0:01 good morning good afternoon good evening
0:04 depending upon your time zone Welcome to
0:09 our webinar on search uh and AI this is
0:11 the third of our series I'm going to go
0:13 to that well I I'll show you the the
0:14 sequence in just a minute but if you
0:16 missed any the first either of the first
0:18 two you can go to the website we have a
0:21 great panel today and uh I'll let folks
0:23 do a quick introduction of themselves so
0:25 I'm Seth early I'm founder and CEO of
0:26 early information science many of you
0:28 know who I am and many of you know about
0:31 the book I wrote called the AI powered
0:34 Enterprise which talks about ontologies
0:37 as being a fundamental to AI initiatives
0:39 and we'll hear more about that today and
0:41 what's interesting is I read an article
0:43 just the other day that said how paler
0:46 who's that really well-known AI company
0:48 and analytics company and you know
0:49 they've been around forever doing tons
0:51 of government contracts kind of first to
0:53 the market with a lot of stuff an
0:55 article that said their secret sauce
0:56 their secret
0:58 sauce we're
1:01 ontologies so I was like okay that's not
1:03 so secret but great it's your sauce I'm
1:04 glad it's your sauce GL it's part of
1:06 your sauce because I think of it as well
1:08 anyway so um Patrick do you want to give
1:11 a quick thumbnail of uh who you are
1:15 and sure my name is Patrick heel I am
1:18 managing partner of Patrick heel
1:20 partners and uh we are a Consulting
1:23 organization providing uh consulting
1:27 services in the search and AI space for
1:30 uh people who are trying to get get
1:33 their heads around what all this
1:36 means abdal how about yourself yeah I'm
1:39 the head of produ and Technology at dbm
1:42 my background like Patrick was in Search
1:43 and then I keep moving up in the journey
1:47 to SEO PPC and track the whole user
1:49 Journey from uh Google down to your
1:52 website the relevancy terrific and how
1:55 about yourself Chris I'm Chris black I
1:58 am currently a fractional CMO coo
2:01 focusing on early stage Tech startups
2:02 I've always been at The Cutting Edge of
2:05 technology so obviously geni and all of
2:06 the impacts that that's having on
2:08 business today is something that I'm
2:10 particularly interested in of course
2:11 that includes with
2:14 search and Chris is actually doing some
2:16 work with e Patrick hopefully will be
2:19 doing some work with Eis on an upcoming
2:21 project and Chris is working with us on
2:23 MAR on marketing and messaging and uh
2:26 taking that 25 30 years of experience
2:28 and boiling it down into meaningful
2:30 messages uh so that you guys can can all
2:33 engage with us as necessary okay so
2:35 again we're about an hour about 50
2:37 minutes we'll try to take questions
2:39 throughout and at the end we are
2:40 recording of course so that you can
2:42 listen to this afterwards or you can
2:44 share it with your colleagues and we do
2:45 have a couple of polls we'd love to hear
2:48 your input on that uh and there's Q&A
2:51 there's Q&A tab where you can ask
2:53 questions throughout and then we have a
2:56 short post session survey which we would
2:58 love to get you feedback on so thank you
3:01 for that and early has been around for
3:02 30 years as I mentioned we're
3:04 headquartered in Boston and we don't
3:06 have our tagline on here but it's making
3:08 information more usable more findable
3:10 and more valuable and that cuts across
3:12 lots of different Industries so whatever
3:14 industry you're in we can help we work
3:16 in product data we work in content we
3:18 work in knowledge strategy and customer
3:20 engagement um I've written for Harvard
3:22 Business Review I've been recently uh
3:24 interviewed for a couple of Harvard
3:26 Business analytic report special U
3:29 research projects on generative AI I can
3:30 certainly share with you folks if you
3:32 haven't seen those um and here whoops
3:34 and here we are in a little timeline
3:36 here this is better than bullets so
3:38 Chris thank you this is a this is
3:40 Chris's first impression on the
3:43 marketplace with from Eis perspective
3:45 she took those boring bullets and she
3:47 put it into a nice little timeline here
3:49 so we are at session number three we
3:51 have four more sessions to go I did get
3:53 someone asking if they could be on one
3:55 of our panels send me your background
3:57 tell me what your angle is and and uh
3:59 we'd love to consider additional
4:01 resources this is really a community
4:02 thing and I'm I'm happy to have other
4:05 folks on so I wanted to start off with
4:08 what is uh how are you doing in SEO
4:11 overall it range from what is
4:14 SEO hopefully won't be too many of those
4:16 our SEO sucks things are okay but we can
4:19 do better my SEO is great but why now
4:24 what do I do about Geo and with gpts or
4:25 none of the above and let us know what
4:27 that is so this is the traditional
4:30 popcorn popping portion of the session
4:33 where I I watch uh as people are
4:35 answering the questions and I can kind
4:37 of see that them coming in and then when
4:40 they slow down and I start to um uh
4:44 smell burning popcorn I I I stop the uh
4:46 the popcorn popping so I do have I do
4:48 have an what is SEO that could be
4:49 factious it could be true right and
4:51 people are not necessarily familiar with
4:53 this and again a lot of folks are in the
4:56 things are okay but we could be doing
4:59 better so if you have any other uh input
5:02 on this we have about half of the folks
5:04 responding for the other half go ahead
5:07 pick pick a slot you can uh say none of
5:10 the above if that those don't apply uh
5:12 yeah no don't be afraid to say you don't
5:15 know about seo seo is a a topic that is
5:18 usually for specialists in the industry
5:21 and um uh and so sometimes people don't
5:23 have knowledge of that okay well I think
5:26 that's enough popcorn so let's go ahead
5:28 and share the results so you can get a
5:30 couple of folks are less familiar with
5:33 SEO nobody's saying it sucks uh which is
5:35 good and a lot of folks are kind of in
5:38 that yeah we can do better uh uh bucket
5:40 but uh and then there are folks who are
5:43 doing well but now what do we do in
5:44 generative search right what do we do
5:48 with uh with generative U free chain
5:50 Transformers and uh then a few are
5:53 saying well one person is saying none of
5:54 the above just let us know in chat okay
5:57 I'm going to stop the sharing there and
5:59 move on so uh first I do want to say
6:02 that this is a new paradigm right it is
6:04 really very different than what we're
6:06 used to with search engine optimization
6:08 search engine optimization many times
6:12 was all about building content that was
6:15 containing words that you wanted people
6:17 to uh wanted the engines to pick up on
6:19 and words that people would be searching
6:22 on or related Concepts so many times you
6:24 would get uh terminology that you want
6:26 to optimize on and then you would just
6:29 add variations of that terminology much
6:30 of this was about you if it's knowledge
6:32 it's Knowledge Management and knowledge
6:34 engineering and knowledge integration
6:36 and Knowledge Management systems and you
6:39 know knowledge architecture and
6:40 knowledge and information management
6:41 whatever it might be but there'd be a
6:43 lot of other you know maybe it's tasset
6:45 learning or there'd be other Concepts
6:47 that be related and many times you would
6:50 get these optimization uh spreadsheets
6:53 that would basically say uh okay try to
6:57 include um as many of these terms as you
7:00 can right and and then it's not really
7:03 written for a human it's written for a
7:05 machine it's written for a machine that
7:07 is trying to pick up those keyword
7:10 densities now there's more than than uh
7:13 terminology and Google uses hundreds and
7:15 hundreds I understood it was about 200
7:17 but abdell is going to tell us it's
7:20 about 1,500 uh different signals but you
7:22 know everything from incoming links to
7:24 you know the quality of uh the content
7:27 the quality of the referring links um
7:30 the authoritativeness of the site uh the
7:32 age of the site but there's a lot of
7:33 stuff but really came down to what could
7:36 you do with your content you could add
7:38 terminology to the content and I wrote
7:40 uh I was writing some uh with one of the
7:42 tools I was writing some content and I
7:44 was like really trying to score high and
7:46 get all the words in and then I was told
7:49 that you will actually get penalized if
7:51 you try to do too much keyword stuffing
7:53 in that content right so but it really
7:56 wasn't W written in a very human
7:58 understandable way right it was I I like
8:00 to use different variations of
8:02 terminology when I am writing or when
8:04 I'm speaking just to make it more varied
8:06 and more more understandable but that
8:09 was not necessarily good in in SEO
8:11 content but when you use terms over and
8:14 over and over again you can see it you
8:15 can feel it you can it reduces
8:18 readability and understanding so what
8:20 Geo does is it says we want
8:22 comprehensive answers and and we want
8:25 those answers to be specific and
8:28 meaningful and not necessarily long
8:30 drawn out content right we want to build
8:33 things in question answering format and
8:35 what we're doing is what those engines
8:37 are doing is they're synthesizing
8:39 information from multiple sources that
8:41 end up creating a very unique response
8:44 to a quiry to a prompt and so you want
8:46 to be one of those sources that it pulls
8:49 in and that it cites uh and in order to
8:50 do that we need to have make sure that
8:53 the result that the the content itself
8:55 is written in a different way so it's
8:57 trying to provide very accurate and
9:00 relevant and personalized information
9:01 within that user interface and what that
9:04 also means is you're trying to get the
9:07 answer in the user interface Chris I I
9:08 know you had spent a little bit time
9:10 researching this and researching the
9:13 impact on on click-throughs and when
9:15 when we have that answer within the
9:17 search results it doesn't give us an
9:19 incentive to click through so tell me uh
9:22 Chris what's that mean in terms of where
9:24 things are going and what the impact has
9:26 been so far yeah so um some of you have
9:28 probably already noticed that your your
9:30 traffic has been going down right and
9:32 maybe you think it's rankings maybe
9:33 you're you've already started trying to
9:35 figure out what to do to to increase
9:38 those clicks again but what's happening
9:40 is that zero click search is really
9:42 starting to take Force it's great for us
9:44 as users right we go to a search we want
9:46 to know you know how to make something
9:48 or or where to go to buy something and
9:50 we we type it in and the answer just
9:53 pops up it's what askd if any of youer
9:56 remember the '90s that's what asks
9:57 wanteded to be right is is something
9:59 that delivered an answer
10:01 well we have that now and these are AI
10:04 driven so we've got search it's going
10:05 out it's grabbing content from a few
10:07 sites and then it's using generative AI
10:10 to create a a paragraph or some answers
10:13 for you and if we're lucky it's cited
10:14 and maybe it comes to our pages and
10:17 maybe it doesn't but overall from a user
10:20 experience it's kind of fantastic like
10:21 we don't get lists anymore and if you
10:25 see here on the left 20 uh 16 we have
10:27 some images before that we didn't even
10:29 necessarily have images it was just a
10:31 list of links and they were all ranked
10:33 based on SEO and all of the things that
10:34 that abdala is going to talk to us about
10:36 a little bit later but you know you get
10:38 some ads you get some images you get
10:40 some organic listings you kind of get a
10:41 little bit of everything but what's
10:44 above the fold are some of those organic
10:47 listings today and I could have given
10:49 you that 2024 and it would have just
10:51 scrolled and scrolled and scrolled but
10:54 our our organic listings are now falling
10:56 below the fold often times we're getting
11:00 an AI analysis A gen I thing at the top
11:02 we're getting images we're getting
11:05 videos but our number one position in
11:08 this case is barely above the fold but I
11:09 think many of us that are using search
11:11 are noticing that that number one
11:13 position is going down now as SEO
11:15 Specialists we might think crap our
11:17 rankings have tanked but what I'm
11:19 sharing here and by the way all of this
11:21 comes from orbit media Studios we make
11:22 sure to give them good credit they're
11:25 doing great work here as far as content
11:27 and SEO trending so if you don't follow
11:29 them I highly recommend them but what
11:30 they're showing here is that the
11:32 rankings are generally holding steady
11:35 it's just that the traffic drops that's
11:36 going to have a bunch of ramifications
11:39 for us it does mean that hopefully our
11:41 conversions on our site will go up
11:42 because if they're coming to the site
11:44 they're probably more commercially
11:46 viable now if you're in
11:49 B2B gosh this world gets really tough
11:51 because most of the time we are
11:53 providing thought leadership that is how
11:55 we make sales and and do our Marketing
11:57 in the B2B space that thought leadership
11:59 now that's going to be bubbled up right
12:01 at that top and that that generative AI
12:05 created blurb that provides data so what
12:06 we need to do probably moving forward is
12:08 trying to make sure that it's our
12:10 content that's bubbling up making sure
12:11 that that we do whatever we can and
12:13 we'll talk about that here in a couple
12:14 of minutes of some of the things that we can
12:16 can
12:19 do so this is kind of a a table that
12:22 just explains where SEO uh is focusing
12:25 the user interaction the goals the
12:26 structure the metrics the role of
12:29 multimedia the tools uh what the impact
12:31 will be and of course when you start
12:32 seeing these side by side you see that
12:34 SEO was really about keywords and answer
12:37 answers but the keywords and ranking but
12:39 the Geo is really about context and the
12:42 AI driven answers so can you formulate
12:44 your content in such a way that it an
12:46 answers a question that a user will want
12:48 to ask right and it's building it in
12:50 more pip siiz chunks it's kind of the
12:53 return of FAQs in a way but on steroids
12:54 you know chunking all of your content
12:56 making sure all of your content is
12:58 answering specific questions right not
13:01 just oh here's a bunch of content that
13:03 covers all this keywords and yeah okay
13:05 so I have a high keyword density that
13:07 doesn't necessarily help right because
13:09 it's not answering a specific question
13:11 so it's really a mind shift in terms of
13:13 how you need to think about actually
13:15 writing the content the user interaction
13:18 is not going to you know SEO is focused
13:20 on click-throughs Geo is really answer
13:22 is is answering from the AI without a
13:24 click so again it's a zero click
13:26 searches you're trying to rank for
13:28 higher clicks rank higher and get more
13:30 clicks in SEO in go you want to be
13:32 selected right you want your content to
13:35 the bubble to the top as the AI is
13:37 selecting answers and finding answers
13:39 and in in terms of the content structure
13:41 it's very different right it's long form
13:44 it's heavy it's uh it's heavy keywords
13:46 density whereas for geo it's more
13:49 conversational it's more concise it's
13:51 more about relevant content that answers
13:53 that specific question and then of
13:56 course multimedia was not necessarily oh
13:58 I'm sorry metrics click-throughs right
14:01 site visits but but in Geo it's really
14:03 about visibility it's are we even on the
14:05 page are we even in the room at the
14:07 table you know on the on the field
14:09 whatever you want to say right it's it's
14:12 how you get that visibility there and
14:15 then for SEO multimedia was not really
14:17 uh not that necessary because you you
14:19 could have great clickbait with an
14:21 infographic right people love
14:23 infographics but for goo it really is
14:26 important right the images the video the
14:27 infographics and then we'll talk about
14:29 how to optimize those because you do
14:32 need descriptive content descriptive um
14:35 um uh descriptions and descriptive uh
14:37 metadata that has a way of of telling
14:39 people what that content is about and
14:41 then the cool the tools again are really
14:44 going from keywords and backlinks and
14:47 you know metadata tags are not as you
14:50 know metadata schema is important but we
14:51 we have seen what's happened with
14:54 overstuffing metadata tags so we have to
14:57 be careful with that but now Geo is more
14:59 natural language and it's ALS also data
15:01 driven content you're going to hear from
15:04 abdell about es schema.org and how
15:05 important that is and how important
15:07 ontologies are so structuring that
15:10 content and making it more data uh uh
15:13 focused and and uh structured with with
15:16 data schema will be much more important
15:18 and of course you know SEO is going to
15:20 be less impactful as no click Bros and
15:22 and Geo is really going to be essential
15:24 for the search visibility Chris do you
15:26 want to add more context or B do you
15:29 want to add more context to this
15:31 yeah I think I think this year what I
15:33 see with my client is brand awareness
15:35 think of it as a brand awareness people
15:37 are getting mad they're like I'm
15:39 creating content Google just show it
15:40 you're going to get the brand awareness
15:42 whereas SEO to your point you get the
15:46 click in the visitor so it's a different
15:48 level what I love about this though is
15:49 that we can actually start writing
15:52 content for humans and not like trying
15:53 to stuff those keywords into there and
15:55 picking oh well this is the one that
15:57 that should get us the most traffic
15:59 that's not too competitive always hated
16:01 doing all of that I just want to talk as
16:04 a person to a person know and this
16:06 transforms us back into what I think
16:08 will be a much better I agree with you
16:10 and and Pat I'd love to hear your
16:11 thoughts on this but I agree because
16:14 many times I would feel constrained and
16:16 I would feel like I was going against my
16:18 instincts when I was writing SEO content
16:20 that just was trying to go for keyword
16:22 density I was like I didn't want to
16:24 write it that way and I was feeling like
16:25 I was forced to write it that way
16:27 whereas I would like to write it for
16:30 more clarity and more conciseness
16:31 Patrick any thoughts from your
16:34 perspective yeah we're at an industry
16:36 inflection point and people have become
16:39 very familiar with how to I don't know
16:42 trick a search engine into getting it to
16:44 put you in the place that you want and
16:46 we just we're now in a place where we
16:50 need to relearn how to influence what
16:51 the search engine gives back and it's
16:56 hard but it's uh it's a it's a necessary
16:58 transition and the transition is
17:00 happening whether we like it or not so I
17:02 think this is an important conversation
17:05 to talk about okay how do we relearn how
17:08 to Market our website so that we can get
17:11 the kind of visibility that we need on our
17:12 our
17:15 content I just want to take a quick uh
17:17 look at the comments and questions one
17:21 was about BM Chris uh or or abdell can
17:22 you talk about
17:25 bm25 in terms of um search algorithm
17:29 bm25 is a is this sort of default
17:32 Searcher algorithm that the majority of
17:37 keyword sites use to determine what
17:41 the rank order will be it's based in
17:44 Lucine which is the I would say Far and
17:48 Away the most commonly used search
17:51 engine outside of outside of Google and
17:54 and B even being even Microsoft uses the
17:56 bm25 algorithm so it's a ranking
17:58 algorithm essentially is how you score
18:01 documents and we could go into all the
18:04 details but it's not important um Google
18:07 uses a completely different algorithm
18:10 and abdell can talk more about that yeah
18:14 so bm25 is something that a Search tool
18:16 might use is that more for on-site
18:19 search yeah absolutely Enterprise search
18:21 um elastic it's the foundation of
18:24 elastic search of solar um you know the
18:27 the most popular open- Source search
18:29 engines in the world that are used across
18:30 across
18:33 Industries throughout the world today
18:35 Great Well here here's a question with
18:38 SEO uh we with SEO we can use various
18:40 tools to gge keyword query frequency and
18:42 impression rates for our content showing
18:44 up in searches with gpts providing such
18:46 unique customized responses what tools
18:49 can we use to identify topic relevant
18:51 topic frequency and our brand mentions
18:53 and GPT responses that's kind of what
18:55 we're going to be talking about shortly
18:57 is there a concise answer right now but
18:59 it really is about
19:01 um about uh the things we're going to be
19:03 talking about in terms of how you write
19:05 your content but is there a short a
19:12 provide I just said I'm going to connect
19:14 to what Patrick said Google is using
19:17 very Dynamic approach so a lot of it is
19:19 a clickstream but Dynamic algorithm so
19:22 every versical what I see with my client
19:23 every vertical they use different
19:26 clickstream different so what I suggest
19:28 to the client let's study the top 10
19:30 three result let's study top three see
19:32 what they done to your appage then you
19:34 can reverse engineer to see what what
19:36 content how they answering it so you
19:39 have to study who they ranking that's a
19:41 big signal walk backward from that
19:44 vertical for that questions you can as
19:46 far as a tool I usually use Keyword
19:48 Planner I have access to a lot of
19:50 Keyword Planner sometime I see a rush
19:51 but the best data is probably Google
19:53 tool the Keyword
19:55 Planner yeah but as we get away from
19:57 keywords that's probably going to be
19:58 less interesting because now we're
20:00 talking context and so it's not a
20:02 specific keyword I don't know that
20:04 there's tools out today to help with
20:06 this but how I work with my clients is
20:07 talk to your salespeople if you're in
20:09 marketing and you're doing you know SEO
20:11 work you're probably in the marketing
20:13 function talk to your salespeople this
20:15 is where're creating go to market teams
20:18 I sales and customer success and
20:21 marketing all come together and now I
20:23 it's it's always been important but even
20:26 now as we think about SEO the questions
20:28 that we have to address on our website
20:31 our customers are asking that our
20:33 prospects are asking these questions so
20:35 now they're going to be going to search
20:37 they're going to be going to perplexity
20:40 or chat GPT you're going to ask their
20:41 questions there hoping to come up with
20:43 answers those are the kinds of things
20:45 that we need to make sure on the site
20:47 can we measure it through one of these
20:50 these keyword tracking tools yet not to
20:52 my knowledge will we be able to yeah
20:55 probably at some point maybe don't know
20:57 what that looks like but today work with
20:58 your salespeople work with your C
21:00 customer success people and those
21:02 questions that come up over and over
21:04 again make sure those are on the
21:06 website absolutely christe do you want
21:08 to uh talk a little bit about this
21:10 particular uh experience that you um
21:13 cited so this can be really hard to
21:16 explain when we're just talking or in
21:17 tables and so I wanted to give a great
21:19 example again this comes from orbit
21:21 media what do you get with a browser
21:22 when you go and look for the ultimate
21:24 guacamole recipe you get a bunch of ads
21:26 you get a bunch of offers maybe it's a
21:28 coupon to your local grocery store you
21:30 get some tracking tags you get some
21:34 images a lot of words and you get to a
21:36 recipe at some point after all of that
21:39 you go to your your favorite you know
21:42 chat system of choice there's no ads
21:45 there's no popups there's no tracking no images
21:47 images
21:50 yet and you get a guac recipe and it's
21:51 very easy you're not having to go
21:53 through a million different things to
21:56 try and figure it out your app is just
21:57 going to expose that and you're not
22:00 having to go to anyone's website to get
22:02 to it with all of the stuff that that
22:03 entails including all the advertising
22:06 and tracking codes yeah and you know
22:08 lately I've been trying different things
22:10 if I have a question or I want to cite a
22:13 certain fact or detail and I go to
22:16 Google and I will get a lot of noise
22:17 right even when you click through to the
22:20 site it's like where is my answer where
22:22 is my answer where is my answer oh I got
22:24 to scroll scroll scroll scroll scroll I
22:26 got to find it I got to find it okay oh
22:28 here it is wait you know way after I go
22:30 through all that n that nonsense and
22:32 then if I put it in chat GPT it's like
22:35 oh okay thank you I get the answer so it
22:38 is a really good user experience but it
22:39 it does it does interfere with the
22:41 business model so you know one of the
22:43 things that we we realize is that you
22:46 know we're still trying to discover the
22:49 levers right across different types of
22:51 platforms and they're they're not well
22:54 known it's we we do understand SEO we
22:57 don't understand Geo as much however we
23:00 can say that the quality of the content
23:02 is always going to be relevant and we
23:04 don't want content that is strictly and
23:05 one of the things people are saying is
23:07 what's so great about generative AI oh
23:09 we're able to create all this great
23:11 marketing content right and we create
23:13 all this content for our website we
23:14 create all these articles and we create
23:17 all this that's spam that becomes spam
23:19 if you just use stuff that's coming out
23:22 of generative mechanisms if you're just
23:26 using the um uh gen uh gen for creation
23:28 of content without your voice
23:31 without your unique perspective without
23:34 your tone and your tenor it is going to
23:37 be detected as spam it'll be spam
23:39 content there's a lot of spam content
23:41 out there right now so and you can
23:43 identify it you can see it you you read
23:44 it and you're like oh boy this is this
23:47 is does not this sounds very machine
23:48 generated and you know some of the
23:52 machine generating some of the GPT z uh
23:53 tools are not that accurate so they
23:56 can't always detect it but I think Chris
23:58 Penn who I like to quote from time to
24:00 time put in uh the Declaration of
24:03 Independence or something into a GPT Z
24:06 and said this is all AI
24:08 generated so so again you can't tell
24:10 that but you have to but the tools are
24:12 getting to the point where you are where
24:15 they are identifying uh generated
24:18 content that will not help uh get your
24:20 your information into the uh into the
24:24 search uh the the AI powered search uh
24:26 answers of course back a little on that
24:28 and that I'm going to p back there's a
24:30 lot of false negatives and a lot of
24:32 false positives right we see this a lot
24:35 in education so I I I'm going to caution
24:37 a little bit on that one as to how the
24:40 accuracy of the tools they are trying to
24:42 determine but if it's well-written
24:43 content and you know how to use an
24:46 Oxford comma uh you English Majors out
24:48 there understand what I'm talking about
24:51 that can make it flagged as you know as
24:53 a a GPT generated kind of content so I
24:56 just I want to caution on that oh
24:58 yeah that's what I'm saying is that
25:00 they're not terribly accurate and when
25:02 you when he did put in the Declaration
25:03 of Independence it said it was AI
25:05 generated which obviously is a false
25:07 positive but but you're right you know
25:09 you know you have to be but I think
25:10 what's important is putting your brand
25:13 voice in making it aligned with your uh
25:16 style I when I try to have chat GPT
25:19 rewrite something for me I give it my
25:22 articles as a template I say use my tone
25:25 use my voice use my my terminology and
25:27 then write up this conversation that
25:29 we've had so it's it's I'm generating
25:31 the content I'm giving it the style and
25:33 then I'm taking the output from that
25:35 perspective but you know this is a fast
25:37 changing area we do have to stay on top
25:40 of uh all of this as it as it evolves
25:42 and moves any other comments or
25:45 questions or comments on on this topic
25:47 Let's see we have a question from what
25:49 I've been reading and hearing this from
25:51 Chris Crawford content should an Ask
25:53 answer basic questions in exin clear
25:55 manner this should help to be included
25:56 in the a response and hopefully
25:58 recommended on the right on the right
26:00 rail yes absolutely I think that's a
26:01 really good point it's a really good
26:04 observation so I I would agree with that
26:06 um let's see Ken also was asking about
26:08 whether or not we need to redesign our
26:10 website to be more favor favorable towards
26:12 towards
26:15 Geo so that semantic search will work
26:18 I'm I'm happy to to take some of that on
26:20 um in that we don't have to redesign our
26:23 website per se now all of the SEO
26:25 qualities are still important it still
26:28 helps drive all all kinds of different
26:29 things so you know keep the meta tags in
26:32 there and so forth what we do want to do
26:34 though is we may need to rewrite
26:37 sections of our site make it more human
26:40 human readable make it more concise like
26:42 we just spoke about so bite-sized chunks
26:44 but we also want to make sure that we're
26:47 adding this this additional content so
26:49 images and video content a lot of that's
26:51 going to get prioritized and we'll talk
26:52 more about that here in a couple of
26:55 minutes but as far as redesigning a site
26:57 I I wouldn't say you have to you know go
27:00 out and get a whole new website done
27:02 yeah yep so let's take another poll
27:05 where are you on your journey the Geo
27:09 not on the radar planning continuing
27:12 your SEO work doing something different
27:16 none of none of the above so planning
27:18 not on the radar for some folks looks
27:20 like a significant number some are just
27:25 continuing their work somewh planning um
27:26 look doesn't look like a lot of folks
27:28 are doing anything different yet
27:31 don't have any of those answers so looks
27:32 like we have about half of you
27:35 responding so far uh if you want to go
27:39 ahead and put your your uh vote in for
27:42 what you're doing so a lot of folks
27:43 aren't really thinking about this right
27:45 now you know they're not uh not
27:49 necessarily on the radar uh which is
27:51 interesting give you another minute or
27:54 so I wish we' thought to ask if people
27:56 were seeing uh declines in their their
27:58 search track oh yeah
28:00 yeah that's a good that would be a good
28:02 uh a good question
28:04 right yeah people aren't aren't planning
28:06 for it may their sites aren't affected
28:08 yet maybe they're not being impacted
28:10 yeah that could be it yep and we see one
28:12 person doing something different and
28:16 then none of the above okay let's uh
28:18 let's close the polling for now and uh
28:21 share the results so you get a sense of
28:23 where people are and a lot of folks are
28:25 not on the radar or planning and then uh
28:27 some folks are doing the other again I
28:29 think it it's early stages so you may
28:32 not see the impact yet I know we have
28:35 not seen a huge drop off yet but um you
28:37 know I have to also revamp and relook at
28:41 my content um great okay so let's uh
28:43 let's carry on here so abdell did you
28:45 want to talk about this
28:48 sline I think the foundation for SEO and
28:50 go is the same basically when I walk
28:53 with client I start investigating the SE
28:56 drop or any Z also is I have to check
28:59 for the page is the page index when last
29:02 time Google indexing somebody asked that
29:04 question what I need to prepare for GI
29:05 one of SC that I've noticed was all my
29:08 client he had a bias to a recency the
29:10 generative AI picked something recent so
29:13 update your key content the second thing
29:16 that I would said here also bookmark
29:17 create bookmark you start having long
29:20 content actually if you have bookmark
29:21 Google create site Link in your SEO
29:24 which it increase your CTR so I think
29:26 what you see on the left side it's
29:28 really the the your page
29:30 did you get update on Google index and
29:32 I'm amazed how many client go create
29:34 Pages they don't pay attention to the
29:36 error in the index so always double
29:39 check that the second and I mean the
29:41 third one metadata what I'm seeing with
29:44 B2B client Google for and then every
29:47 versical is different now with SEO but
29:50 also for paid ad I walk on B is you
29:52 should have one topic The Lending page
29:54 or SEO focus on the one topic because
29:56 the one topic go deeper answer the
29:58 question will give you more more
30:02 Authority AI look for freshness
30:04 Authority and you look for organized
30:06 information so organizing with book
30:09 market so I think that topic because now
30:11 Google changed everything to be dynamic
30:15 Patrick and I work with um deep learning
30:17 now all the quality score is done by
30:20 Vector search and the vector score you
30:23 if you have one topic so I said did a
30:26 good job and talk about content at the
30:28 end of the day it's Still Human talking
30:31 to human are you writing relevant
30:32 content for human somebody question it's
30:34 not the big answer it's a big question
30:37 and a big answer so what I done for L BB
30:39 clients I'm going to go back to what
30:42 Chris said to improve that we double the
30:45 traffic how we took all the to review we
30:46 took their data from CRM feedback from
30:49 the client and generate content around
30:52 it you be ma is not the head query is a
30:55 longterm what question the client asking
30:57 then that lead me to the last point
30:58 which is engagement
31:00 if you go back so if you write the right
31:02 content and the right experience the
31:04 engagement become more important and if
31:06 you can go next slide why the engagement
31:09 become more important so this is a on
31:11 the left side is one of the Google
31:13 ranking search algorithm he was
31:16 explaining me the weight if you look at
31:19 it is the weight for the engagement and
31:21 the clickstream of the user are now
31:24 jumping depend on versal to
31:27 60% so you don't want to just write
31:28 content but you want right content
31:31 engaging that have call for actions the
31:35 page is fast and it's linking because
31:37 now as I say earlier there is too much
31:39 content on the on the web Google is
31:41 having a problem actually so they look
31:43 at which page get engaged which one
31:45 answer the question so it's higher
31:47 weight and you can see on the right side
31:49 this is an e-commerce company before I
31:50 scroll down they already have four
31:53 button you can see they have did you fit
31:55 look at the bottom of the shirt they
31:57 have already added they adding more more
31:59 engage Eng agement is different
32:00 engagement and then the more engagement
32:02 you have the more click the more you
32:03 increase your
32:07 ranking said and so Patrick do you want
32:08 to add anything to clickstream Patrick
32:10 you work on you not work on clickstream
32:12 yes but you covered it really well the
32:14 clickstream the flow of traffic that
32:18 comes back from the site to inform what
32:20 did the user do in response to the
32:23 results that they got uh that's critical
32:25 information that will continue to be
32:26 critical information and continue to
32:34 forward next slide I think it's very
32:36 important and and you know to get that
32:39 feedback and to understand those signals
32:40 because they're always throwing off
32:41 signals depending upon what they're
32:43 clicking on and what they're doing and
32:45 that actually changes a a metadata model
32:48 about the user in a real-time basis and
32:50 you can take those signals and use those
32:53 signals to further uh refine and
32:55 personalize and recommend what you are
32:58 presenting to the customer or the the
33:00 prospect of what said mentioned earlier
33:03 the 250 if you look at it by the way I
33:06 put July because Google like I said
33:09 earlier is become more Dynamic and in
33:11 October is there a lot of volatility
33:13 somebody asked that question we seen the
33:16 drop yes it's become M Dynamic and at
33:18 the end between the clickstream and the
33:21 vector search things going to be uh even
33:22 Google team cannot tell you what for
33:24 your vertical what's the number factor
33:26 that's why I said study your client
33:28 study who is the ranking High than you
33:30 see what they're doing so this is a
33:31 brief summary but just don't hold me
33:33 accountable because it's always evolving
33:37 every day but you can as you can see the
33:39 the first two is infrastructure and site
33:41 is really the registration the basic
33:43 Foundation but the most important level
33:45 is a content is it engaging content are
33:47 you answering question that your
33:49 customer is asking it go back to what
33:51 kis said talk to your customer talk to
33:54 yourself people write thing that a human
33:55 are looking for Google will reward you
33:58 if you answer your customer questions
34:01 and then the left side is more Authority
34:04 I recommend to the client ironically
34:06 take your content create link on social
34:09 media create lot of Link because then
34:11 that will that's another form of Click
34:15 Stam will have access to that so again
34:17 just this quick example that I work with
34:19 client more apply button add the menu
34:22 link the confirmation expose for the eom
34:24 expose the facet you can have survey at
34:25 the end of the article was it relevant
34:27 article for you I have client that do
34:29 that Anna link case study anytime you
34:31 have engagement button every time you
34:34 scroll down try to give them some option
34:36 to give you a feedback so uh Chris did
34:39 you want to uh take this and discuss
34:41 some of these recommendations for
34:43 optimizing content
34:45 structure yeah so most of this we've
34:47 already we've already talked about a lot
34:50 of this is still basic SEO right having
34:52 structured formats you know having your
34:55 your H1 tags concise paragraphs making
34:58 sure it's easily extractable right so
35:01 not long PHD paragraphs writing for for
35:03 simple sentences simple simple
35:06 extraction that conversational tone
35:08 right so it's a it's a dialogue I
35:10 suspect FAQs are back in our futures
35:13 again they were mostly eradicated but uh
35:15 yeah they're they're back the schema
35:17 markup right we talk a lot as an
35:19 organization about the schema standards
35:22 that's still important that helps the AI
35:24 pull out the content extract the content
35:27 and I cannot emphasize this enough we
35:29 have got to start to be more diverse in
35:31 the kinds of content that we offer so
35:34 with video most of us from an SEO
35:35 perspective we thought we did video so
35:37 that we had the transcript and it was
35:39 keyword dense but now that video is
35:42 actually going to be pulled out and and
35:45 and used in these AI generated blurbs
35:47 that come in in search so have not just
35:48 the text but make sure you're having
35:51 images having video making sure you're
35:53 you're creating context around that so
35:55 if you got an H1 tag and then your your
35:58 video having those Contex actually
36:00 keyword Rich so it's not the same word
36:01 over and over but that you're really
36:03 speaking in human terms that is all
36:05 going to come but we're definitely not
36:08 saying not to do the SEO tactics those
36:10 are still really helpful in forming
36:13 these these AI thoughts to to come and
36:15 and grab the content that's appropriate
36:16 for the
36:19 search yeah yeah it it it it still is
36:21 about a Content that is Meaningful and
36:24 that is useful uh Gabrielle had asked is
36:27 there a way to know which questions lead
36:30 to our website and um what do you guys
36:31 think about that I mean that's that's
36:33 kind of you know we we we say here's a
36:35 keyword but you know when we start to
36:38 get to questions we don't have the
36:40 necessarily have that the tools that
36:42 identify exactly what those are but I
36:43 think we'll start seeing that and
36:45 deriving that what are what are your
36:47 thoughts about that Chris you had said
36:48 you know talk to your salespeople what
36:50 questions are they asking but do we know
36:53 how questions are leading to our website
36:55 I would say at least within our Google
36:57 analytics and and other analytics tools
37:00 we can see at least if any of these chat
37:01 systems are driving traffic to the site
37:03 but I don't think we have anything that
37:05 says which question drove it but we
37:07 should start to see a lot more traffic
37:09 maybe not a lot more traffic but we
37:10 should start to see traffic being
37:11 generated from these these various
37:14 systems at least so I'm gonna get a
37:16 little bit in trouble with Google
37:18 actually I pick the main keyword and
37:20 then I crawl actually I have a team of
37:22 crawler and then you know they create a
37:24 section called people sync for the
37:26 questions people also ask they literally
37:29 just add the section so I call that I
37:31 see who responded so I think too you're
37:33 right Google did not put the question
37:34 volume usually the question volume they
37:36 hide the number is not that high it's
37:38 still doing the topic they haven't made
37:40 a switch itself gole but there is way of
37:42 reverse engineering I have another
37:43 question here what are your opinions on
37:47 the impact of core web vitals like LCP
37:50 inp CLS in making content more
37:53 digestible for geo purposes look the c i
37:55 important but here is what I get I have
37:58 a client that OV 100% he like nothing
38:00 move I'm like there is 200 Factor you
38:02 just move one level so I think like I
38:04 said if you look at the previous slide
38:06 you want to work on an index you want to
38:08 work on your cor valal you want to work
38:10 on a metad data and engaging content so
38:13 I think it's still important like uh
38:15 chis said you still got to do the basic
38:17 but I don't think it's just one lever
38:20 you can suddenly see a jump so how about
38:21 visual content what do we need to do
38:24 about visual content certainly
38:26 transcription right that's important if
38:27 we have a video we can do the
38:29 transcription and make that a readily
38:31 available accessibility tags for images
38:33 so making sure we use all text and
38:36 descriptions that help uh an AI
38:38 understand what the image is and then
38:40 adapting visual content from mobile
38:42 devices is really very important do you
38:44 want to say more about those U those
38:47 pieces Patrick Chris uh abdell who would
38:49 like to chime in on some of
38:52 this I can go for Home Depot I work for
38:55 Home Depot ironically YouTube was a
38:58 second SEO traffic for us why people
39:00 type how to how to build a deck how to
39:03 so we build massive YouTube video but
39:04 then we went to Tik Tok we went to
39:07 Instagram this is why Google Now is
39:09 trying to get generative AI actually
39:10 they're try to align them if you type
39:13 the how to 90% now it trigger the
39:15 generative AI so actually video and text
39:18 are conversion suddenly yeah so tactics
39:20 aren't changing for the most part it's
39:22 it's the kind of content we generate and
39:25 the um the ability to not have to
39:26 keyword stuff anymore and so we're just
39:28 creating better content it's not that
39:30 content is no longer King content
39:34 remains King right that is a a a
39:38 foundation of of providing a a good
39:40 experience to to the people trying to
39:41 find us to that are trying to find
39:44 answers it's helpful from an AI
39:46 perspective so if we focus on our
39:49 customers I I think we're still doing
39:51 good like most of us have as as abdell
39:53 was talking about most of us have
39:55 adopted video because it's good for our
39:57 customers it images are good for the
39:59 customers we can talk all day long but
40:01 that can be hard to understand so the
40:03 more that we are focused on the the kind
40:05 of content that the people who are
40:08 looking for us need I think we're in
40:11 good shape uh Chris to that point um we
40:13 have spent a long time in the industry
40:15 building websites for computers to
40:18 consume now we are trying to make this
40:20 ship to build websites for humans to
40:23 consume and the computers are going
40:25 to the computers come along the
40:28 computers are speaking more like us than
40:29 than we ever I think could have imagined
40:32 how I mean how quickly this all came on
40:33 us that all of a sudden the the
40:35 computers now speak in a way that we
40:37 speak that we can interact with it in a
40:40 way that feels very human and we'll
40:41 start to get into more existential
40:44 questions of what does that mean but for
40:46 us in this topic that's all good news
40:47 for us to to be able to get back to
40:50 speaking in a way that that we want to
40:51 be able to talk that people want to be
40:54 able to to understand yeah it's it's
40:56 pretty cool yeah it's interesting when
40:58 you when you start looking at you know
41:00 obviously the the infographic
41:02 infographics are very appealing because
41:05 they take textual content and create
41:07 some kind of visual representation
41:09 sometimes that visual representation is
41:11 not that meaningful right sometimes it's
41:13 just the layout and the format and but
41:16 for whatever reason it's it's ey candy
41:18 and it's uh catnip to you know people
41:20 who are so interested in these topics
41:22 but we do need to make sure that that
41:25 text that's contained in the infographic
41:28 is readable to uh the machines so that
41:31 that will uh surface so again it's
41:33 providing the the additional contextual
41:37 clues for the geni if we think in terms
41:38 of accessibility I think that's really
41:40 helpful because we were already doing
41:42 this as much for accessibility as it was
41:44 for the search engines and so
41:46 accessibility and and AI I think there's
41:48 a lot of crossover here that if we're
41:50 doing it so that someone who um maybe
41:53 can't read um that that are are visually
41:56 um compromised that that ends up being
41:59 very very more y yep absolutely so when
42:01 you think about getting started I mean
42:03 part of this is saying how do we
42:06 structure our content right and it's
42:09 much more about being concise it's much
42:11 more about answering specific questions
42:13 and you can start to think about well
42:15 what questions do people have you know
42:17 what are new new customers asking what
42:20 are we trying to convey and then reverse
42:22 engineer that into questions and then
42:24 chunk the content so that it answers
42:27 those very specific questions we talked
42:29 about data in terms of structuring the
42:31 content with data but also including
42:34 data including statistics including
42:36 citations uh I just did a a research
42:39 project on AI adoption I still have to
42:40 write it up for those of you who have
42:42 been patiently waiting for that maybe
42:44 chryst will help me get that out the
42:47 door uh but but the point here is that
42:50 it's it's data that is representative of
42:52 what people are experiencing and any
42:56 kind of data that cites research or CES
42:59 statistically valid information is also
43:01 important right because those citations
43:03 are going to increase the visibility so
43:05 if you find that you've surveyed your
43:07 customers and 30% of your customers
43:09 think that you've classified them
43:10 incorrectly I don't know I was trying to
43:12 make a joke but nothing came to
43:15 mind there's two types of of taxonomist
43:17 in the world those who lump and those
43:20 who split that's all I know about um
43:23 taxonomy statistics anyway l lumpers or
43:26 Splitters I'm I'm a lumper anyway um so
43:28 so incorporating data that's uh that's
43:30 important that might be a good statistic
43:32 integrating the multimedia again we
43:34 talked about this with regard to uh the
43:37 content visibility making sure that we
43:39 can uh have direct quotes and clear
43:42 citations that make that content
43:44 referenceable right it's more likely to
43:46 be referenced Chris did you want to add
43:50 uh to this um list no I do want oh yes
43:52 so I want to double click on that that
43:54 credible data and and the cross linking
43:57 Abell touched on it some um but having
43:59 this relative the statistics
44:02 authoritative facts right citing that
44:03 citations are going to be really really
44:06 helpful and and um they always have been
44:08 right the the concept of backlinks but I
44:11 think um I we can project forward that
44:13 this is going to be more important even
44:15 with with generative a the other again
44:16 when we were talking about this and
44:17 Chris want to let you kind of walk
44:20 through the rest of these content over
44:22 keywords so it's really looking at what
44:25 is what is it that the that people want
44:27 to answer and not just with keywords do
44:29 you want to pick up on that and go
44:32 through the rest piece um absolutely
44:35 yeah so Seth just really said it and and
44:36 you're probably beating a dead horse
44:38 here but think about those longtail
44:40 queries right those are the ones the
44:41 people that are really looking for our
44:43 content the people that were really
44:45 truly helping speaking to them in a
44:47 natural language and in bite-sized
44:49 chunks so if you're an English major
44:51 like I am uh worst multiple English
44:52 degrees you know don't don't write for
44:55 the PHD dissertation we really want to
44:58 hone that into to um question answer
45:00 kinds of topics some of the best places
45:02 to go is if you're at a company that's
45:04 far enough along you've got customer
45:05 success what are the questions that get
45:08 asked all the time that is a really
45:10 excellent way to know what content to be
45:12 producing and really how to talk about
45:13 it think think with your CS your
45:15 customer success hat because someone has
45:17 a question and it gets answered right
45:19 that's that's going to be something and
45:20 and the more of those that they're
45:22 seeing the more likely it is is it's a
45:25 good topic for your website um building
45:28 authority right that that ability being
45:30 citable right so the AI models are
45:33 looking for for cross-pollination so if
45:35 you're linking to um other authority
45:37 figures maybe you've got some industry
45:41 associations or customers and partners
45:43 anything like that where you can cross
45:45 link that's going to be really helpful
45:47 SEO specific tools to test and optimize
45:49 I don't know that those exist yet but
45:51 they can't be far behind so so kind of
45:54 watch for those I do go through I I use
45:57 a tool called Hub chat that allows me to
46:00 query multiple uh uh multiple
46:03 applications to see how how things are
46:07 appearing it's pretty manual today but
46:09 it is a way where I can go in and I can
46:11 ask and enquiry multiple engines think
46:13 about your industry right all of this
46:15 changes by industry so some Industries
46:17 care about certain things over others so
46:19 be very industry specific if you're you
46:20 know at a museum you're probably going
46:22 to be a little more creative than you
46:24 know where I usually focus is deeply
46:26 Technical and so it's going to be more
46:27 technical data we're going after
46:29 different audiences and and different
46:32 languages so you know again you know
46:36 content and context and ultimately
46:37 nothing really changes it's about our
46:39 users it's about our prospects it's
46:42 about our customers and providing them
46:44 what they need the more we do that the
46:47 better SEO is the better Geo is and the
46:49 better conversions we have on our
46:51 website great and uh we have a couple of
46:53 questions here Karen Schneider asked if
46:56 we optimize commercial websites towards
46:58 efficiency for the AI to pick up on do
47:00 we bias our responses towards commercial
47:03 content as opposed to academics
47:04 governance content and peerreview
47:07 content which may have a more neutral
47:10 factual point of view I would say that
47:12 you need to balance it because I think
47:14 the neutral or factual point of view
47:15 that can be referenced is going to be
47:17 very valuable right and it's going to
47:20 increase the um uh the likelihood that
47:22 it'll be picked up um do you guys want
47:24 to add add to
47:27 that I was just talking to Patrick for
47:29 this webinar I had a a client who was
47:30 hospital they panicking they're like oh
47:33 my God a visitor went down was it not we
47:34 went look at a conversion the conversion
47:36 didn't go down I said look anytime you
47:39 search for symptom disease Patrick and I
47:41 would even running search you will
47:43 Google want to keep the head quing
47:45 informational navigation generative AI
47:47 going to keep it Google wanted people to
47:48 spend more time there because you give
47:50 them more signal you have to focus on
47:52 what Google cannot do I said look then
47:54 doctor they don't have doctor for cancer
47:57 look at the long tail where you chis
47:58 mentioned earlier commercial and high
48:02 intent so I think just be flexible spend
48:04 I will personally spend more time on the
48:07 intent commercial but to your point you
48:08 want to have a little bit Authority so
48:10 it's a delicate balance and be aware
48:13 that Google one people that what I call
48:16 the longtail questions navigation the AI
48:19 I see by vertical vertical Google is
48:21 grabbing yeah and unfortunately I don't
48:23 think there's any way to measure how
48:25 often you appear in these kinds of AI
48:27 generated results
48:30 so your your authoritative content may
48:33 be exposed but it may not generate the
48:36 click anymore the commercial stuff is we
48:38 have to be really careful or or really
48:40 considerate really intentional that
48:42 we're getting the traffic to the site
48:43 that traffic's going down so we have to
48:45 make sure that we understand our
48:47 customer Journeys and that we understand
48:48 the path that we think people will
48:52 follow to raise their hands and and have
48:54 us reach out reach back out to them or
48:57 make it easy for that sale I I think
48:58 ad's right I think generally speaking
49:00 our conversions probably aren't going to
49:03 go down but our traffic will our bounce
49:05 rates are going to go down right because
49:06 we're not just getting all these people
49:08 trying to click looking for that
49:10 guacamole recipe trying to figure out
49:12 what it is and then getting to a safe
49:14 way add trying to sell them something
49:17 else like all of that's going to go away
49:19 we have to be prepared for that traffic
49:21 to go down but but make sure that
49:23 traffic that you get is really optimized
49:26 for your customer Journey it's very hard
49:29 to find wle rep recipes on our site I
49:31 have to admit that and that's what you
49:33 missed opportunity here
49:36 dude let's see we have another comment
49:38 here we know 15% of the searches on
49:39 Google are new at any given point with
49:41 the Advent of Geo are we seeing an
49:43 increase in the trend for new searches
49:47 and longer ter uh uh tail
49:49 queries I think this goes back to the
49:51 brand discussion brands that are not
49:54 known are not going to get those new
49:57 searches right so if if we're a new
49:59 company that brand awareness is going to
50:01 be really important so we have to
50:03 diversify how we're marketing if
50:06 companies are are really focused on SEO
50:09 as their only path to to uh any kind of
50:11 marketing to any kind of lead generation
50:14 I I think that is in danger and we
50:16 really have to diversify that so brand
50:18 you know a lot of a lot of early
50:19 companies they don't want to do a lot of
50:20 brand because they need leads
50:22 immediately but I I think in this new
50:23 world brand is going to have to be
50:25 important otherwise they're going to be
50:27 invisible in search let's see there's
50:29 another question here how do you think
50:31 this generative AI is going to help in
50:34 compatibility example Auto Parts
50:35 specific size is going to fit across
50:38 multiple products currently we have to
50:40 list all of those will gen have a
50:43 different way look this is where Patrick
50:44 can elaborate we' seen that in the
50:47 search world if you don't have the right
50:49 taxonomy once you get to the auto part
50:51 you have to be precise I think the
50:53 generator is a long way because they
50:56 don't have that specific taxonomy this
50:59 is where accuracy does matter for the
51:00 buyer accuracy matter you're not going
51:02 to buy a power for your car that doesn't
51:05 match so I generative not generative AI
51:07 I would say focus on your taxonomy and
51:08 have the
51:10 Precision Patrick do you want anything
51:13 we've seen that before where which CH oh
51:16 yeah um part number search is
51:18 classically uh difficult for a
51:21 generative kind of search environment
51:23 for a rag kind of search environment for
51:26 Vector search it does that very poorly
51:30 because it doesn't have the training on
51:33 specific part numbers it it can tell you
51:35 the difference between a a hose and a
51:37 hose clamp but it if you put in the
51:39 actual part number for that it's not
51:41 going to know um and that's where
51:45 marrying the vector-based generative
51:48 capabilities with the still those
51:52 catalog specific terminology focused
51:55 keyword search capabilities is still
51:58 really important in um in today's market
52:00 and I don't think that's going to change
52:02 anytime soon I think it's important to
52:05 remind folks too that generative AI is a
52:07 great prediction tool so it's like on
52:09 our phones when you start to type out
52:10 and it predicts what the next word might
52:12 be and you hit Tab and go yes it is that
52:15 on steroids so when we talk about AI
52:17 knowing stuff it's it's knowing what
52:20 they're doing is they're predicting
52:22 words and they do it really incredibly
52:25 well so that's I I think kind of gets to
52:27 your point Patrick on and it doesn't
52:29 know about all of these these you know
52:31 part numbers that's not really an easy
52:33 language model so it doesn't see that
52:36 enough to know in quote yeah no that's a
52:38 really good point and then the question
52:40 becomes how does that content become
52:43 visible you know um in the old days of
52:45 faceted search we had to map out all of
52:48 the facet patterns and build a site map
52:50 because the content wasn't visible
52:52 unless somebody was clicking through and
52:55 and selecting those facets um maybe
52:56 there's something analogous that's going
52:59 to go on with uh with Geo I I I do not
53:01 know but it's a it's a really valid
53:03 point here's another question for
53:05 countries where AI overviews have not
53:08 been rolled out yet Canada is there a
53:10 way that we can see if or how our
53:11 content is appearing in AI overviews in
53:13 the US or places where it's already
53:14 rolled out do you guys have an answer
53:17 for that I use VPN I have develop all
53:19 over the world a client I say just use a
53:22 VPN I start a VI machine go to the US
53:24 see the same search that's a simple
53:27 answer that I did for S CL
53:29 great great same I would say the same
53:32 thing use a VPN you can you can get that
53:34 Endo to look like it's anywhere in the
53:36 world and then you'll get answers that
53:40 are localized to that area yeah so
53:42 there's lots and lots of challenges I
53:43 mean you know obviously we're going to
53:45 be losing traffic it's going to be
53:50 harder to uh make or organic traffic to
53:51 obtain organic traffic it's hard to
53:54 predict which content the AI is going to
53:56 choose so we have an unpredictability
53:58 content needs to be authoritative it
54:00 needs to be concise it needs to be
54:02 conversational so that means that we
54:04 have additional complexity to our
54:06 content operations and of course we want
54:10 multi mul that multi modal content
54:13 multimedia content images videos
54:15 infographics that's going to add to
54:17 production uh costs and production time
54:20 and we don't have as many tools to uh
54:22 measure and optimize Geo success so and
54:24 these algorithms are changing all the
54:25 time we know that these models are
54:27 changing they require are constant uh
54:29 updates and there's going to be less
54:32 brand control your content may be used
54:34 without driving users to your site right
54:36 that's what a lot of the that's what the
54:38 New York Times and Wall Street Journal
54:39 and a lot of these major Publications
54:41 are saying is you're you're using our
54:43 content but you're not paying for it
54:45 we're not getting traffic from it and of
54:47 course creating MIT Rich uh media which
54:49 is what we talked about before is going
54:51 to be uh resource intensive so if there
54:54 are no other questions we can actually
54:56 give you two minutes back to your day
54:58 any final comments from our panelists
55:01 before we uh we finish up
55:05 here remember your customer customers
55:07 first got it it's a Brave New World
55:11 Don't Be Afraid just uh dig in and uh if
55:14 you if you need help we're happy to help
55:17 absolutely and then engaging customer
55:19 content and then also closing the loop
55:21 the tracking we didn't talk about TR can
55:23 make sure your UTM are working because
55:26 go in that feedback absolutely so you
55:27 have our contact information we'll get
55:31 you the slides feel free to uh reach out
55:33 as Patrick has said and uh we will see
55:36 you uh next time we have another session
55:39 in two weeks I should probably put that
55:40 schedule up but we are right at the top
55:43 of the hour so great timing thank you to
55:45 our panelists I really appreciate the
55:46 insights thanks to everybody who
55:48 listened in and Carolyn thank you for
55:50 your uh Operational Support in the back
55:52 end making all of this possible and
55:55 thank you to our sponsors uh cmswire and
55:58 vktr they will be an article every uh
56:00 after every session we we do have one
56:04 published today from vktr uh Vector is
56:06 uh uh how it's pronounced and then
56:08 there'll be one coming up in another
56:10 week and then there'll be one companion
56:13 article to each uh of these session so
56:14 keep your eyes open for those thanks
56:16 everyone we'll talk to you next time
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