mostly living my life and not sharing it with others and
and not sharing it with others and sharing with people in the moment. I
sharing with people in the moment. I can't tell you how profound that's been
can't tell you how profound that's been in my life in a lot of different ways.
in my life in a lot of different ways. >> You feel happy?
>> You feel happy? >> Oh, well, way happier than I was before.
>> Oh, well, way happier than I was before. Happiness is a journey, right? Dr.
Happiness is a journey, right? Dr. Brooks talks about this. It's not a
Brooks talks about this. It's not a destination. come to studio. He'll be
destination. come to studio. He'll be here in a couple weeks. That would be
here in a couple weeks. That would be awesome.
awesome. >> Say hi.
>> Say hi. >> Yeah, that'd be great.
>> Yeah, that'd be great. >> Um, I have a quick question. Sorry, I
>> Um, I have a quick question. Sorry, I interrupted you. Were you were going to
interrupted you. Were you were going to say something else?
say something else? >> Uh, I have one story connected to
>> Uh, I have one story connected to getting to know yourself because we were
getting to know yourself because we were talking about that and then we got to
talking about that and then we got to get into the 11 ways.
get into the 11 ways. >> Well, yeah. And I was going to ask you
>> Well, yeah. And I was going to ask you about this. I How do I do um maps?
about this. I How do I do um maps? >> Yes. Directions.
>> Yes. Directions. >> So, you have it, but there's is there a
>> So, you have it, but there's is there a screen that shows a little line about
screen that shows a little line about where I'm driving?
where I'm driving? >> And there's also other So, this is one
>> And there's also other So, this is one device we use. So, this is part of our
device we use. So, this is part of our digital
digital >> plan of life. So, you first start with
>> plan of life. So, you first start with the device. So you have the light phone
the device. So you have the light phone or you have the wise phone 2 by Techlas.
or you have the wise phone 2 by Techlas. Techlas I'd say is the best company
Techlas I'd say is the best company making the best tool that's most
making the best tool that's most applicable to most people. So Techlas
applicable to most people. So Techlas has the Wise phone 2 that and we're
has the Wise phone 2 that and we're partner with them very deeply and some
partner with them very deeply and some really exciting stuff too. It's a
really exciting stuff too. It's a smartphone hardware. There's no internet
smartphone hardware. There's no internet but it has every app you need. It has
but it has every app you need. It has driving, banking, flying, all the stuff
driving, banking, flying, all the stuff you need without a browser. So it's a
you need without a browser. So it's a 99.99%
99.99% pornfree device. No social media, no
pornfree device. No social media, no gaming, no nothing. Just the essential
gaming, no nothing. Just the essential tools. That's probably the best choice
tools. That's probably the best choice for most people.
for most people. >> Texting,
>> Texting, >> texting, everything. Good. Email,
>> texting, everything. Good. Email, calendar, great.
calendar, great. >> All the good stuff. All of what you need
>> All the good stuff. All of what you need as a tool without the distraction.
as a tool without the distraction. >> And then, you know, when you need to do
>> And then, you know, when you need to do your social stuff, you have another
your social stuff, you have another platform, right? Atomic Habits.
platform, right? Atomic Habits. >> You have friction, right? That little
>> You have friction, right? That little bit of friction, that inconvenience. We
bit of friction, that inconvenience. We need way more inconvenience in our life.
need way more inconvenience in our life. >> I'm totally buying one of these phones.
>> I'm totally buying one of these phones. >> Yeah, you're gonna love it. Yeah,
>> Yeah, you're gonna love it. Yeah, >> we'll hook you up. We give you
>> we'll hook you up. We give you >> My husband will love it, too. My husband
>> My husband will love it, too. My husband has the old school alarm clock by his
has the old school alarm clock by his bed.
bed. >> I love that. That's one of our
>> I love that. That's one of our challenges. Yeah, cuz the main excuse
challenges. Yeah, cuz the main excuse is, well, I need my phone for my alarm
is, well, I need my phone for my alarm clock. It's like, Laya, we did not talk
clock. It's like, Laya, we did not talk about this yet, but I'm pretty deep in
about this yet, but I'm pretty deep in the health and wellness space. So, even
the health and wellness space. So, even just regarding the phone, 5G, EMF,
just regarding the phone, 5G, EMF, electromagnetic fields. We have a whole
electromagnetic fields. We have a whole episode on that. And in 2011, the WHO
episode on that. And in 2011, the WHO came out and said that the radiation
came out and said that the radiation from your device is a class 2B
from your device is a class 2B carcinogen along with lead gasoline. So
carcinogen along with lead gasoline. So the phone being on the ear, on the body
the phone being on the ear, on the body at all times is literally affecting our
at all times is literally affecting our biology. It's a carcinogen. There's a
biology. It's a carcinogen. There's a explosion of cancers particularly on the
explosion of cancers particularly on the head that are happening around the world
head that are happening around the world from our phones being attached to our
from our phones being attached to our heads.
heads. >> I noticed that the rate of an increase
>> I noticed that the rate of an increase in brain cancer. Anecdotally, I know a
in brain cancer. Anecdotally, I know a family, they had two family members die
family, they had two family members die of brain cancer. It didn't run in the
of brain cancer. It didn't run in the family inexplicably in like a 24-month
family inexplicably in like a 24-month period. This is like a family that I
period. This is like a family that I grew up with.
grew up with. >> Yeah. you know, brain tumors, brain
>> Yeah. you know, brain tumors, brain cancer. Another girl, I mean, Trent
cancer. Another girl, I mean, Trent Horn's wife has suffered a brain tumor
Horn's wife has suffered a brain tumor recently. I know another family that
recently. I know another family that we're familiar with, their son just
we're familiar with, their son just died. I mean, it's like everyone's
died. I mean, it's like everyone's getting brain tumors.
getting brain tumors. >> So, your Wi-Fi, your 5G, your cell
>> So, your Wi-Fi, your 5G, your cell phones, all of this is an
phones, all of this is an electromagnetic field that our biology
electromagnetic field that our biology has never experienced in our history.
has never experienced in our history. >> But that's Wi-Fi in the room you're in,
>> But that's Wi-Fi in the room you're in, right?
right? >> In the room from cell towers. We have a
>> In the room from cell towers. We have a whole section on how this is affecting
whole section on how this is affecting us biologically, largely increasing
us biologically, largely increasing inflammation, chronic disease. It's
inflammation, chronic disease. It's releasing this calcium into our cell
releasing this calcium into our cell through this ion vulgated channel in our
through this ion vulgated channel in our in our mitochondria. There is an
in our mitochondria. There is an incredible amount of data that the FCC
incredible amount of data that the FCC and telecommunication companies are
and telecommunication companies are shutting down because there's scientists
shutting down because there's scientists from all around the world that are
from all around the world that are sounding the alarm that we are living in
sounding the alarm that we are living in a spectrum of energy that our body was
a spectrum of energy that our body was not designed to experience.
not designed to experience. >> But you're saying it's worse when the
>> But you're saying it's worse when the phone is closed. Just a general like
phone is closed. Just a general like >> I'm always on speaker phone. You'll
>> I'm always on speaker phone. You'll never see this thing on my ear. I have a
never see this thing on my ear. I have a little attachment that that's a
little attachment that that's a hardwired. I do not use Bluetooth in my
hardwired. I do not use Bluetooth in my ear ever.
ear ever. >> So, no earpods?
>> So, no earpods? >> Nope. So, here's the thing. They all
>> Nope. So, here's the thing. They all say, "Well, it's not thermal." This is
say, "Well, it's not thermal." This is all the studies they say. Well, it's
all the studies they say. Well, it's creating no thermal effect. It's
creating no thermal effect. It's creating so much damage to our biology.
creating so much damage to our biology. Just because there's no thermal effect
Just because there's no thermal effect doesn't mean there's no effect. Right?
doesn't mean there's no effect. Right? So, we have a whole episode on EMF. We
So, we have a whole episode on EMF. We won't get into that now. Let's get into
won't get into that now. Let's get into solutions.
solutions. >> Yes. I We could go down that rabbit.
>> Yes. I We could go down that rabbit. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Let's start with be light. That's one of
>> Let's start with be light. That's one of my favorite ones. I love the science of
my favorite ones. I love the science of light. I'm a light nerd. Okay. Okay, so
light. I'm a light nerd. Okay. Okay, so I love sunlight. I love light. I got
I love sunlight. I love light. I got fascinated with light over the years. We
fascinated with light over the years. We are living in a biological mismatch on
are living in a biological mismatch on many different fronts that's affecting
many different fronts that's affecting our physiology, right? Which is part of
our physiology, right? Which is part of our obesity epidemic, part of our mental
our obesity epidemic, part of our mental health crisis. So in Genesis, right,
health crisis. So in Genesis, right, what happens in the beginning? God
what happens in the beginning? God separates light from dark. We talked
separates light from dark. We talked about this a little bit earlier. So we
about this a little bit earlier. So we are living in what's called now like
are living in what's called now like nighttime days and daytime nights. So
nighttime days and daytime nights. So our our biology was was was designed to
our our biology was was was designed to evolve with the sun. The sun is not
evolve with the sun. The sun is not going to kill you. Just to give you a
going to kill you. Just to give you a perspective, there's about 3 million
perspective, there's about 3 million people that die a year, give or take in
people that die a year, give or take in the US. There's about 12,000 people that
the US. There's about 12,000 people that die of skin cancers. It doesn't even hit
die of skin cancers. It doesn't even hit top 10 of the top killers, right?
top 10 of the top killers, right? There's a southern Swedish study that
There's a southern Swedish study that was done that literally interviewed
was done that literally interviewed thousands of women um and showed that
thousands of women um and showed that actually the more time, bless you, the
actually the more time, bless you, the more time uh it interviewed multiple
more time uh it interviewed multiple different women, women that were indoors
different women, women that were indoors all day and women that were outdoors
all day and women that were outdoors smoking cigarettes, literally they had
smoking cigarettes, literally they had the same risk of all cause mortality. So
the same risk of all cause mortality. So you being inside all day was literally
you being inside all day was literally the same as poke smoking a pack of
the same as poke smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. So your disconnection
cigarettes a day. So your disconnection from the sunlight, it's not just vitamin
from the sunlight, it's not just vitamin D. The sunlight actually releases
D. The sunlight actually releases melatonin in the cell's intracellular
melatonin in the cell's intracellular melatonin. So melatonin is not just the
melatonin. So melatonin is not just the sleep hormone. It's the prime
sleep hormone. It's the prime antioxidant of the body. Our separation
antioxidant of the body. Our separation from sunlight all day, particularly at
from sunlight all day, particularly at the morning and evening hours, is
the morning and evening hours, is creating an incredible amount of harm in
creating an incredible amount of harm in our biology. We are designed, we are
our biology. We are designed, we are evolved to be in the light. Now, does
evolved to be in the light. Now, does that mean you go out and get sunburned?
that mean you go out and get sunburned? No. This is like the distinction, right?
No. This is like the distinction, right? But there's a lot of data that's showing
But there's a lot of data that's showing we are living in a mismatch biologically
we are living in a mismatch biologically with light. Now your average child,
with light. Now your average child, teenager and adult is losing about 30
teenager and adult is losing about 30 minutes of sleep at night due to blue
minutes of sleep at night due to blue light from the screen. So what's blue
light from the screen. So what's blue light doing? Your eye is not just for
light doing? Your eye is not just for sight. It's a clock. It connects to the
sight. It's a clock. It connects to the pituitary gland and the hypothalamus
pituitary gland and the hypothalamus which is connected to the super
which is connected to the super kaismatic nucleus, right? The master
kaismatic nucleus, right? The master circadian clock of the body. Light
circadian clock of the body. Light literally dictates and tells every phys
literally dictates and tells every phys physiological process in the body what
physiological process in the body what time of the day it is. Right? So, if you
time of the day it is. Right? So, if you listen to Andrew Huberman or any of
listen to Andrew Huberman or any of these health guys, light in the morning
these health guys, light in the morning is incredibly crucial to start your day.
is incredibly crucial to start your day. We had some students actually recently
We had some students actually recently in high schools that are going through
in high schools that are going through our program, they're like, "I just start
our program, they're like, "I just start my day and I'd scroll all day and I had
my day and I'd scroll all day and I had a headache." And this girl just started
a headache." And this girl just started going and getting sunlight in the
going and getting sunlight in the morning. All of her headaches went away.
morning. All of her headaches went away. She stopped scrolling and like feels way
She stopped scrolling and like feels way better just from her light environment.
better just from her light environment. So, we're living in in a biological
So, we're living in in a biological mismatch from our light environments,
mismatch from our light environments, right? Our days we're indoors. We're
right? Our days we're indoors. We're getting less than a 100 to like a
getting less than a 100 to like a thousand lux. Lux is just a measurement
thousand lux. Lux is just a measurement of light. And then in the evenings, we
of light. And then in the evenings, we have all these fluorescent lights on
have all these fluorescent lights on which our biology was never designed to
which our biology was never designed to see. We never saw anything over 60 lux
see. We never saw anything over 60 lux at night. We only saw candle light or
at night. We only saw candle light or fires, right? Which is a deep infrared
fires, right? Which is a deep infrared frequency that we don't get anymore. So
frequency that we don't get anymore. So literally our first episode on be light
literally our first episode on be light breaks down the science of our screens
breaks down the science of our screens in the evenings and our mismatch from
in the evenings and our mismatch from sunlight and how to get back into the
sunlight and how to get back into the light.
light. >> So when you say there's an episode on
>> So when you say there's an episode on this, there's a podcast series.
this, there's a podcast series. >> So it's an 11-part video series of me
>> So it's an 11-part video series of me interviewing MD, PhDs, psychologist
interviewing MD, PhDs, psychologist >> and that's all on the website
>> and that's all on the website humanity.org.
humanity.org. >> This is when you take the course. Yep.
>> This is when you take the course. Yep. >> Oh, is that a course you can take
>> Oh, is that a course you can take online?
online? >> Yeah, anyone can do it. It's an 11 ways
>> Yeah, anyone can do it. It's an 11 ways to be human. You go through that.
to be human. You go through that. >> So this sounds great. I mean basically
>> So this sounds great. I mean basically it's I mean it's probably connected to
it's I mean it's probably connected to the next one. Be outside. It's like the
the next one. Be outside. It's like the touch grass. I mean that's really in a
touch grass. I mean that's really in a nutshell.
nutshell. >> I mean and the ground. Yeah. Grounding.
>> I mean and the ground. Yeah. Grounding. Yes. Get outside. You know this is the
Yes. Get outside. You know this is the sunshine on you.
sunshine on you. >> Well nature has an incredible healing
>> Well nature has an incredible healing modality. So and there's a lot of
modality. So and there's a lot of literature too that talks about this uh
literature too that talks about this uh and uh Nicholas Carr talks about this.
and uh Nicholas Carr talks about this. Michael Easter talks about this.
Michael Easter talks about this. Literally just putting more green in
Literally just putting more green in your environment will decrease cortisol.
your environment will decrease cortisol. >> The color green or plants?
>> The color green or plants? >> The color green. Literally plants in
>> The color green. Literally plants in your environment.
your environment. >> It's my favorite color. It's a great
>> It's my favorite color. It's a great one.
one. >> Well, so this is great. So St. Hildigard
>> Well, so this is great. So St. Hildigard of Bijon. Does that name ring a bell?
of Bijon. Does that name ring a bell? 12th century mystic nun. This woman, I
12th century mystic nun. This woman, I don't know if I'm allowed to say this,
don't know if I'm allowed to say this, but she was a badass. Okay, so she was a
but she was a badass. Okay, so she was a mystic. She consulted kings and queens.
mystic. She consulted kings and queens. She was an herbalist, a nutritionist.
She was an herbalist, a nutritionist. This woman was talking about like
This woman was talking about like intermittent fasting in the 12th
intermittent fasting in the 12th century. Okay. And saunas. Okay. I love
century. Okay. And saunas. Okay. I love her. I kind of
her. I kind of >> Did she do saunas? She's a nun.
>> Did she do saunas? She's a nun. >> Oh. Oh, yeah. And And
>> Oh. Oh, yeah. And And >> how did you do a sauna in the
>> how did you do a sauna in the >> Probably a different modality then, but
>> Probably a different modality then, but some type of heat therapy.
some type of heat therapy. >> And she also wrote an incredible amount
>> And she also wrote an incredible amount of music. So like I'm trying to be like
of music. So like I'm trying to be like the dude version of her to be honest.
the dude version of her to be honest. Just maybe with
Just maybe with >> St. Hildigard
>> St. Hildigard >> like with wife and lots of babies.
>> like with wife and lots of babies. >> Oh, actually I I am a little familiar
>> Oh, actually I I am a little familiar with her the herbalist. Yeah. Yes.
with her the herbalist. Yeah. Yes. >> But I I wasn't familiar with her uh
>> But I I wasn't familiar with her uh having the her favorite color.
having the her favorite color. >> So she talked about the energy of
>> So she talked about the energy of greenness. So she called this virtos.
greenness. So she called this virtos. I'm going to say that wrong. It's a
I'm going to say that wrong. It's a Latin word for the healing energy of
Latin word for the healing energy of greenness.
greenness. >> Sounds super woo woo. It's not. It's
>> Sounds super woo woo. It's not. It's Catholic. And guess what? She's a doctor
Catholic. And guess what? She's a doctor of the church. Holler. Okay. So nature
of the church. Holler. Okay. So nature in our environment is incredibly
in our environment is incredibly important. Now with most of our time
important. Now with most of our time being spent indoors and think of cities
being spent indoors and think of cities actually cities your most your most
actually cities your most your most densely populated cities have the lowest
densely populated cities have the lowest happiness. Now Michaela talks about this
happiness. Now Michaela talks about this these complex fractals in nature
these complex fractals in nature actually decreases cortisol in the body.
actually decreases cortisol in the body. So when you go on a 15-minute nature
So when you go on a 15-minute nature hike it it does incredible physiological
hike it it does incredible physiological benefit to you. just 15-minute walk a
benefit to you. just 15-minute walk a day outside in nature is is going to do
day outside in nature is is going to do so much, you know, help with your
so much, you know, help with your cardiovascular health, lower
cardiovascular health, lower inflammation, you know, decrease stress.
inflammation, you know, decrease stress. Just I'm like a huge walker, so I try
Just I'm like a huge walker, so I try and walk on calls. I try and walk and
and walk on calls. I try and walk and work as much as I can. And that's
work as much as I can. And that's actually a benefit of the good of
actually a benefit of the good of technology, right? So being outside, we
technology, right? So being outside, we have to start getting outside more and
have to start getting outside more and stop this whole weird thing of being
stop this whole weird thing of being afraid from the sun. Now, while I know
afraid from the sun. Now, while I know you know, and I probably know people
you know, and I probably know people that are having skin cancer and
that are having skin cancer and different things, you have greater risk
different things, you have greater risk greater risk of death. You have greater
greater risk of death. You have greater risk of death, the more you avoid the
risk of death, the more you avoid the sun. That's actually what the data
sun. That's actually what the data points to. The more you avoid the sun,
points to. The more you avoid the sun, the shorter you're going to live. Now,
the shorter you're going to live. Now, listen, you're going to get a little
listen, you're going to get a little more wrinkly, you know, which I realize
more wrinkly, you know, which I realize isn't cool for our modern age. I'm going
isn't cool for our modern age. I'm going to be old and really wrinkly and really
to be old and really wrinkly and really healthy is my hope, you know. So, being
healthy is my hope, you know. So, being outside is huge. What else do you want
outside is huge. What else do you want to hit?
to hit? >> Um, well, what you said about the towns
>> Um, well, what you said about the towns or the excuse me, the densely populated
or the excuse me, the densely populated cities and the low there's lowest
cities and the low there's lowest happiness in the densely populated
happiness in the densely populated cities and you're saying it's because of
cities and you're saying it's because of a lack of access to nature.
a lack of access to nature. because more people
because more people like the way that they built towns in
like the way that they built towns in Italy, you know, hundreds of years ago,
Italy, you know, hundreds of years ago, they were densely populated. You did
they were densely populated. You did have a lot of people living close to
have a lot of people living close to each other, but the town itself wasn't
each other, but the town itself wasn't so big that you couldn't like venture
so big that you couldn't like venture out into nature.
out into nature. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> And I think that's the difference. It's
>> And I think that's the difference. It's like densely populated, small groups of
like densely populated, small groups of people.
people. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Um, you know, the the the smallest
>> Um, you know, the the the smallest version of that would be like the family
version of that would be like the family home where hopefully there's a ton of
home where hopefully there's a ton of kids and, you know, grandparents are
kids and, you know, grandparents are living there too or whatever. But then
living there too or whatever. But then you have quick and easy access and
you have quick and easy access and regular access to nature.
regular access to nature. >> Yeah, here's some of those quick stats.
>> Yeah, here's some of those quick stats. 5 hours monthly in semi- wild nature is
5 hours monthly in semi- wild nature is optimal for mental health. 15 minutes in
optimal for mental health. 15 minutes in nature. Yeah. Drops blood pressure,
nature. Yeah. Drops blood pressure, heart rate, stress hormones. Um having
heart rate, stress hormones. Um having plants in the office increases
plants in the office increases productivity by 15%.
productivity by 15%. >> Real. Yeah,
>> Real. Yeah, >> they have to be real. Harris, we got to
>> they have to be real. Harris, we got to we got to get the real plants. We have
we got to get the real plants. We have the fake olive tree in here.
the fake olive tree in here. >> This is wild. We don't like think about
>> This is wild. We don't like think about this, but we're living in noise decibb
this, but we're living in noise decibb cities that are actually,
cities that are actually, >> you know, I had a vision of having like
>> you know, I had a vision of having like potted plants in my studio, like real.
potted plants in my studio, like real. >> Just let's let's just go full jungle, I
>> Just let's let's just go full jungle, I think, in here.
think, in here. >> I actually like that idea. We'll work on
>> I actually like that idea. We'll work on this next time.
this next time. >> I know it needs a little work. And the
>> I know it needs a little work. And the green I the thing is they say don't put
green I the thing is they say don't put green in your set because green does not
green in your set because green does not translate well on camera.
translate well on camera. >> Well, I don't know who they are, but we
>> Well, I don't know who they are, but we can tell them about Yo, St. Hildigard's
can tell them about Yo, St. Hildigard's got this.
got this. >> By the way, I didn't Sorry, I'm being
>> By the way, I didn't Sorry, I'm being very ADHD with you right now.
very ADHD with you right now. >> I'm ADHD. This is great. Uh, Pope
>> I'm ADHD. This is great. Uh, Pope Benedict declared St. Hildigard a doctor
Benedict declared St. Hildigard a doctor of the church in 2020 2012.
of the church in 2020 2012. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> I have not studied her life.
>> I have not studied her life. >> So, you're convicting me of learning
>> So, you're convicting me of learning more about her. I mean, I'm a big fan of
more about her. I mean, I'm a big fan of Sienna, St. Cather, St. Cath, Avila, St.
Sienna, St. Cather, St. Cath, Avila, St. Jose, these other doctors,
Jose, these other doctors, >> but she's like a not very well-known
>> but she's like a not very well-known doctor today.
doctor today. >> Oh,
>> Oh, >> and she sounds amazing and especially
>> and she sounds amazing and especially like a saint for the time. So, thank you
like a saint for the time. So, thank you for introducing her
for introducing her >> because one of her books, she has a
>> because one of her books, she has a whole book on nutrition, a whole book on
whole book on nutrition, a whole book on healing on earth. I mean, absolutely
healing on earth. I mean, absolutely incredible stuff. Some stuff's outdated,
incredible stuff. Some stuff's outdated, but there's Hildergard healing centers
but there's Hildergard healing centers all over the world actually of secular
all over the world actually of secular people using her prescriptions.
people using her prescriptions. >> Amazing.
>> Amazing. >> One other fun thing with cities and
>> One other fun thing with cities and whatnot actually noise contributes to
whatnot actually noise contributes to heart disease uh raises anxiety and
heart disease uh raises anxiety and we're actually living in like unhuman
we're actually living in like unhuman decibb of noise. So actually noise has
decibb of noise. So actually noise has physiological effects
physiological effects >> on the human person. So anyway, our
>> on the human person. So anyway, our whole outside topic is all again this is
whole outside topic is all again this is all technology. Technology has conquered
all technology. Technology has conquered the outdoors. We've conquered nature
the outdoors. We've conquered nature action away that's killing us. So again,
action away that's killing us. So again, this is this weird finding good
this is this weird finding good stressors in your life physiologically.
stressors in your life physiologically. How does muscle grow? You have to lift
How does muscle grow? You have to lift heavy things. You have to tear muscle to
heavy things. You have to tear muscle to build it. How do you get healthier? It's
build it. How do you get healthier? It's actually not sitting all day. You have
actually not sitting all day. You have to move. Right. Again, these are
to move. Right. Again, these are trade-offs of sitting all day. We're
trade-offs of sitting all day. We're living in a Wall-E world. So, I don't
living in a Wall-E world. So, I don't know if you've ever seen the movie
know if you've ever seen the movie Wall-E.
Wall-E. >> Oh, yeah. I thought about that earlier
>> Oh, yeah. I thought about that earlier when you're living in Wall-E. It's now
when you're living in Wall-E. It's now >> obesity and those little
>> obesity and those little >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> chubby guys, right?
>> chubby guys, right? >> Yeah. 70% of our population is obese.
>> Yeah. 70% of our population is obese. Six out of
Six out of >> the movie with the scene where they're
>> the movie with the scene where they're all fat and they're like Yeah.
all fat and they're like Yeah. >> We're living in that now. But again,
>> We're living in that now. But again, this is an effect. This is a trade-off
this is an effect. This is a trade-off technology. While you can hit the button
technology. While you can hit the button that gets you Uber Eats and brings you
that gets you Uber Eats and brings you food to your door. For maybe you and me,
food to your door. For maybe you and me, that's not as detrimental. There's
that's not as detrimental. There's people that are really struggling with
people that are really struggling with their weight, that that's a really bad
their weight, that that's a really bad technology for them. Again, convenience
technology for them. Again, convenience is a killer. So, you have to realize in
is a killer. So, you have to realize in your life right now, what conveniences
your life right now, what conveniences are you going to say no to to help get
are you going to say no to to help get your time, attention, and your health
your time, attention, and your health back? Because again, even just the light
back? Because again, even just the light at night is suppressing melatonin by
at night is suppressing melatonin by over 80%. Just fluorescent lighting in
over 80%. Just fluorescent lighting in the evening is suppressing one of the
the evening is suppressing one of the most important antioxidants in the body,
most important antioxidants in the body, melatonin, in your day-to-day. And all
melatonin, in your day-to-day. And all these things are connected, right? The
these things are connected, right? The amount of time you're moving outside,
amount of time you're moving outside, your light environment, your social
your light environment, your social connection. Again, remember
connection. Again, remember kind of to answer your beginning point
kind of to answer your beginning point of like, well, what about the good that
of like, well, what about the good that can be done in this? You have to take
can be done in this? You have to take into account what it's doing to your
into account what it's doing to your average person, right? So, your average
average person, right? So, your average person again, while they're scrolling
person again, while they're scrolling and and getting lost doom scrolling,
and and getting lost doom scrolling, they're probably not connecting with
they're probably not connecting with people. They're probably not moving.
people. They're probably not moving. When you're actually on technology and
When you're actually on technology and TV, you eat 30% more calories.
TV, you eat 30% more calories. Uh they're probably not getting proper
Uh they're probably not getting proper sunlight and movement. It's like we have
sunlight and movement. It's like we have to kind of look at I think at a macro
to kind of look at I think at a macro level per person and I'd say for most
level per person and I'd say for most people they're going to do better with
people they're going to do better with limiting their technology on almost
limiting their technology on almost every platform.
every platform. >> So very compelling. You're we we're
>> So very compelling. You're we we're talking about be light. We're talking
talking about be light. We're talking about be outside.
about be outside. >> Hit me with some other ones.
>> Hit me with some other ones. >> Um another one is be free on here. Does
>> Um another one is be free on here. Does that have to do with not consuming
that have to do with not consuming entertainment?
entertainment? >> No. And I'm not against entertainment,
>> No. And I'm not against entertainment, right? Like I go and watch movies at
right? Like I go and watch movies at movie theaters and I'll watch a Netflix
movie theaters and I'll watch a Netflix movie with a friend or uh I'll watch a
movie with a friend or uh I'll watch a football game. Um I don't own a TV and
football game. Um I don't own a TV and at my cabin in Wyoming I have no cell
at my cabin in Wyoming I have no cell reception. So
reception. So >> but surely there is a you would
>> but surely there is a you would recommend
recommend >> yes
>> yes >> at Humanity that you limit the amount of
>> at Humanity that you limit the amount of time you're consuming media content
time you're consuming media content >> 100%. And that's going to look different
>> 100%. And that's going to look different for everybody, which is why that's hard
for everybody, which is why that's hard to make a prescription. But
to make a prescription. But >> in general,
>> in general, >> yeah, the the more you can limit that to
>> yeah, the the more you can limit that to more meaningful interactions, the
more meaningful interactions, the better. That might be reading a book,
better. That might be reading a book, that might be calling a friend, that
that might be calling a friend, that might be FaceTiming a friend, right?
might be FaceTiming a friend, right? >> Maybe learning from a podcast that you
>> Maybe learning from a podcast that you that you really implement. Like my hope
that you really implement. Like my hope actually people listening to this is
actually people listening to this is that you go and do something after. And
that you go and do something after. And I actually really encourage most of
I actually really encourage most of these shows I go on for people to have a
these shows I go on for people to have a pen and write down.
pen and write down. >> We should have started with that. I know
>> We should have started with that. I know I can say that in the intro. So, so
I can say that in the intro. So, so sorry. What is be free then? So Be Free
sorry. What is be free then? So Be Free is actually all in the addiction science
is actually all in the addiction science part which which we hit a little bit
part which which we hit a little bit about. So the the founding tech
about. So the the founding tech founders, their intentions, how you're
founders, their intentions, how you're being addicted. It goes into all the
being addicted. It goes into all the addiction science what we just touched
addiction science what we just touched on, but that whole episode is on how
on, but that whole episode is on how they're addicting you on purpose and
they're addicting you on purpose and what you can do to be free. And this is
what you can do to be free. And this is what young people I find really
what young people I find really fascinating. They don't like they don't
fascinating. They don't like they don't like when they find out they're being
like when they find out they're being used. All social media platforms make
used. All social media platforms make money by advertisements. So literally
money by advertisements. So literally the camera is looking at your eyeballs
the camera is looking at your eyeballs on how long you scroll on each uh feed.
on how long you scroll on each uh feed. Everything that you do on every social
Everything that you do on every social media platform is being harvested and
media platform is being harvested and sold to the highest bidder. Google has
sold to the highest bidder. Google has over 3 million data points of each
over 3 million data points of each person on the planet. 3 million. So you
person on the planet. 3 million. So you have to understand that these apps
have to understand that these apps aren't free. These algorithms are
aren't free. These algorithms are purposely
purposely engaging you to spend more time on
engaging you to spend more time on platform to get you money. Uh James or
platform to get you money. Uh James or not Jared Laneer wrote a book called 10
not Jared Laneer wrote a book called 10 reasons to delete your social media. He
reasons to delete your social media. He goes into these bummer principles that
goes into these bummer principles that he talks about. But essentially your
he talks about. But essentially your attention is is rented. It's being sold
attention is is rented. It's being sold to the highest bidder.
to the highest bidder. >> So I'm amazed at these young people,
>> So I'm amazed at these young people, they don't like being used and they
they don't like being used and they don't like to find out that they're
don't like to find out that they're being used for these guys' money. Your
being used for these guys' money. Your digital exhaust is making these people a
digital exhaust is making these people a lot of money. Oh yeah.
lot of money. Oh yeah. >> And sadly they aren't concerned with
>> And sadly they aren't concerned with your health. All right, last stat with
your health. All right, last stat with this 2021 Francis Hogan whistleblower
this 2021 Francis Hogan whistleblower came out and showed that actually meta
came out and showed that actually meta knows from internal documents that their
knows from internal documents that their algorithms were increasing self harm,
algorithms were increasing self harm, suicidality, body image issues amongst
suicidality, body image issues amongst young girls and they were asked to
young girls and they were asked to change.
change. >> And they said no
>> And they said no >> because they didn't want to decrease
>> because they didn't want to decrease engagement.
engagement. >> I remember that. I find that incredibly
>> I remember that. I find that incredibly evil to know that your product
evil to know that your product >> is destroying lives and you willingly
>> is destroying lives and you willingly >> you willingly
>> you willingly heightening the algorithm. You know,
heightening the algorithm. You know, >> it's an unethical business. So, so be
>> it's an unethical business. So, so be free then is what are the top few tools
free then is what are the top few tools under be free? I mean, we mentioned
under be free? I mean, we mentioned Covenant Eyes as an example to protect
Covenant Eyes as an example to protect you from pornography.
you from pornography. >> There's this like not a smartphone, the
>> There's this like not a smartphone, the dumb phone which I love.
dumb phone which I love. >> That's a smarter phone actually.
>> That's a smarter phone actually. >> Oh, smart. I like that. Smarter, even
>> Oh, smart. I like that. Smarter, even smarter phone than the dumb smartphone.
smarter phone than the dumb smartphone. >> Anyways, are there other tools you
>> Anyways, are there other tools you recommend for
recommend for >> Bree? Yeah, a lot of Bree, we we help
>> Bree? Yeah, a lot of Bree, we we help you understand the science of how this
you understand the science of how this is affecting your brain. And then the
is affecting your brain. And then the whole point is each episode uh leans
whole point is each episode uh leans into these real life victories that we
into these real life victories that we invite students into and then community
invite students into and then community adventures. So, there's actual practical
adventures. So, there's actual practical habits that we help you build out along
habits that we help you build out along the process.
the process. >> So, that week you'll watch an episode
>> So, that week you'll watch an episode and then you have a real life victory to
and then you have a real life victory to choose from. There's six different ones
choose from. There's six different ones and you can uh actually this might be
and you can uh actually this might be fun. Can I have the water bottle in the
fun. Can I have the water bottle in the >> real life victory from a certain social
>> real life victory from a certain social media?
media? >> Yeah. Some type of habit that you're
>> Yeah. Some type of habit that you're going to help change. So
going to help change. So >> like an in bad Instagram habit. Is that
>> like an in bad Instagram habit. Is that what we're talking about?
what we're talking about? >> Anything regarding your technology. So
>> Anything regarding your technology. So you get the humanity water bottle and
you get the humanity water bottle and then you have all these challenges. I'll
then you have all these challenges. I'll let you look at them. But for some of
let you look at them. But for some of these stickers,
these stickers, >> these are stickers. So you take on the
>> these are stickers. So you take on the challenge, you achieve the sticker.
challenge, you achieve the sticker. >> So one of them that week is mindful
>> So one of them that week is mindful meals,
meals, >> right? So you watch be free. That week
>> right? So you watch be free. That week your challenge is to not scroll while
your challenge is to not scroll while you eat meals. Be present to your food.
you eat meals. Be present to your food. Right? There's only about 30
Right? There's only about 30 >> or the people you're eating your food or
>> or the people you're eating your food or >> the people you're eating your food with.
>> the people you're eating your food with. There's only about 30% of families that
There's only about 30% of families that are eating meals together.
are eating meals together. >> Is this the foodie one?
>> Is this the foodie one? >> Mindful meals. Foodie one. That's a
>> Mindful meals. Foodie one. That's a community adventure. So you and friends
community adventure. So you and friends together learn and cook. Mindful meals.
together learn and cook. Mindful meals. Okay.
Okay. >> Yeah. So
>> Yeah. So >> So when you So when you do the challenge
>> So when you So when you do the challenge and you do a full week of it, then you
and you do a full week of it, then you get to put the sticker on your water
get to put the sticker on your water bottle.
bottle. >> Boom. And you And that's a challenge.
>> Boom. And you And that's a challenge. That's really hard to eat a meal and
That's really hard to eat a meal and like not look at your phone.
like not look at your phone. >> So you you win the challenge. This is
>> So you you win the challenge. This is hard.
hard. Oh, there's like little places on the
Oh, there's like little places on the water bottle for it. This is fun.
water bottle for it. This is fun. >> Yeah, we're trying to make these things
>> Yeah, we're trying to make these things fun because it's actually fun.
fun because it's actually fun. >> Yeah, gify it a little bit.
>> Yeah, gify it a little bit. >> It's fun to gamify a little bit and it's
>> It's fun to gamify a little bit and it's fun to feel better.
fun to feel better. >> This is a plastic water bottle, though.
>> This is a plastic water bottle, though. >> I know this. Well, it's BPA free. Oh,
>> I know this. Well, it's BPA free. Oh, >> okay. All right.
>> okay. All right. >> We want to get to no plastic, but we're
>> We want to get to no plastic, but we're not there yet. Yeah.
not there yet. Yeah. >> Um I love this. Okay. And there's so
>> Um I love this. Okay. And there's so many on here. Photo fast. No selfies, no
many on here. Photo fast. No selfies, no pictures in general.
pictures in general. >> One one picture a day.
>> One one picture a day. >> Focus fitness. Um
>> Focus fitness. Um >> so that's working out with no screen.
>> so that's working out with no screen. Just no music. Literally just go and
Just no music. Literally just go and work out and be present to your workout.
work out and be present to your workout. >> Love it. Spiritual. Pray 10 minutes at
>> Love it. Spiritual. Pray 10 minutes at least. Go to
least. Go to >> prayer without the phone essentially,
>> prayer without the phone essentially, which we also love.
which we also love. >> That's hard.
>> That's hard. >> Yes. And listen, we partner with so we
>> Yes. And listen, we partner with so we love a good
love a good >> We do too. I love you. Hello.
>> We do too. I love you. Hello. >> We love. But this challenge is to just
>> We love. But this challenge is to just have no phone.
have no phone. >> You put on the smarter phone.
>> You put on the smarter phone. >> No, that would be smart though.
>> No, that would be smart though. >> That would be smart.
>> That would be smart. >> Shoot. Alex, I'm sorry. Okay. Um, how
>> Shoot. Alex, I'm sorry. Okay. Um, how about uh dance with somebody? I like
about uh dance with somebody? I like that.
that. >> Oh, I want to dance.
>> Oh, I want to dance. >> My four-year-old loves dancing with me.
>> My four-year-old loves dancing with me. Okay. challenge is to go out and dance.
Okay. challenge is to go out and dance. >> I love that.
>> I love that. >> Don't post it. Just go dance.
>> Don't post it. Just go dance. >> Paris dances. He has dance parties.
>> Paris dances. He has dance parties. >> Like swing dance. Even though he does
>> Like swing dance. Even though he does actual dancing like
actual dancing like >> I love that. Literally just go swing
>> I love that. Literally just go swing dance.
dance. >> Renaissance guy
>> Renaissance guy >> and go be there with people and dance.
>> and go be there with people and dance. Don't post it.
Don't post it. >> Servant, go do something nice for
>> Servant, go do something nice for somebody and don't post it.
somebody and don't post it. >> Yeah, that too.
>> Yeah, that too. >> I love this. Okay, so love all of that.
>> I love this. Okay, so love all of that. >> Um I just want to run through these
>> Um I just want to run through these because I want to leave people with this
because I want to leave people with this high note. These are all fant fantastic.
high note. These are all fant fantastic. Be moving. We kind of talked about that,
Be moving. We kind of talked about that, but like get outside and move. Take a
but like get outside and move. Take a walk at least.
walk at least. >> Yeah, we're Yeah. Because of technology,
>> Yeah, we're Yeah. Because of technology, 80% of our population is is indoors
80% of our population is is indoors sitting on screens for their job. So, we
sitting on screens for their job. So, we have to first think about the huge shift
have to first think about the huge shift in work.
in work. >> Even defining what work is.
>> Even defining what work is. >> Work for most of our history was
>> Work for most of our history was movement at all. This is the weird I was
movement at all. This is the weird I was laughing the other day just driving here
laughing the other day just driving here looking at a gym.
looking at a gym. >> Do you realize how weird a gym is?
>> Do you realize how weird a gym is? >> That we go and pay people. If you were
>> That we go and pay people. If you were to have told someone 200 years ago, hey,
to have told someone 200 years ago, hey, we're going to have these things where
we're going to have these things where we pay people to go move and lift heavy
we pay people to go move and lift heavy things and we're going to even pay
things and we're going to even pay people to watch us do that sometimes.
people to watch us do that sometimes. You know, think about a fitness trainer.
You know, think about a fitness trainer. They'd be like, "Huh?" Right? Your day
They'd be like, "Huh?" Right? Your day was like,
was like, >> and you're not like a professional
>> and you're not like a professional athlete,
athlete, >> right? Your day was walking. You walked
>> right? Your day was walking. You walked miles a day, right? So, low-level
miles a day, right? So, low-level movement's key. Most of us are so
movement's key. Most of us are so sedentary. And this is a battle in my
sedentary. And this is a battle in my own life. Here's the such the ironic
own life. Here's the such the ironic nature of this whole thing. I'm on a
nature of this whole thing. I'm on a computer like all day trying to build
computer like all day trying to build this movement of helping people to get
this movement of helping people to get out of their screen addiction and be
out of their screen addiction and be more human. I have to hack this just as
more human. I have to hack this just as much as anybody else, right? So, again,
much as anybody else, right? So, again, my phone calls, I try and walk. My lunch
my phone calls, I try and walk. My lunch break, it's outdoors, you I get made fun
break, it's outdoors, you I get made fun of for all this stuff, but like
of for all this stuff, but like >> I'm trying to be human. Like these
>> I'm trying to be human. Like these inputs we always had, you got to get
inputs we always had, you got to get outside and you got to get moving. Every
outside and you got to get moving. Every study in this
study in this >> master manual and every study you're
>> master manual and every study you're going to look at with with exercise is
going to look at with with exercise is correlated to longevity. Just start
correlated to longevity. Just start moving. And here's what's so interesting
moving. And here's what's so interesting to me. There's more information than
to me. There's more information than ever about movement, fitness, and
ever about movement, fitness, and health. I think it's the most confusing
health. I think it's the most confusing thing on the planet actually right now.
thing on the planet actually right now. One day you're looking online and then
One day you're looking online and then they're like, "Bananas are bad for you."
they're like, "Bananas are bad for you." One day you have a doctor, you have a
One day you have a doctor, you have a PhD saying meat's bad for you. And then
PhD saying meat's bad for you. And then you have a vegan saying no, you know, or
you have a vegan saying no, you know, or you know, they're saying like, yeah,
you know, they're saying like, yeah, >> and then Jordan Peterson is like, just
>> and then Jordan Peterson is like, just eat meat.
eat meat. >> Um,
>> Um, >> so anyway, movement's key. You have to
>> so anyway, movement's key. You have to start to implement movement.
start to implement movement. >> But I think it's very foundational like
>> But I think it's very foundational like eat more whole foods. Avoid the
eat more whole foods. Avoid the processed section of the grocery store
processed section of the grocery store and processed foods and be outside and
and processed foods and be outside and take a walk. I mean, you don't even have
take a walk. I mean, you don't even have to go to the gym. You don't even have to
to go to the gym. You don't even have to lift weights. You
lift weights. You >> I don't even encourage people to go to
>> I don't even encourage people to go to gyms. Literally, just get some like get
gyms. Literally, just get some like get some functional movement in your life.
some functional movement in your life. play a sport, play a hobby, get
play a sport, play a hobby, get outdoors. Like, young people aren't
outdoors. Like, young people aren't doing these things. We have to literally
doing these things. We have to literally retach them to do some of these human
retach them to do some of these human things.
things. >> Okay, I want to go through a couple more
>> Okay, I want to go through a couple more of these before we wrap. So, be
of these before we wrap. So, be connected.
connected. >> That's all on relationship. Beautiful.
>> That's all on relationship. Beautiful. >> That's all on really how to build
>> That's all on really how to build authentic friendship. You need to log at
authentic friendship. You need to log at least about 200 hours with a person in
least about 200 hours with a person in person to build a friendship.
person to build a friendship. >> We go through Aristotle's ideas.
>> We go through Aristotle's ideas. >> 200 hours in person with someone to
>> 200 hours in person with someone to build What does that mean to build a
build What does that mean to build a friendship? I have friends that I've met
friendship? I have friends that I've met only a couple times, but we stay in
only a couple times, but we stay in touch.
touch. >> Yeah, you stay in touch. Yeah, that's
>> Yeah, you stay in touch. Yeah, that's Yeah, that's like an interesting phrase,
Yeah, that's like an interesting phrase, too, right? To stay in touch. Like
too, right? To stay in touch. Like really, what does that look like? What
really, what does that look like? What does that mean? What does that look
does that mean? What does that look like? And is that really what we were
like? And is that really what we were designed for? So, I would say the
designed for? So, I would say the hyperconnection is actually part of the
hyperconnection is actually part of the loneliness epidemic. This is what's so
loneliness epidemic. This is what's so wild about
wild about >> it's not deep connection.
>> it's not deep connection. >> It's not deep connection. This is why
>> It's not deep connection. This is why 68% of Gen Z says that no one really
68% of Gen Z says that no one really knows me. That's
knows me. That's >> while we're sharing all of our ideas and
>> while we're sharing all of our ideas and sharing all of our days and sharing all
sharing all of our days and sharing all of our posts and getting all these
of our posts and getting all these likes, we're not building intimate
likes, we're not building intimate relationships because you can only build
relationships because you can only build those in person. And guess what? You can
those in person. And guess what? You can only learn empathy like what we're doing
only learn empathy like what we're doing even right now through in person. You
even right now through in person. You can't learn this through a screen. So
can't learn this through a screen. So Dr. Robin Dumbar goes through this. He's
Dr. Robin Dumbar goes through this. He's an evolutionary psychologist that talks
an evolutionary psychologist that talks about friendship. How many friends we
about friendship. How many friends we can actually facilitate as humans today?
can actually facilitate as humans today? >> So do you know the number of
>> So do you know the number of acquaintances that we can really
acquaintances that we can really facilitate? Do you know the number? No,
facilitate? Do you know the number? No, but I know the number for friends is
but I know the number for friends is like 10 or 12, right?
like 10 or 12, right? >> You're right. So, it's about 150 to 230.
>> You're right. So, it's about 150 to 230. So, if you look at most of these Amish
So, if you look at most of these Amish communities, hunter gather tribes,
communities, hunter gather tribes, they're weirdly in this 150 to 230 room.
they're weirdly in this 150 to 230 room. >> It's like the biggest wedding, but that
>> It's like the biggest wedding, but that makes sense,
makes sense, >> right? That's acquaintances. You want to
>> right? That's acquaintances. You want to get a little closer intimate intimate
get a little closer intimate intimate friendships that you're seeing more
friendships that you're seeing more regularly is about 50 and then it goes
regularly is about 50 and then it goes down to 15. And deep intimate
down to 15. And deep intimate friendships, it's five. So, here's what
friendships, it's five. So, here's what I found. You
I found. You >> What do you do when you have 10 people
>> What do you do when you have 10 people in your family? That's a lot of intimate
in your family? That's a lot of intimate friendships or Yeah, that's a lot of
friendships or Yeah, that's a lot of connections you got to facilitate.
connections you got to facilitate. >> 10 kids. What do you do?
>> 10 kids. What do you do? >> It's a lot. It's a lot. And here's also
>> It's a lot. It's a lot. And here's also funny.
funny. >> He said 12 disciples, though.
>> He said 12 disciples, though. >> Yeah. And he invested in three, right?
>> Yeah. And he invested in three, right? >> He was Jesus.
>> He was Jesus. >> But he really invested in three.
>> But he really invested in three. >> That's true.
>> That's true. >> So even there's like these tears, right?
>> So even there's like these tears, right? And I found on my social media, I found
And I found on my social media, I found this so weird. More people knew about my
this so weird. More people knew about my life and what I was doing than me. So I
life and what I was doing than me. So I would go to another city. I don't like I
would go to another city. I don't like I would wake up in city. I still do that
would wake up in city. I still do that sometimes. I wake up and I'm like, I
sometimes. I wake up and I'm like, I don't know what city I'm in, right? And
don't know what city I'm in, right? And I remember people come up to me like,
I remember people come up to me like, "Oh, I just saw you were in Canada or
"Oh, I just saw you were in Canada or you were on the West Coast." And I'm
you were on the West Coast." And I'm like, "Oh, yeah. I was like, people were
like, "Oh, yeah. I was like, people were starting to know know more about my own
starting to know know more about my own life than me." And I found that my
life than me." And I found that my friendships online, while I knew that
friendships online, while I knew that they got married or had a kid and the
they got married or had a kid and the kid did this and that next thing
kid did this and that next thing happened, I noticed no one was really
happened, I noticed no one was really checking in with me as much because
checking in with me as much because guess what? They knew what I was doing,
guess what? They knew what I was doing, but they didn't really know me. So,
but they didn't really know me. So, here's what's happening right now. And
here's what's happening right now. And this is deep sociological. There's so
this is deep sociological. There's so much depth to this idea. We know more
much depth to this idea. We know more about what people are doing than we
about what people are doing than we actually know about them.
actually know about them. >> So this shallowess of our relationships
>> So this shallowess of our relationships is actually causing this loneliness
is actually causing this loneliness epidemic, I believe.
epidemic, I believe. >> And it's driving the polarization
>> And it's driving the polarization because you can much more easily hate,
because you can much more easily hate, judge, be angry at someone or something
judge, be angry at someone or something that you don't really know.
that you don't really know. >> One out of five millennials has zero
>> One out of five millennials has zero friends. This is why dating apps are are
friends. This is why dating apps are are getting a lot of traction because people
getting a lot of traction because people are incredibly lonely. Largely due to
are incredibly lonely. Largely due to our technologies, largely due to the
our technologies, largely due to the car. One out of every five millennials
car. One out of every five millennials say they have no friends.
say they have no friends. >> Yeah. The car did incredible good and
>> Yeah. The car did incredible good and incredible damage all at once. Right.
incredible damage all at once. Right. The tra the train the plane. I'd say I'
The tra the train the plane. I'd say I' I've experienced a lot of the damage of
I've experienced a lot of the damage of the plane in my life. I have felt like
the plane in my life. I have felt like I've flown everywhere in the world and
I've flown everywhere in the world and I've also like live nowhere,
I've also like live nowhere, >> right?
>> right? >> And I and I meet friends all over I have
>> And I and I meet friends all over I have friends all over the world. Amazing
friends all over the world. Amazing friendships. I rarely get to really
friendships. I rarely get to really invest in them, you know? I mean, you
invest in them, you know? I mean, you remind me a little bit about myself
remind me a little bit about myself before I got married because I was on
before I got married because I was on the road 50% of the time minimum. Yeah.
the road 50% of the time minimum. Yeah. >> And I was for pro-life activism and I
>> And I was for pro-life activism and I would go around the world. I'd speak.
would go around the world. I'd speak. I'd do investigations. I would do
I'd do investigations. I would do seminars. I would do whatever. All these
seminars. I would do whatever. All these things
things >> and I was so lonely.
>> and I was so lonely. >> I was so lonely because I also was
>> I was so lonely because I also was living alone. I was not supposed to live
living alone. I was not supposed to live alone more than like a year, but it just
alone more than like a year, but it just like ended up happening for like 3
like ended up happening for like 3 years.
years. >> So, I had no one in my home.
>> So, I had no one in my home. >> It was just me. So, I finally I was
>> It was just me. So, I finally I was like, I know I'm not supposed to do this
like, I know I'm not supposed to do this anymore. I need to take decisive action
anymore. I need to take decisive action >> and I want to design my life now
>> and I want to design my life now >> for the kind of life that I'm praying to
>> for the kind of life that I'm praying to God for which includes a husband and and
God for which includes a husband and and children. And so I want to yes I I I I
children. And so I want to yes I I I I worked hard here. I'm going to keep
worked hard here. I'm going to keep working hard, but I'm going to now start
working hard, but I'm going to now start like designing my life so I can sustain
like designing my life so I can sustain >> what I feel called to do with proife
>> what I feel called to do with proife work and like culture work and stuff
work and like culture work and stuff while still being a wife and a mother.
while still being a wife and a mother. And I'm still like figuring it out. Like
And I'm still like figuring it out. Like nothing's perfect. But
nothing's perfect. But >> it had to do with cutting back on the
>> it had to do with cutting back on the the plane actually.
the plane actually. >> I mean I'm in that now. And also by the
>> I mean I'm in that now. And also by the way there's an incredible trade. I love
way there's an incredible trade. I love aviation. So, I went from being
aviation. So, I went from being terrified of flying, like panic attacks,
terrified of flying, like panic attacks, to like I can't wait to be a pilot one
to like I can't wait to be a pilot one day, like I want to get my private
day, like I want to get my private pilots license for funsies. I think
pilots license for funsies. I think aviation is the most successful wild
aviation is the most successful wild technological victory of humanity. When
technological victory of humanity. When you think about what happens every day
you think about what happens every day all over the world, it's unbelievable.
all over the world, it's unbelievable. Like, we land like I just went up in the
Like, we land like I just went up in the sky with two random people going 500
sky with two random people going 500 miles an hour and we land and everyone's
miles an hour and we land and everyone's like,
like, it's absurdly. honestly terrifying when
it's absurdly. honestly terrifying when you
you >> but also from a circadian rhythm
>> but also from a circadian rhythm standpoint it is absolutely damaging to
standpoint it is absolutely damaging to the human person to change time zones
the human person to change time zones every day every week once a week. We
every day every week once a week. We were not physically designed to do that.
were not physically designed to do that. That's why a lot of pilots and a lot of
That's why a lot of pilots and a lot of these people that have night shift
these people that have night shift workers whether in the health care
workers whether in the health care system or night shift workers have
system or night shift workers have incredibly high risk of of disease uh
incredibly high risk of of disease uh and cancer because we are living again
and cancer because we are living again in environments light environments we
in environments light environments we weren't designed to be in. So anyway,
weren't designed to be in. So anyway, friendships be connected all about how
friendships be connected all about how to create and how people can really
to create and how people can really invest in the most important
invest in the most important relationships in their life and that's
relationships in their life and that's the science we kind of dive into.
the science we kind of dive into. >> Um, just to keep it something actionable
>> Um, just to keep it something actionable for someone, you mentioned the 200 hours
for someone, you mentioned the 200 hours for a friend.
for a friend. >> Would you say the best advice you can
>> Would you say the best advice you can have for somebody maybe listening in
have for somebody maybe listening in terms of building friendships
terms of building friendships >> is identify some people in your life,
>> is identify some people in your life, they could even be family members
they could even be family members >> that you actually make time to spend
>> that you actually make time to spend time with where there's no screens
time with where there's no screens involved. Yes, 100%. And
involved. Yes, 100%. And >> that's just that's it. Go walking with
>> that's just that's it. Go walking with them. Play bingo with them. I like
them. Play bingo with them. I like playing chess. You can play chess with
playing chess. You can play chess with them.
them. >> I love board games.
>> I love board games. >> Board games. Read a book.
>> Board games. Read a book. >> Go to, I don't know, somewhere with
>> Go to, I don't know, somewhere with them. Go to church with them.
them. Go to church with them. >> Go play go build pots, you know, go go
>> Go play go build pots, you know, go go do something that involves humans.
do something that involves humans. >> Yeah. Now, this is terrifying. And this
>> Yeah. Now, this is terrifying. And this is what's hard is like if people can use
is what's hard is like if people can use technology to get in person, there's no
technology to get in person, there's no third places anymore, right? So with a
third places anymore, right? So with a population going to less churches,
population going to less churches, there's less places for people to be
there's less places for people to be with each other. So I'm actually
with each other. So I'm actually interested in somehow being part of the
interested in somehow being part of the movement that helps create third places
movement that helps create third places in some way. But go to coffee shops. But
in some way. But go to coffee shops. But the funny thing is even coffee shops,
the funny thing is even coffee shops, that's where I go to work.
that's where I go to work. >> I go to I go to work and I go into a
>> I go to I go to work and I go into a coffee shop and sit by myself in a
coffee shop and sit by myself in a computer and it's like
computer and it's like >> it's so weird.
>> it's so weird. >> So anyway, you have to prioritize this
>> So anyway, you have to prioritize this stuff is the point. And you have to make
stuff is the point. And you have to make an intentional decision to say, "Hey,
an intentional decision to say, "Hey, I'm going to start to spend more
I'm going to start to spend more facetime with people." Again, the
facetime with people." Again, the physiological benefit of deep social
physiological benefit of deep social relationships is your number one
relationships is your number one predictor for longevity. More you should
predictor for longevity. More you should clean your, you know, we should stop 60%
clean your, you know, we should stop 60% of the population is eating
of the population is eating ultrarocessed food. That's a bad stat,
ultrarocessed food. That's a bad stat, right? 6 out of 10 Americans have one or
right? 6 out of 10 Americans have one or more chronic diseases. 12% of our
more chronic diseases. 12% of our population is metabolically unhealth
population is metabolically unhealth unhealthy. 50% of the population is
unhealthy. 50% of the population is diabetes. These are bad things. But even
diabetes. These are bad things. But even more than that is increasing social
more than that is increasing social capital capital in your life.
capital capital in your life. >> Real life connection.
>> Real life connection. It's going to be awkward. You're gonna
It's going to be awkward. You're gonna screen.
screen. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> I keep saying that because you can often
>> I keep saying that because you can often like the teenagers today get together
like the teenagers today get together and they're all on their phone next to
and they're all on their phone next to each other.
each other. >> Oh, literally I literally saw this. I
>> Oh, literally I literally saw this. I see this everywhere. The other day I was
see this everywhere. The other day I was just in Denver. Whole group of kids came
just in Denver. Whole group of kids came in on their phone, sat together,
in on their phone, sat together, good-looking guys, some really
good-looking guys, some really good-looking girls. I'm like, "Dudes,
good-looking girls. I'm like, "Dudes, you should be spitting game right now,
you should be spitting game right now, right? Like you should be like talking
right? Like you should be like talking to them and flirting." They were all on
to them and flirting." They were all on their phones. One of them looked up out
their phones. One of them looked up out of the matrix, stood up, and walked out.
of the matrix, stood up, and walked out. And all of them got off their phones,
And all of them got off their phones, stood up, and walked out. They didn't
stood up, and walked out. They didn't say a word. I see this all over all over
say a word. I see this all over all over the world, right? I mean, this is this
the world, right? I mean, this is this is what's hard to like really
is what's hard to like really diagnose like what's going to be best. I
diagnose like what's going to be best. I honestly, if I had to say, I'd say
honestly, if I had to say, I'd say for most people, the more you can limit
for most people, the more you can limit your digital interactions,
your digital interactions, social media, gaming,
social media, gaming, news,
news, if you can limit that to 10 to 30
if you can limit that to 10 to 30 minutes a day, if I had to put a real
minutes a day, if I had to put a real time to it, to me, that's what the data
time to it, to me, that's what the data shows to would probably bring the most
shows to would probably bring the most benefit into your life.
benefit into your life. >> Here's my challenge for people
>> Here's my challenge for people listening. if they feel this urge at all
listening. if they feel this urge at all to delete social media.
to delete social media. >> Unless you are intentionally using
>> Unless you are intentionally using social media to advance a specific cause
social media to advance a specific cause and it could be your home business
and it could be your home business because that matters for your home.
because that matters for your home. That's how you're supporting your
That's how you're supporting your family. I would say delete it.
family. I would say delete it. >> Yeah,
>> Yeah, >> that's what I would say.
>> that's what I would say. >> Yeah. And if you are using social media
>> Yeah. And if you are using social media to advance a specific cause, could be
to advance a specific cause, could be your home business or the pro-life cause
your home business or the pro-life cause or evangelization or something, then you
or evangelization or something, then you have to be 100% locked in about how
have to be 100% locked in about how you're using it. To your point, and
you're using it. To your point, and you're not doing the doom scrolling.
you're not doing the doom scrolling. >> Yeah. Well, even how you're sharing it,
>> Yeah. Well, even how you're sharing it, too. Like, I think we forget that. I I
too. Like, I think we forget that. I I think I over I think I I said this the
think I over I think I I said this the other day and someone said that was a
other day and someone said that was a good quote. I'll try and remember it,
good quote. I'll try and remember it, but they're like, I was consuming so
but they're like, I was consuming so much Catholic content, I was forgetting
much Catholic content, I was forgetting to be consumed by God.
to be consumed by God. >> So, here's also again the trade-off. You
>> So, here's also again the trade-off. You can listen to all the best Catholic
can listen to all the best Catholic content all day every day and forget to
content all day every day and forget to know the God that created the content.
know the God that created the content. >> That's my other message for people
>> That's my other message for people listening. If you are listening to this
listening. If you are listening to this podcast and it's getting in the way of
podcast and it's getting in the way of you praying,
you praying, >> yes,
>> yes, >> spending time in silence and praying,
>> spending time in silence and praying, please delete my podcast from your life.
please delete my podcast from your life. >> Like this, the goal of this is to help
>> Like this, the goal of this is to help you live your life better and love God
you live your life better and love God and other people better. And the bottom
and other people better. And the bottom line, and you have this here,
line, and you have this here, >> um you have be silent in here. You have
>> um you have be silent in here. You have be mindful. I know those are connected
be mindful. I know those are connected to faith, but you need to create space
to faith, but you need to create space in your life. Yes, for mass, I believe,
in your life. Yes, for mass, I believe, for going to church um is is is
for going to church um is is is essential, but for just silence, letting
essential, but for just silence, letting God speak to you, Lord, what do you want
God speak to you, Lord, what do you want to say? Just sitting there in front of
to say? Just sitting there in front of the blessed sacment.
the blessed sacment. >> This was to the one story. I was on a
>> This was to the one story. I was on a plane, woman next to me scrolling
plane, woman next to me scrolling literally the entire flight. When I mean
literally the entire flight. When I mean the entire flight, I mean literally
the entire flight, I mean literally scrolling the entire flight.
scrolling the entire flight. >> How long was the flight?
>> How long was the flight? >> It was at least an hour and a half.
>> It was at least an hour and a half. Second we got out of Wi-Fi zone, you
Second we got out of Wi-Fi zone, you know, phone died and she like head down
know, phone died and she like head down to sleep. I mean, it was so wild. I get
to sleep. I mean, it was so wild. I get my light phone and we land and I'm like,
my light phone and we land and I'm like, "I need to get a ride." She's like, "Oh
"I need to get a ride." She's like, "Oh my gosh, what is that thing?" I was
my gosh, what is that thing?" I was like, "This is my life phone in a
like, "This is my life phone in a digital detox company I run, you know."
digital detox company I run, you know." And she's like, "Oh my gosh, I'm so
And she's like, "Oh my gosh, I'm so addicted to my phone." In the back of my
addicted to my phone." In the back of my head, I'm like, "Yeah, no crap, lady."
head, I'm like, "Yeah, no crap, lady." Like, I saw I was I was very nice. I was
Like, I saw I was I was very nice. I was very generous.
very generous. >> She said something I'll never forget.
>> She said something I'll never forget. She said, "I can't be with my thoughts
She said, "I can't be with my thoughts for just one second."
for just one second." >> So,
>> So, >> that's going to make me cry.
>> that's going to make me cry. >> I cry a lot this show. That's so sad.
>> I cry a lot this show. That's so sad. >> There's a huge reality that this is
>> There's a huge reality that this is outsourcing our reality again of getting
outsourcing our reality again of getting to know ourselves, which again connects
to know ourselves, which again connects back to loving God and loving yourself.
back to loving God and loving yourself. >> It's really hard. I think one of the
>> It's really hard. I think one of the hardest journeys I've been on again is
hardest journeys I've been on again is getting to love and know myself.
getting to love and know myself. >> And the more I'm on these things, again,
>> And the more I'm on these things, again, it's not just what you're viewing. The
it's not just what you're viewing. The US Surgeon General literally said that
US Surgeon General literally said that social media needs to have uh warning
social media needs to have uh warning labels just like cigarettes. This is a
labels just like cigarettes. This is a US surgeon in general ask for warning
US surgeon in general ask for warning labels on social media platforms because
labels on social media platforms because it's mostly carcinogenic and toxic to
it's mostly carcinogenic and toxic to our psychology, right? And one I think
our psychology, right? And one I think the toxins is again we're missing the
the toxins is again we're missing the journey of getting to know ourselves
journey of getting to know ourselves which you were created by God. You're
which you were created by God. You're worth getting to know
worth getting to know >> and you're you're worth getting to know
>> and you're you're worth getting to know yourself now. Everything online now is
yourself now. Everything online now is getting to know yourself and
getting to know yourself and self-expression and all these things.
self-expression and all these things. And um Paul Kings North, he wrote a book
And um Paul Kings North, he wrote a book called Against the Machine and Philip
called Against the Machine and Philip Reef he quotes in his book uh the
Reef he quotes in his book uh the triumph of the therapeutic and he quotes
triumph of the therapeutic and he quotes these different stages that man has been
these different stages that man has been in. It started with the political man.
in. It started with the political man. So Socrates was terrified of us writing
So Socrates was terrified of us writing down things. He thought our brains would
down things. He thought our brains would turn to mush. Sadly, I think a lot of
turn to mush. Sadly, I think a lot of what he said has come true in many
what he said has come true in many different ways. But he was while he
different ways. But he was while he talked about this, he wrote this down,
talked about this, he wrote this down, right? He was writing about how writing
right? He was writing about how writing is going to ruin our brains, right? So
is going to ruin our brains, right? So in some capacity, we have to enter into
in some capacity, we have to enter into these mediums in some way to help people
these mediums in some way to help people get out of the addictive side of it,
get out of the addictive side of it, right? But it started with the political
right? But it started with the political man, it went to the religious man, from
man, it went to the religious man, from there to the economic man, and then now
there to the economic man, and then now we're in the psychological man phase. So
we're in the psychological man phase. So everything's about the interior and the
everything's about the interior and the psychological. And this is where you get
psychological. And this is where you get all these crazy ideologies that are
all these crazy ideologies that are coming out of these social platforms.
coming out of these social platforms. There's a real history to actually why
There's a real history to actually why these ideas are happening, but we're
these ideas are happening, but we're identifying ourselves. It's called
identifying ourselves. It's called expressive individualism. Whatever I
expressive individualism. Whatever I feel is what I am. That's an idea that's
feel is what I am. That's an idea that's deeply rooted in Freud, in Rouso, in
deeply rooted in Freud, in Rouso, in many different atheistic thinkers,
many different atheistic thinkers, right? The amazing gift of Christianity
right? The amazing gift of Christianity is that you aren't your feelings. And
is that you aren't your feelings. And actually, your deepest, we're a body
actually, your deepest, we're a body soul composite, right? We have this
soul composite, right? We have this hyomorphic view of the human person. I'm
hyomorphic view of the human person. I'm an embodied soul. And if I'm honest, I
an embodied soul. And if I'm honest, I don't know exactly what that means. I've
don't know exactly what that means. I've thought about that a lot, but apparently
thought about that a lot, but apparently that's what we are.
that's what we are. >> It's partly a mystery.
>> It's partly a mystery. >> It's partly a mystery. But what's
>> It's partly a mystery. But what's happening with a lot of these
happening with a lot of these technologies is that they are creating
technologies is that they are creating this worldview of the interpretation of
this worldview of the interpretation of oursel that is largely psychological and
oursel that is largely psychological and not actually understanding the full
not actually understanding the full potential and flourishing of the human
potential and flourishing of the human person. We're embodied souls, right? I
person. We're embodied souls, right? I am not my identity is not what I do.
am not my identity is not what I do. That's why it's always weird when I come
That's why it's always weird when I come on these things and people, you know,
on these things and people, you know, you start with what you do, right? Who
you start with what you do, right? Who are you? Oh, I'm an artist. I'm a
are you? Oh, I'm an artist. I'm a musician. I'm a theologian. and I'm a
musician. I'm a theologian. and I'm a national board certified health and
national board certified health and wellness coach. I'm this. It's the
wellness coach. I'm this. It's the deeper thing that I am as a son of God,
deeper thing that I am as a son of God, >> right? It has to all come back to that.
>> right? It has to all come back to that. >> That's what it has to come down to. But
>> That's what it has to come down to. But I noticed this woman really broke open a
I noticed this woman really broke open a lot. Most of our escape into the digital
lot. Most of our escape into the digital realm, I think, and what a lot of the
realm, I think, and what a lot of the literature shows is actually psych it's
literature shows is actually psych it's it's quenching the psychological stress
it's quenching the psychological stress and fear of getting to know ourselves.
and fear of getting to know ourselves. Last, Harvard did a study where they put
Last, Harvard did a study where they put students, university students, in a room
students, university students, in a room for 15 minutes by themselves and were
for 15 minutes by themselves and were asked to just be alone. Yes.
asked to just be alone. Yes. >> Right. They started with this electrical
>> Right. They started with this electrical shock. One student shock themselves up
shock. One student shock themselves up to like 130 plus times, right?
to like 130 plus times, right? >> We're terrified of being with ourselves.
>> We're terrified of being with ourselves. Be mindful, be silent. Those episodes,
Be mindful, be silent. Those episodes, we put you into practical situations.
we put you into practical situations. Like one of these stickers we have is
Like one of these stickers we have is idle hours.
idle hours. >> So that challenge is while you're doing
>> So that challenge is while you're doing the groceries, while you're at a
the groceries, while you're at a stoplight, while you're waiting in
stoplight, while you're waiting in between things, don't pull out the
between things, don't pull out the device. Just be present to the moment.
device. Just be present to the moment. And that would be like the challenge
And that would be like the challenge someone can start today. You know, when
someone can start today. You know, when you're at the stoplight, don't pull out
you're at the stoplight, don't pull out the phone. Just look around. You know,
the phone. Just look around. You know, when you're at the airport, I dare you
when you're at the airport, I dare you when you're at the airport in your gate
when you're at the airport in your gate to just look around and just look at
to just look around and just look at people. Look at people. Watch people. Be
people. Look at people. Watch people. Be present to God. God's everywhere. St.
present to God. God's everywhere. St. Paul said to pray unceasingly. We didn't
Paul said to pray unceasingly. We didn't really get into the whole spiritual
really get into the whole spiritual aspects of all this. Obviously, all this
aspects of all this. Obviously, all this angst, I feel, I think
angst, I feel, I think >> got to have your back, Andrew. There's
>> got to have your back, Andrew. There's so much more to explore. It's largely I
so much more to explore. It's largely I think because there's this huge
think because there's this huge spiritual component to this and I'm
spiritual component to this and I'm interested in that whole person
interested in that whole person experience. But that would be my
experience. But that would be my encouragement is there's there's
encouragement is there's there's practical
practical little things you can do today that's
little things you can do today that's going to help one get that number down.
going to help one get that number down. I want that 27 years that you're in life
I want that 27 years that you're in life to not be 27 years and I want you for
to not be 27 years and I want you for the years you have left to spend them
the years you have left to spend them with the most valuable experiences you
with the most valuable experiences you can have. You know,
can have. You know, >> I'm hopeful because everything that you
>> I'm hopeful because everything that you recommend is so human and it's so in a
recommend is so human and it's so in a way effortless if you get back to the
way effortless if you get back to the the roots of how we were designed.
the roots of how we were designed. >> All of this is available on your
>> All of this is available on your website. You have these great resources.
website. You have these great resources. How can people find your work?
How can people find your work? >> Yeah. So, we're not on any social media
>> Yeah. So, we're not on any social media platforms. Now, I'm interested actually,
platforms. Now, I'm interested actually, this might change. I'm interested in
this might change. I'm interested in going to the podcast world. I do think
going to the podcast world. I do think this medium can be incredibly
this medium can be incredibly beneficial.
beneficial. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> And so, while we're not on any podcast,
>> And so, while we're not on any podcast, we don't have any social media. You can
we don't have any social media. You can go to our website, humanality.org. org
go to our website, humanality.org. org and we're on Hallow again. You can go to
and we're on Hallow again. You can go to Hollow, go to Digital Detox, go through
Hollow, go to Digital Detox, go through this. People are really giving
this. People are really giving incredible feedback there. Anyone can
incredible feedback there. Anyone can start this course. If you're 90 years
start this course. If you're 90 years old and you want a better relationship
old and you want a better relationship with your phone and screens if you're 9
with your phone and screens if you're 9 years old, actually, we probably
years old, actually, we probably recommend 14 years old and above. There
recommend 14 years old and above. There is an episode that does talk about the
is an episode that does talk about the effects of pornography. So, we want to
effects of pornography. So, we want to keep that for 14 years and older. Anyone
keep that for 14 years and older. Anyone can start this with their friends. This
can start this with their friends. This is happening at schools, at churches, at
is happening at schools, at churches, at businesses.
businesses. >> Amazing.
>> Amazing. >> I want to help the world be human. And
>> I want to help the world be human. And that's really my mission.
that's really my mission. >> Thank you, Andrew. This is incredible.
>> Thank you, Andrew. This is incredible. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you so much. We will be um so
>> Thank you so much. We will be um so excited to share this with people
excited to share this with people listening. I'm sure they're excited
listening. I'm sure they're excited hearing this. Please share this with a
hearing this. Please share this with a friend and check out humanity.org
friend and check out humanity.org >> and what they can do. Instead of
>> and what they can do. Instead of commenting, communicate with a person
commenting, communicate with a person >> about it. I love
>> about it. I love >> So, here's what I love. If you feel this
>> So, here's what I love. If you feel this impetus where you're like, "Oh my gosh,
impetus where you're like, "Oh my gosh, I I got to type this comment." Whether
I I got to type this comment." Whether you really agree with what I'm saying or
you really agree with what I'm saying or you're incredibly furious about what I'm
you're incredibly furious about what I'm saying, I want you to direct that energy
saying, I want you to direct that energy towards an in-person interaction because
towards an in-person interaction because that's actually going to help your day.
that's actually going to help your day. >> I love that.
>> I love that. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you for what you're doing.
>> Yeah. Thank you for what you're doing. >> So good. Thanks so much for listening to
>> So good. Thanks so much for listening to this episode of the Lilaya Rose Show. I
this episode of the Lilaya Rose Show. I hope you enjoyed it. I always do. Make
hope you enjoyed it. I always do. Make sure that you're subscribed if you
sure that you're subscribed if you haven't hit that subscribe button
haven't hit that subscribe button already and go over to our Patreon to
already and go over to our Patreon to support the mission of this show. That's
support the mission of this show. That's patreon.com/laose.
patreon.com/laose. A huge thank you to our partner EWTN.
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The largest religious broadcaster in the entire world, EWTN is reaching millions
entire world, EWTN is reaching millions of people every single day with the
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