0:00 that's the first thing they told me in
0:01 Moscow you never do that's a giveaway
0:03 they cannot lose sight of you okay
0:05 somebody needs to see you at all times
0:08 because the moment you're clear you
0:10 could be doing something and they're not
0:11 aware of it now one caveat for today the
0:15 CIA know how to make faces faces that
0:18 look like real people now what you focus
0:21 on now is two
0:24 things let's get into to some of your
0:27 operational training on tradecraft so um
0:30 can you explain I I guess a good good
0:32 one to start with is um surveillance
0:34 detection routes or
0:35 sdrs yeah there was a actually in Berlin
0:40 surveillance detection was was
0:43 horrendous I
0:46 got the the person that I worked with by
0:49 the name of Nikolai he didn't have good
0:52 training you know he he gave me some
0:54 ideas you know you got to walk around in
0:56 the city and you can't turn around like
0:59 this but you could walk towards a
1:02 display window of an department store so
1:04 you can see who is following you that's
1:06 the first thing they told me in Moscow
1:08 you never do because that's a that's a
1:11 giveaway So you you're supposed to when
1:14 you do surveillance detection you're
1:16 supposed to do something that uh you
1:22 wander around in in a city take public
1:24 transportation go in and out of
1:25 buildings and
1:27 walk there cannot be any motion any any
1:32 action that could be considered proof
1:35 that you're an agent so it has to be
1:38 normal even though it's not normal to
1:40 wander around in the city for like 3
1:43 hours go from here to there to there to
1:45 there but it's not proof there there's
1:48 indirect proof that this guy is like
1:49 checking on on himself but it it can't
1:52 can't hold up in the in in the court of
1:54 law so you would not be arrested by
1:56 knowing or guessing that you on a
1:59 survance ATT
2:00 route okay so uh and the training the
2:05 was superb in Moscow I I I was my my
2:10 mentor my my coach was the guy who was
2:16 in charge of
2:18 that uh that
2:20 department in the first directorate
2:23 that's
2:25 Espionage and uh he showed me some you
2:28 know he showed me around and he said
2:29 what to do and what not to do and the
2:31 first thing he said you don't don't ever
2:33 do that walking towards the
2:34 window uh and he gave me some hints he
2:37 he also was a master in something I he
2:40 didn't teach me but he he took in
2:43 misdirection uh and that wasn't
2:45 surveillance d
2:48 uh Discovery uh uh he he told me just
2:53 follow me from a little distance like
2:55 like 30 ft and watch what I'm doing and
2:58 so he was walking around a little bit
3:00 and said nothing then he went we went
3:05 backwards there was an A A flower bed
3:10 elevated and he had put a cartridge he
3:12 stuck a cartridge into the soil
3:15 there I must have looked that way for
3:17 some reason he was a magician so but
3:21 that wasn't part of the training so uh
3:23 no also what what they what we try what
3:26 they tried to teach me is uh uh
3:29 surveillance protction by vehicle so
3:32 they I actually they I learned how to
3:34 drive in
3:35 Moscow but in heavy traffic and I'm
3:39 paying attention who might be following
3:40 you that's too dangerous we we we
3:42 stopped it so it was on foot public
3:45 transportation escalators elevators uh
3:49 uh my favorite places
3:52 uh were big
3:55 stores apartment stores where you can go
3:57 this way and that way and turn around
4:00 because you know it's it's halfhazard
4:01 you know and you don't have to buy
4:03 anything uh Museum of Natural History
4:07 very few people in there uh a lot of
4:10 hallways with not too many people but
4:11 you can also walk in and out this way
4:13 that way and uh my absolutely favorite
4:18 spot where where it never failed that I
4:21 would see somebody following me so I'm
4:25 going down so I had to know the city
4:28 really well I wouldn't I knew every
4:30 subway stop I mean I knew the city
4:31 better than most people who who were
4:33 born and raised there uh and that's that
4:36 wasn't the rule when I came to New York
4:38 same thing I I that the city was my
4:41 playground
4:43 so I'm walking
4:46 down a road that's downhill and it's
4:49 curving to the left and at the top at
4:52 the bottom of that uh that Hill there
4:55 was a phone
4:57 booth and if you wanted to make make a
4:59 phone call you have to walk in and turn
5:02 that way because the phone was pointing
5:04 in the other
5:05 direction and so the bottom line was uh
5:09 if you and and I had in those days I
5:12 had a an
5:15 incredible memory for
5:18 faces that was my advantage over the
5:20 team usually the team was uh 8 to 10
5:23 people following you with uh Elite
5:27 change because you know if if one guy
5:30 is they cannot lose sight of you okay
5:34 somebody needs to be needs to see you at
5:36 all times because the moment you you're
5:39 clear you could be doing something and
5:41 they're not aware of it you could even
5:43 just be a chalk Mark or something like
5:45 that so there was always like whether I
5:48 was in an elevator or or in a store or
5:53 in the
5:54 subway
5:57 uh there has had to be somebody close by
6:01 waiting for for a bus at a bus stop so
6:04 and I was always scan scanning the
6:06 people and uh if I saw the same P the
6:11 same face twice I knew that I was being
6:13 followed the the the tougher challenge
6:16 was to determine that you were not being
6:19 followed because you had to you couldn't
6:22 prove a negative right but over time I
6:25 had confidence in knowing that that I
6:28 would detect the uh the uh surveillance
6:32 and uh we there were about I forgot 6
6:36 seven eight uh exercises where I
6:39 was uh you know competing with a team
6:43 you know my my Handler my liazon would
6:46 would show up at the apartment any given
6:50 morning and said time to
6:52 check and let's say it was six at the
6:56 end uh when we were all done and I was
6:59 to declared to be fully prepared the
7:02 score was six to nothing in my favor and
7:06 the the guy who was my mentor there he
7:08 said I was one of the best students
7:11 which helped me later on to determine
7:14 whether I was being followed by the FBI
7:17 and or the
7:20 KGB because when they when
7:23 they and we W going to get to that when
7:26 they thought I was being followed I
7:29 determined that not to be true cuzz I
7:31 was very
7:33 very uh certain in my ability to to
7:36 detect uh um surveillance now one card
7:42 for
7:44 today the CIA and I don't know if other
7:48 intelligence agencies uh know how to
7:50 make
7:52 faces faes that look like real people uh
7:55 there's a uh there was a couple in the
7:58 CIA uh
8:00 the husband is not with us anymore but I
8:02 met the wife Jonah
8:04 Mendes and
8:06 she at then was at a conference she
8:09 showed pictures of herself as a black
8:13 male and that face can be put on uh in a
8:18 couple of minutes and it's
8:19 indistinguishable from a human face now
8:22 what you focus on
8:24 now is two things
8:28 gate at very difficult to change and
8:33 Footwear it's it's harder to you know
8:36 everything else you know what you wear
8:38 that you can change it real quick but
8:40 you know shoes but people forget about
8:42 that so so there's still the ability to
8:46 do this and then there's the other thing
8:47 there's uh surveillance cameras all over
8:50 the place uh and with the Advent of
8:55 AI you can actually scan all of that
8:59 material before you couldn't there's
9:01 tooo much but with AI if and if you have
9:03 access to the footage which may be a
9:06 problem too you know it's there stores
9:09 that have surveillance cameras you can't
9:11 force them to hand this over so there's
9:13 still a way to defeat surveillance but
9:16 it's not as good as it used to
9:20 be what's up guys thank you so much for
9:23 taking the time to watch the interview
9:24 if you got anything out of this video at
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9:44 don't miss any of them but that's it
9:47 thank you for your support I really
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9:50 soon
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